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Discussion Starter #1
When I bought my 86 GTV6 (Car of Many Colors) I noticed that the clutch pedal effort was way more than that of my Alfetta GT. It is even higher than the effort of my 164S, which is higher than my Alfetta. But the effort on the GTV6 is significantly more than the 164. It is unacceptably high. When I got the car, there was a small fluid leak at the clutch MC, so I replaced that; leak is gone, but effort did not change. Before I tore the rear end off the car, I went under the car and measured the travel of the end of the clutch fork. My GTV6 manual does not spec the clutch travel, but my Milano manual specs it at 0.5". My car was putting out a good 0.5" of travel. But my car has also consistently scratched the gears/synchros whenever I shift from neutral to first gear, or neutral to reverse. So I suspected some sort of wear problem in the clutch. After removing the entire rear end recently (this was coming off regardless of the clutch problem [need to replace rear rotors, rebuild rear calipers, do half shafts, replace axle seals in the diff, and replace the rear trans rubber mount, along with painting deDion, springs, and crossmember]).

Today I pulled the slave cylinder and clutch assy off the transaxle. Slave looked good (no leaks) and piston was free. Fork had minimal wear where it contacts the TO bearing and pivot bolt. Fork pivot bolt looked good. Clutch assy freely slid off the tranny shaft splines. The TO bearing spins freely and smoothly. There is minimal wear where the fork pulls on the TO bearing. So I can't see anything wrong.

The spring fingers on the pressure plate look really beefy to me, so I am trying to determine if this Sachs clutch is the standard OE clutch or equivalent. If this is some HP clutch upgrade, maybe that would account for the high pedal effort. Attached are pictures of all of the numbers I can see on the pressure plate (the yoke is still on the clutch input shaft, so the clutch is still assembled).

Sachs
GMZ 215
3032 100 199 (number cast in PP periphery)
3083 030 232 (number painted on PP spring fingers)
168 000 F&S 6 92 (number stamped into PP spring fingers)

1631478


1631479


1631480


So question to you Alfa transaxle experts: what clutch do I have here?
 

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1986 Alfa Romeo GTV6
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Isn't it original?
Mine is supper heavy and it does push your foot up hard and fast.
Double clutch
 

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Tom, I've driven a GTV 6 with both the original double plate clutch and now, the Milano single plate clutch. While it is still heavier than my Spider, the single plate is definitely lighter than the OEM clutch. That's the nature of the beast.
That being said though, I suggest you take these steps:
Use a good heavy lube, chassis grease or moly lube, and apply to the clutch fork where it sits on the ball stud pivot.
Then, re-seal your slave cylinder just so you know you are developing full force hydraulically.
Last, most important, install a new slave cylinder hose, preferably the stainless steel braided TFE hose. It will last for eons, it will not expand like the OEM hose, and being slightly smaller ID it will speed up the reaction of the clutch fork.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
From the 1992 dates on the pressure plate, obviously this is not the clutch that was put on the car at the Alfa factory in 1986. So I am trying to find out what this particular clutch is. A Google search of this Sachs part number turned up nothing useful.

Surely the people who race the 116/119 know all about the various clutches for the TA cars.
 

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The double disc clutch wasover kill. When it wears the fingers loose tension. This causes the clutch not to fully dis engage. The travel would not be an issue or different between gtv6 or milano. The single disc was at a time all the replace that could be had. It is a better option in my opinion as well. Driving and racing the gtv 6 and milano in scca i much more prefer the single disc. The double disc also requires a slightly different release compared to the single disc. Try not to over think the system. Clutch master cyl and slaves do wear out as well as the hose. Good luck
 

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Tom, thinking back to what my Dad always advised me, that is check the easiest and cheapest things first, and knowing that the original rubber hoses tend to delaminate on the ID over time, I suggest that's the next thing you do is change out the hose.

Remember this is one of the factors that puts extra strain on the spider clutch pivot pin, and contributes to the weld failure.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I am only asking one simple, concise question: Who knows what this Sachs GMZ 215 clutch is?
 

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1986 Alfa Romeo GTV6
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I think the 215 is the diameter of the pressure plate or of the disk. Not sure.
Can't find anything else of value.
Everything else shows up Al's Goldman Sachs lol. (Google search)
 

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You have a sachs single pate clutch originally designed for a Milano that has been retrofitted to your GTV6.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Thanks Sporty. But is this clutch equivalent to the clutch that Alfa put on the Milano at the factory? The pressure plate spring plate is made out of approx. 3.5 mm thick material. This seems pretty beefy to me compared to what I remember seeing in other non-GTV6/Milano clutches (but it has been many years since I last looked at any pressure plate). The GTV6 and Milano use the same clutch master and slave cylinders, so.......?

I plan on selling this GTV6 when I am finished restoring it (I already have an Alfetta GT that I have been driving for 45 years). No one will buy this car with a clutch pedal as crazy stiff as it is currently.
 

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1986 Alfa Romeo GTV6
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Now that we are on this subject, changing the double disc to a single disk. What are the major advantages? Does it wear out quicker than the dual? Cost wise is it cheaper?
 

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I assume you checked/replaced the slave hose? While I'd assume a plugged hose would cause problems both with actuating and deactuating the clutch, I've had weird crap happen before.
 

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I replaced my MC and slave last year and pedal tension is heavy.....good indication that the hydraulics are working well.
 

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Your Sachs pressure plate part # 3032 100 199 was/is the pressure plate for Alfa Romeo 75/Milano .
This single pressure plate is a direct replacement for the twin pressure plate that were fitted to GTV6's
Retro fitting single plate clutches is as simple as removeing the twin and installing the single plate unit,
Alfa Romeo moved to the single plate 75/Milano clutch because is less complicated and more reliable.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
With nothing on the car aft of the driveshaft, the clutch pedal is very loose; takes almost no pedal force to put the pedal on the floor. Air easily flows thru the clutch hose at 5 PSI.
Since this particular clutch is apparently not some racing clutch, I am going to have to think for a while. I have plenty of other parts to restore/replace.

I will probably do some work on the pivot pin and and go with a stiffer new hose (as Loco suggested) to try to give me a little more travel at the TO bearing.
 
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