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Discussion Starter #1
Two alfas caught at crossroads - A 1985 GTV 6 and a 1970 GTV
This thread is put in this forum to solicit your suggestions and comments as Alfa connaisseurs.
I believe that because of my age I have to start downsizing. Which brings me to the Alfas at the crossroads.
By that I mean I will sooner rather than later have to divest myself of one of my beloved Alfas.
I have been fortune enough to own two great Alfas. As you can imagine I am distraught over which Alfa to let go. So I am canvasing your opinions to help me with my choice between keeping the 1985 or the 1970.
As you can see, the 1985 GTV6 is truly in pristine condition. It is a rare European model with the much-desired light bumpers. It is almost a trailer queen, driven very sparingly, only in good weather. Everything is original (except the tires) and in excellent condition and a concourse winner. It has about 30,000 miles, most of which have been highway driven. Mechanically, I would not hesitate to drive the car on a weekend trip.
The 1970 also is all original. It would be best described as a survivor. Everything is there. I am the second owner having bought it in 1993 and pretty well stored since then. Many of the small mechanicals have been overhauled and the car is now roadworthy. The car is equipped with 6.5 inch MOMO Vega rims which are worth upwards of $1,000 and original Weber fuel system. Having said that the car cries out for a worthy restoration.
I realize that this car, because of its low production year, has become sought after by collectors, especially in light of recent prices thrown at restored examples. For me, the drawback to this car is that it is almost impossible to find in my neck of the woods a trustworthy restorer who would undertake this project for a reasonable price and in a reasonable time frame. It would be impossible for myself to take on such a project. Also, I have to consider that my mechanical skills are very limited to non-existent.
I have two grown sons, neither of whom has displayed any strong interest in the 1970 GTV.
I would appreciate your comments and suggestions from this knowledgeable group to help me reach this decision.
I have included some pictures to assist you in the evaluation process.
Thank you, James
 

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Easy.

Based on the assumption you have a daily driver as well; completely ignore one car for a month and only use the other for the fun runs. Then repeat the process the next month with the other car ... decision is made by which one you missed the most during it's ignore month.

Or the decision is made by your sons, which means it has already been made, as it reads like they have a connection with the GTV6 ... but as there are 2 of them I can see an emotional battle in the future, or a GTV6 cut in half!
Pete
 

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Hello James,

I don’t want the same problem in the future and I have given it much thought. I have decided not to be the caretaker of my Alfas for the next person, I am going to be the driver who keeps them in good maintained condition and enjoy them. I have been the caretaker of too many cars that I should have enjoyed driving and never did, never again.

I am actually driving my very low mileage S4 Spider as much as I can, it is my daily driver if there is no rain or snow. I don’t commute and don’t need to drive everyday. My wife has a newer car, it’s more of the family car so that solves a lot of problems.

I also have a 2016 4c, currently I drive that sparingly, it is hard to drive two cars at once. I guess once I wear out the spider, I’ll work on wearing out the 4c.

I hope this helps,

Kevin
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thanks for your valuable advice.
I was seeking perhaps sort of more professional or scientific guidance.
I was hoping to get comments on which car will be more valuable in the future, which will be the easier to maintain and repair etc. For instance, I have recently noticed that spare parts for the 1985 are scarcer and more expensive than the 1970. Does this mean that the GTV6 will be almost impossible to drive ten years from now, given that the GTV6 is a much smaller market than the 105 series. The 105 series seem to have a plentiful supply of parts and a wide variety or reproduction parts.
I look forward to your suggestions, James
 

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I would wager the nicest GTV6 is of equal value to a pretty nice 105 the way the market has been showing. Interest and nostalgia from enthusiasts isn’t as high with the GTV6 certainty...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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I would wager the nicest GTV6 is of equal value to a pretty nice 105 the way the market has been showing. Interest and nostalgia from enthusiasts isn’t as high with the GTV6 certainty...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Nah ... GTV6's are awesome and all, but 105's created Alfas modern history. Like the 8c2300s created their old.
Pete
 

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As someone who owns both and likes them equally, I would sell the GTV. If you change your mind in the future, it is relatively easy to find a nice, restored GTV nowadays. On the other hand, nice GTV6's are much rarer, and restoration costs are much higher and the process more difficult than for GTV's.

For reference, since BAT started keeping track of sales in 2014, there have been 150 GTVs offered for sale on Bring A Trailer. These ranged from projects to trailer queens.

https://bringatrailer.com/alfa-romeo/gtv/

In contrast, there have only been 13 GTV6's for sale in the same time period, and only one of them was a low mileage, unrestored car.

https://bringatrailer.com/alfa-romeo/gtv6/
 

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With due respect to what your children prefer, I don't think you have said which car you like to drive. If you know that already, decision made?

