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Discussion Starter #1
Hello to all. My 164S has had all kind of little problems but this is a bit more than I can figure out myself. For a few weeks when I tried to start it cold it would take three to six tries to get it going. The engine seemed not to get enough fuel and I suspected fuel tank pressure loss since when I filled the tank there was a gas smell. I fixed that by replacing filler hose and cap. Filled the tank and there was no more smell. But the car still had problems starting cold. After I drove it for a while I could stop the engine and it would start on first try when starting it within the next hour or so. Then when it got real cold (I'm in Montreal and we often get below freezing point) the car would start with the first turn but I would have to keep a light pressure on the gas pedal to keep it going otherwise it would idle like a pendulum between 800 and 1200 rpm. But still, if I ran it for a while it would start on first try again within the hour. Now things have taken a turn for the worse. I starts cold, runs rough and like a pendulum unless I press the gas pedal, but now if I turn the engine off, it will not start again. The more I try the more it smells like gas and I have to wait a few hours before I can start it again.

I have read other threads and noticed recurrent advice about ignition coils and wire set and I wonder how these can produce these different symptoms.
I will probably replace both and plugs as well just to be on the safe side but that is at least 300$ invested in a trial and error procedure. I'd like knowledgeable advice in advance. Thanks.
 

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Hello to all. My 164S has had all kind of little problems but this is a bit more than I can figure out myself. For a few weeks when I tried to start it cold it would take three to six tries to get it going. The engine seemed not to get enough fuel and I suspected fuel tank pressure loss since when I filled the tank there was a gas smell. I fixed that by replacing filler hose and cap. Filled the tank and there was no more smell. But the car still had problems starting cold. After I drove it for a while I could stop the engine and it would start on first try when starting it within the next hour or so. Then when it got real cold (I'm in Montreal and we often get below freezing point) the car would start with the first turn but I would have to keep a light pressure on the gas pedal to keep it going otherwise it would idle like a pendulum between 800 and 1200 rpm. But still, if I ran it for a while it would start on first try again within the hour. Now things have taken a turn for the worse. I starts cold, runs rough and like a pendulum unless I press the gas pedal, but now if I turn the engine off, it will not start again. The more I try the more it smells like gas and I have to wait a few hours before I can start it again.

I have read other threads and noticed recurrent advice about ignition coils and wire set and I wonder how these can produce these different symptoms.
I will probably replace both and plugs as well just to be on the safe side but that is at least 300$ invested in a trial and error procedure. I'd like knowledgeable advice in advance. Thanks.

Since you smell gas let's pretend you have an ignition problem.

So lets do the easy checks first:
1. Remove coil wire from distributor cap inspect coil tower in cap check wire end and cap for corrosion.
2. Remove rubber boot and coil wire from coil do same inspection to coil tower and wire end.
3. Check coil wire resistance with multimeter and see if you have about 1000 ohms (1.0 kohm).
4. Remove distributor cap from dizzy, check rotor condition and resistance again about 1.0 kohm.
4, Check inside cap for condition/length of spring loaded center carbon button and condition of 6 terminals for each cylinder wire.
5. With key on check for 12v at green wire to coil.
6. Locate RPM/Timing 3-wire Bosch connector near front of engine under A/C service valve along inner fender. Inspect cable going from connector to front crank pulley to ber sure it is not chaffed/shorted by alternator/AC compressor belts or pulleys.
7. Remove spring lock and disconnect connector and inspect for corrosion.
8. Check resistance of sensor between middle pin and one of side connectors for 600 ohm (.6 kohm). Other outside pin to middle pin should not have a readingnot should two outside pins to each other.
9. Clean connector with contact cleaner and pack with dielectric grease.
10. If car will now start does it still idle rough is so you need to check connector to and resistance of coolant temp sensor in mid thermo housing located under top radiotor hose connection below thermostat outlet.
11. Another thing to check is Air Flow Meter inlet corragated tube for cracks at clamps and in corragations.
12. Check and clean Air Flow Meter Bosch connector (try to start engine with it disconnected sometimes it will start and just idle with it disconnected.

Report your findings (don't throw new parts at it until you find a bad part.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I read through your instructions and when I consider #5. "With key on check for 12v at green wire to coil." I think I'm going to have a bad suprise. For a while now when I start, the car I can read on my control panel gage that I have closer to 8 volt available than 12. Until I rev the car abov 2000 rpm or so I don't get much of an improvement and then it get to up to 14.Maybe I should adress that before anything else. If so how do you suggest I proceed?
Thanks
 

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I read through your instructions and when I consider #5. "With key on check for 12v at green wire to coil." I think I'm going to have a bad suprise. For a while now when I start, the car I can read on my control panel gage that I have closer to 8 volt available than 12. Until I rev the car abov 2000 rpm or so I don't get much of an improvement and then it get to up to 14.Maybe I should adress that before anything else. If so how do you suggest I proceed?
Thanks
Inspect battery for proper fluid level in all cells and take a specific gravity reading of each cell. Most auto stores will inspect and test battery.

You need 11.5 volts for car to start and run correctly. So bad cell in battery could be your problem.
 
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