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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #1
Hi y'all. Did a stepper resistor mod into a '93 L @ car-side harness for steppers still fully functional & quiet. But, if y'all please, I noticed something different for which I haven't found any info ~ the connector @ stepper assembly is white vs rust color (pic atch'd). Do any of y'all know if that may be significant? Regards, Ralph
20210322_113922.jpg
 

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Good luck on the upgrade, a wise mod. The double* socket attached to the stepper frame is usually rust color but white ones, probably on later cars, are known. Here's another white socket from my files just so you don't feel alone!

(* I say "double" because on some European models there were two sockets, one for the heat stepper and the other for the distribution stepper)

11807000w1.jpg
 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #3
Thx pinino.
I was kinda hopin' along th' same line. Also wonderin'' if "white" connector may indicate an assembly w/ th' later production steppers w/ their stronger gears. Anyway, since system was still functioning perfectly, figured this mod may avoid failure all together. Keepin' fingers crossed.🤞😉
Regards, Ralph
 

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I'm not aware that the gears of later stepper assemblies were stronger (I would doubt that a '93 L would be different than a '91 L). The later (face-lift) cars had reprogramming of the HVAC ecu, that is where the problem was. Not that it is all that easy to do, but not using the extremities on the dial

front air — front & floor — floor — floor & windshield — defrost

will make the gears last longer because then they are not pounding (1 pulse per second) on a stop. As for the heat stepper, not setting to the coldest setting in the summer, would lessen some of the pounding as well.

IMG_2633_c.jpg


How many miles do you have on your car?
 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #5
Not sure where I came across info of later stronger gears in Bosch stepper motors (wouldn't be surprised if I'm speaking ignorantly). I done three gear swaps w/ motors from non-Alfa applications ~ BMW, if I recall correctly ~ could be I misunderstood what I thought I learned there.
Car has 84,789 miles ~ of which 3,785 are mine since June '18.
Regards, Ralph
 

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The internal gears could be replaced by the ones used in certain BMWs? Are they better (stronger), or was it the programing for them as well? The motors themselves are not a problem, as steppers almost never fail.

I cheated and used the OZ metal gears. Not an inexpensive option, but they will last longer than I will, lol. Would have used a different less expensive option if we had known at the time.
 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #7
Del, somewhere on th' BB is info that led me to do that gear harvest method. Like I told pinino, I could have easily misunderstood what I thought I learned back then. His reply is 1st I've ever heard of reprogram for face-lift HVAC system. My knowledge is really no deeper than task instructed DIY project experience. All I can state for sure right now is I did gear harvest thrice. I have 2 sets of AlfaPro gears, in case either of my cars ever need 'em.
Regards, Ralph
 

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BMW, Alfa: same Bosch gears made in Belgium. Why did Alfa's fail? System uses 2 steppers (+1 for recir) and an idiotic ecu program that overtorqued them. BMW uses 7 (yes 7) steppers, and system doesn't overtorque.** That's why BMW gears serve as great replacements for our Alfa units, they are not worn out.

** some BMWS have 10 stepper motors:
1. Passengerside footwell flap
2. Passengerside dash vent flap
3. Passengerside temperature mixing flap
4. Driverside footwell flap
5. Driverside dash vent
6. Driverside temperature mixing flap
7. Outside air flaps
8. Recirculation mode flap
9. Demister vents flap
10. Rearpassengers freshair flap
 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #9
pinino, if I'm not using "AUTO" mode, I set temp controls at least 1"click" back from "LO" or "HI" extreme selections; but, I've no idea how to do anything similar w/ distribution settings.
Regards, Ralph
 

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Ralph, here's information on the HVAC change starting with '94 model year.


"AUTO' is a mysterious god that I never understood and seldom use. Manually punching the temp and distribution is my way too, just remember FRONT VENT and DEFROST are settings that stress out the gears, of course the resistor mod helps to decrease the wear.

What is interesting about "AUTO" is the way it controls the fan. Manually you have the buttons 1, 2, 3, 4, but "AUTO" seems to be able to glide in between those fixed settings, have you ever noticed that?
 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #11
pinino, when I do use "AUTO", I've noticed it usually blows fan @ high speed before settling to a lower speed & oscillating between higher & lower speeds. I mostly use manual fan speed selections w/ dash&floor distribution setting regardless of temp selected ~ for an interior heat-soaked condition, I'll choose "LO" temp & dash vents for a bit.
Regards, Ralph
 

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1964 Giulia Spider Normale, 1991 164S 5-speed
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This is the NOS stepper motor connector that I have (in preparation for when I have to do the job)
Can you link me to details on this resistor mod?
1679423
 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #13
kg23, I'll try to find it tomorrow ~ just finished getting ready for nite-nite now.
Regards, Ralph
 

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See p. 18-19 of this pdf (also helpful for stepper R/R)

 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #16
Thx pinino. After being a life-long DIYer, this thread proves once again that when you think you've learned it all, you should always presume you haven't.😁
Regards, Ralph
 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #17
kg23, here's another link to a document I also "learned" from:


I hope you can access it (it's a link to my Dropbox cloud), as I can no longer find it on th' BB.
Regards, Ralph
 

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Ralph, that's the same as the one linked in post #14, just a different server. You might note that "Stepper R/R..." predates "164 Stepper Motor..." by 2 months and takes a historical approach starting with the person (Ries van Kersbergen) who truly should be credited with the seminal stepper repair including the resistor mod. Lots of people contributed to the article and most are named. It's truly a Gene Gene made a machine, Joe Joe made it go... (I won't finish the ditty).
 

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EnjoyingSportingLuxury
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Discussion Starter #19
pinino, I know all 'bout ". . . Art, Art . . ."
😉😆😅😂🤣
Regards, Ralph
 

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Just so you know, there is no manual setting for the auto climate control (except OFF). The buttons just override the sensor inputs. The computer still drives the stepper motors, not the driver.

There is no way to prevent the steppers from pushing their respective physical parts to the limits. The temperature flap goes fully open and fully closed from time to time regardless of what temperature setting you select between LO and HI. The distribution drum may not have any physical stops, it wouldn't need any.
 
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