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Discussion starter · #21 ·
Alfasevin, I wouldn't feel so bad if I were you. That thread doesn't strip out that easily-- I bet it was already 90% gone by a PO when you turned your wrench. I've changed my Spider's oil don't know how many times, and that thread's pretty hefty in there.
Thanks mate. I am not beating myself anymore. I am pretty sure it was messed up before I came along.
 
Discussion starter · #23 ·
Sorry but that's life. Good luck with new one and check torque:sneaky:
No worries.....Life is good :)
So is the torque on the plug 30-40 ft lb? I've been reading some conflicting info.
Also I'm pretty sure I don't use any sealer on the lower pan gasket...correct?
 
The spec on the oil drain bolt is 51-58 lb-ft. It is on page 86 of your owner's manual. Use a fresh copper washer (or anneal the existing washer before reusing it). It sounds high but I've been using that spec for years with zero problems.

Lower pan gasket should go in dry: you want to use a gasket OR silicone, never both. Note proper torque on the bolts (it's in the service manual somewhere).
 
The spec on the oil drain bolt is 51-58 lb-ft. It is on page 86 of your owner's manual. Use a fresh copper washer (or anneal the existing washer before reusing it). It sounds high but I've been using that spec for years with zero problems.

Lower pan gasket should go in dry: you want to use a gasket OR silicone, never both. Note proper torque on the bolts (it's in the service manual somewhere).
I think that torque is too high. My manual says 30-40 ft-lb.:

1692604
 
Discussion starter · #26 ·
That's what I had seen too. Seems to be some disagreements on this in the threads I have looked at.
 
It's the same 51-58 spec in my '91 owner's manual and my '74 owner's manual. I believe that diagram in the service manual is in error. I've used 51 with no issues.

1692605
 
Why wouldn't you? Humans are terrible at achieving consistent, repeatable torque. My wife's a Mech E and they have a saying that "tight enough is too tight"...most people tend to overtorque fasteners by hand. With a proper wrench you know you get it right every time.

Apparently the previous guy didn't use a torque wrench because he managed to mostly strip that mo-fo!
 
Lower pan gasket should go in dry: you want to use a gasket OR silicone, never both. Note proper torque on the bolts (it's in the service manual somewhere).
Tom I hardly ever disagree with what you post but I can't understand this comment. You would always use an additional sealer with any gasket. What is important is to use the correct one.

As for the originale poster, if you have your old pan repaired a good mod is to move the drain plug and have it put at the rear of the pan, away from the road. More relevant to road cars that have been lowered but its just a suggestion.
 
Why wouldn't you? Humans are terrible at achieving consistent, repeatable torque. My wife's a Mech E and they have a saying that "tight enough is too tight"...most people tend to overtorque fasteners by hand. With a proper wrench you know you get it right every time.

Apparently the previous guy didn't use a torque wrench because he managed to mostly strip that mo-fo!
I guess it comes down to experience. Haven't stripped a thread for 30 years.

Torque wrench or not, if you can't feel a thread letting go you are in trouble
Pete
 
Tom I hardly ever disagree with what you post but I can't understand this comment. You would always use an additional sealer with any gasket. What is important is to use the correct one.
People think that because that's how they learned it years ago. The reality is that fiber gaskets are designed to seal without sealant, and they should go in dry unless specified otherwise in the procedure. Parts manufacturers have gotten clearer about this: the last water pump I bought for my GTV came with a fiber gasket and very clear instructions to install it dry. But despite it being right there on the instructions people will still tell you to put goop on the darned things.

(Exception in point, the valve cover gasket. Not held in position by bolts, so the Alfa procedure says to put gasket adhesive - on the cover side only - to hold it in place during assembly. But that's not to seal anything, just to hold it in place. I also think that's the one place I've seen in the Alfa service manual where it says to use something on a gasket).

If it makes you feel better to use some gasket dressing it probably won't hurt anything, but it's not necessary in most cases. RTV, however, is always the wrong stuff for fiber gaskets: it is meant to be used in place of a gasket, and using it as a gasket dressing is completely wrong.

Honestly they should make you take a test or something before you buy RTV, because I swear it's the most consistently misused product sold in the auto parts store.
 
I cannot believe anybody uses a torque wrench to do up an oil drain plug ... tight enough. If worried about it falling out, lock wire it like you have to on race cars

Pete
I guess it comes down to experience. Haven't stripped a thread for 30 years.

Torque wrench or not, if you can't feel a thread letting go you are in trouble
Pete
By the time you feel the thread letting go its far, far too late sir.
 
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Nah, you just stop and let the next guy worry about it. Apparently that's what Alfasevin's PO did! :LOL:
Buddy asked me to help him change the oil on a Tacoma back in the day. He had no mechanical aptitude, I said sure, bring it over. Upon arrival I find the sump bolt, literally, and i mean that, covered in RTV -- like a little mountain of RTV on the back of the pan. Uh-oh I tell him. Long story short I changed the oil by pumping the oil out from the dipstick tube, got 97% of it by volume. Told him to either get a new pan or sell the car. He sold the car!!!
 
Honestly they should make you take a test or something before you buy RTV, because I swear it's the most consistently misused product sold in the auto parts store.
(y)LOL There should be tests for many a things in life.

But seriously I don't care what a manual or a engineer writes on some document, in the real world if you're running a workshop you do everything you can to prevent stuff coming back. An old aluminium engine, i'll keep using my sealants because I have seen over many years why you should. Its the same as putting sealant on the outside of a seal. The primary reason is because they can leak on the outside, the secondary reason is to glue them in. Why wouldn't you do this? Its just good practice. Of course the caveat is to use the correct product and the correct amount. The amount of times I have seen qualified mechanics putting on silicon like its brick mortar is amazing., a little bit is good, more doesn't make it better.
But each to their own, all i can say is my repairs don't leak oil over many years. Your engine will never be the same but it wont leak oil :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
To strip a nord or V6 sump thread is a fair effort but I guess these engines are pretty old and have seen a few oil changes. Unless completely ham fisted I would imagine this is cumulative damage over the years.
Just an anecdote, the sump thread on the later Twin spark and JTS engines (156 ect) is literally a few mm deep and is easily stripped. The factory use what is called a dowty washer, they have no feel when you tighten them up. Add to that the sump casting around the sump plug is very thin and cracks. Yup repaired and replaced to many of them.
 
I came to appreciate all this, at the tender age of 17, when I stripped out a spark plug hole in the head of my Giulietta Sprint. My dear Dad was not amused, but he came to the rescue with a helicoil kit. It was after that experience when I began to comprehend the concept of strength of materials... :rolleyes:
 
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