That's a gorgeous v6, sell it (to me) and fund your GTV restoration. Yes you might have to send the GTV away to a good shop and be without an Alfa for a long time if you go the sell and restore route, and a true restoration of the GTV to the condition of the v6 will be expensive. Does the GTV have body corrosion? How involved do you want to be in restoring a car? I think your first questions to answer might be what condition of a car do you want to have and do you want to undertake a restoration or extensive refurbishment...would you be happy with continuing to drive the GTV as-is, as a solid driver?

Driving dynamics, 1960's versus '70's styling, classic 4 cylinder versus amazing v6, original v6 versus restored GTV. I prefer the v6 but those are personal decisions. I would rather praise the virtues of each and the Alfa character that both have.

From a money point of view, perhaps this is even between the two since this particular v6, late-year, low mileage, original condition and European lineage, makes it a unicorn in the USA and given enough time, you will realize a very strong price, PM me if you want more perspective there. Some opinions may differ, :). The market for good driver GTVs is of course well documented; the market for 116 cars will probably appreciate over time for really nice examples like this.

Starting at equal condition, the v6 maintenance is more costly but not ridiculous. It is a more complicated car and the plastic interior stuff is delicate if not treated well and overexposed to UV. Yes, v6 body and interior parts are harder to find but not impossible and I don't see that changing to the point where the car is not drivable. GTV parts it seems are more available especially in reproduction but you might find stuff for a specific 1970 car not so available at least at less than premium prices.

Hard decision for sure but better to have two and decide which to keep!
 

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@Zinhead Agreed that really nice GTV6s of any mileage that are fully sorted come up for sale infrequently, and original low-mileage ones in pristine running condition almost never. With stock euro bumpers in the US? Late GTV6 interior (seats), '85 transaxle gearing and minor running changes make it modestly more attractive.
 

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Thanks for your valuable advice.
I was seeking perhaps sort of more professional or scientific guidance.
I was hoping to get comments on which car will be more valuable in the future, which will be the easier to maintain and repair etc.
<snip>

Oh, you want advice based on data and market research? Hmmm... ;)

In my opinion, the 105 values have already jumped, the 116 hasn't. Therefore, the 116 has more upside. As for maintenance, the 105 is simpler and easier than the 116.

I'd ignore the kids, and pick the one I want to drive and enjoy.

bs
 

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At the moment, yes they may have more upside in the next few years but I believe they will never ever be equal. I have a ‘66 gtv and would never sell it to get a gtv6, I just love the looks of the 105 over the 116’s. As for the fun factor, My ‘66 is way fun, light, nimble and tossable. I don’t want to knock the 6 because I’m sure owners will say the same. If it’s strickly value, stay with your ‘70 gtv.
 

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Just to add, I have a 67 Duetto, Montreal, 67 Super and the 66 Gtv, and if I was only able to keep one it would be the gtv because of its fun factor. Good luck with your decision.
 

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Glad I don't have to make this decision. More complex than I thought.

Unless you are very old and close to hanging up your license, the decision should be all yours and not related to what your kids want IMO.
Pete
 

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If you are looking at future values 10 or 20 years down the road, the GTV has more potential as people who have never owned an Alfa are gravitated to it. Watch the following video of two guys who were not born when the car was made gushing over a GTV.


On the other hand, the only people who seem to buy GTV6's are those who have had some prior experience with them. Unless Alfa takes off and develops a cult status like Porsche, the market for GTV6's will be more limited as those who enjoyed them when new age out of the buyer pool.
 

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HA! it's a trick question- Do whatever you have to do to keep them both.
They are both special cars- you will hate yourself for selling either.

BTW- put an air filter on the 105 and fix the horrible, incorrect, front side indicators.
 

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I have a 1985 GTV6, albeit not low mileage like yours, but excellent condition nonetheless. Interior trim are hard to find, this is true. And glass and body panels in the event of a collision. (Though with any old car, if I crashed while driving it, I'd feel lucky to just survive and live to tell the tale...). Mechanically it really isn't so bad to maintain. It has electronic Bosch FI, but if that ever conks out you can replace it with something else. (Though if you just leave it alone, it's pretty reliable). And suspension work isn't so bad either, again provided you know what you're doing and don't mess around with it too much.

Really, I given the nature of cars, thinking about them in terms of money (read: investment) may not be the best strategy. I think it comes down to what car gets you excited just thinking about driving it. (I realize it's probably both...but one has to win out over the other). Both cars will likely appreciate somewhat in time, but which one will YOU appreciate more over time?
 
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