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Discussion Starter #1
I'm installing seat belts in my Duetto , but the lower bolts ( sill + gearbox tunnel) to anchor the belts , are missing. Does anyone know what size (diameter) these are. I assume they are metric. The screws (bolts) for the shoulder anchor are in place , They might be the same size as the lower bolts, but I have not tried , in fear of messing up the threads. Thanks !
 

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Yep, you can blame the US for that one. Even though they have US threads, Euro cars had metric across-the-flats sizes, many of them 17mm.
Andrew
 

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Not sure if it makes a difference..USA 66-67 Spiders had lap belts only and they were secured with chrome plated machine threaded screws with a flat blade head. Shoulder belts make a lot of safety sense though.
Cheers Jon
 

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Discussion Starter #5
OK - 7/16 -20 , I think they have them in the local hardware store. There are more questions , now that I've had look ! I bought a sett of nice Klippan´s , with the chrome anchor bar , from member at the Alfa club over here. They are dated 1971 . He had taken them out of his Alfa , but not a spider . Unfortunately the bar is not going to work with out modifications , To wide and Tall. The passenger seat/seat back adjustment knob is low and very close to the driveshaft tunnel , I think I might as well start from scratch on a new bar . I found a photo of an original Kleppan bar for a AR spider - I Think I can make one ,for the time being. I'M HAVING A HARD TIME figuring out how to adjust the length (shorten) of the belt. It was sort of tied together in a knot when I got them. There is no chance of adjusting length at the anchor points- so it must be at the claw mechanism . Can anyone help me?
I bought the Duetto in New York , but it has metric gauges and the head light buckets have access from the rear (for changing bulbs). So I'm not sure if it is a US Alfa to start with. It has 3 anchor points , and the slotted bolts for the shoulder point where in place. But there are no holes /modification to the drapes . So it probably never had 3 point belts ??? .And I can't remember removing any belts either . I could put in new belts , but it just dosent look right -if I have choice .
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Thanks for the help so far !
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
If some one that has this type of Klippan , Does the belt look like it is threaded right - through here ? It dosent seem "lock" the belt to the buckle /claw at this end. So you can not shorten/adjust the length . I'm a little puzzled ,because it dosen seem as though one can thread it another way , without undoing the stitches and taking off the anchor "eye". OR am I out in the fields ?
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IT works if I thread the end/anchor down through the open slot , but then the end comes inside the belt loop -and that dosen seem right.
 

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The only problem with these belts are that they are all over 40 years old, not sure how much I would trust that old of webbing, no matter how good it looks Can you post a picture of the center bar, it should be flat , not round along the sides, Early BMW 2002 used the same Klippan set up but the bar that they use is round all the way . Something doesn't quite look right I would have to dig my belts out and look at them but they are packed away in a box

Thanks, Rick
 

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Those seat belts are either from a GTV or Berlina. They are way too long. Plus, it looks like the adjustment mechanism is broken or missing some parts.

The hoop that goes on the drive shaft tunnel for a Spider is much smaller. See picture below.

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There are a great number of suppliers of seat belts. You can buy really nice new lap belts or three point belts.

If you want a set of OE belts, look on eBay. US spec cars came with these belts:

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UK delivered cars came with Britax brand belts similar to this one.
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You can even find new stickers for the belts on eBay.

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Each market sourced it's own seat belts, that is why they are different.
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Thanks for the help Here ! I´d like to try and make these Klippans work - first . Not to Crazy about cutting a hole in the drape , but thats how they did it in the 70´s with after marked 3 point belts. They are the right length , They seem to keep you strapped In pretty well . Wish I had right hoop , like the one Ossodisepia posted a photo of . I think that is going to be hard to find, but easy to make. The hoop I have is marked - Klippan 705586 1971 - . Its not for the spider. Osso`s photo of the Crab claw also makes me think the webb some how is threaded wrong on my belts. I think it should come up through the middle slot (where nothing goes thru on mine) , and down through the rear slot . On mine it comes up through rear slot . I dont think any thing is missing or not working on my "Crab Claws" , but rear is retracted on my photo , I think this done when you adjust the length. You can even se the little arrow ,to push it all together ,on Osso`s photo. Anyone have some close up photos of the Klippan Crab claw webb routing ?
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The only problem with these belts are that they are all over 40 years old, not sure how much I would trust that old of webbing, no matter how good it looks Jon is right about the original style of bolt that held the hoop in place. Most seatbelt bolts have a small shoulder on them and sometimes there are plastic insert that goes into the anchor so the anchor can swivel and still be tight
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Well, I have mounted them up and even with the seat retracted all the way , the length of the belt seems to be in the ball park. But Im a tall guy. This hoop is not going on . The webbing can be replaced , with new. I ve been looking for belts for a while , but I haven't found anything new, that dosent have a big Orange button on a stalk (at least not much). Any suggestions ? You know ,I'm not really thinking of maximum safety here. In that case I might as well stay in the landcruiser. It for looks, and calming the passenger down. They expect to find some belts.
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I ve been looking for belts for a while , but I haven't found anything new, that dosent have a big Orange button on a stalk (at least not much). Any suggestions ?
I would strongly recommend keeping the Klippan belts. #1, they are correct for your car, and #2 they are just so cool the way they latch on and off the chromed hoop. Sure, replace the webbing if it is old or too long/short. Sure, find the correct hoop for your Duetto. But for heavens sake, don't install some 21st century belts with day-glow buttons!

I'll post some photos of the belts in my Duetto, showing how the webbing should be looped around the buckle.
 

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I'll post some photos of the belts in my Duetto, showing how the webbing should be looped around the buckle.
As ossodiseppia wrote above, the total length of the webbing is ~ 50" / ~130cm. The third shot below shows how the excess length of the webbing is hooked back on the webbing that attaches to the sill. Not sure how you would duplicate this detail when re-webbing the buckles.

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Discussion Starter #19
Hello Alfajay , thanks for photos. Are your belts 2 or 3 point ? After studying photos , I am almost a 100% certain that mine are threaded wrong through the claw. One end comes out on top , both should come out on the bottom / same side . The access belt also has to be stored by the claw . My belts dont have an end - there are anchor points(metal tabs) in both ends. These tabs dont look like they will fit through some of slots on the claw/belt latch - But I could be wrong. I have asked the guy I got them from if he knows what is going on with these. I was about cave, and get some 2 point airplane style belts no cutting in the drape and no need to fabricate a hoop. But I`d still like to se if I can get these working first.
 

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Hello Alfajay , thanks for photos. Are your belts 2 or 3 point ?
2 point. I believe these what originally came with these cars in 1967 - at least for the US market.

After studying photos , I am almost a 100% certain that mine are threaded wrong through the claw. One end comes out on top , both should come out on the bottom / same side .
Yes, I agree. After studying your photo (below) the threading certainly looks different from mine. I also can't figure out why the black plastic part of your buckle is pushed forward, exposing so much of the chromed metal at the rear. Are the mis-threaded belts holding it forward?



My belts dont have an end - there are anchor points(metal tabs) in both ends. These tabs dont look like they will fit through some of slots on the claw/belt latch - But I could be wrong. I have asked the guy I got them from if he knows what is going on with these.
Is it possible that they are 3-point belts, and that's why they have anchor points at both ends?

I was about cave, and get some 2 point airplane style belts no cutting in the drape and no need to fabricate a hoop. But I`d still like to se if I can get these working first.
It isn't hard to install & remove seat belts, so you certainly could install some 2 point airplane style belts as an interim solution. It may take some time to re-web the Klippan buckles that you have and find the correct center hoop. But it's always nice to bring your Alfa back to its original configuration.
 
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