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Discussion Starter #1
Hi BB Members,

Here in Brazil is getting hard to maintain alfas, some parts are really impossible to get and when you find an usable part it's **** expensive.

Importing parts it's also a headache, huge taxes are applied and you need to pay almost the triple for any imported part (following our importation laws, in case you choose to don't do it you may also not get the part when it arrives).

My 164 is stopped for almost 3 years now, and I'm starting to feel really bad to see it that way. A crankwalk ended my happy rides with this awesome car, now it's too expensive to rebuild the engine and put back on the road.

The plan now is to turn it on a race car, I mean real race car with an MR layout and a bi-turbo busso on it. :)
Of course this is also very expensive, but at least importations for sport are allowed with lower taxes. This makes the project possible and also a better value for money.

I saw some threads about 164 conversions to RWD using 75 parts, but as no alfa 75 or milano exists in Brazil such conversion cannot be made. The solution is really to design all car to support an MR layout, I believe it can be done as there is plenty of space between the axles.

It would remember something like the 164 PROCAR, but of course not that good as the chassis will still be the same 164 chassis and instead of that F1 v10 engine will be a v6.

Probably I will need lot's of support from this great community, but in return I think will be the world's first race 164 with MR layout. :):)
 

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So sad to see what is has become. It is to bad when it becomes improbable to keep a nice car going because of crazy laws designed to make the consumer consume more than he wants to consume.

Even though car manufactures would love to have us crazy Americans junk our "clunkers" and buy new and take on enormous monthly car payments to keep the corporate world humming along, we have a choice.

My choice is to drive an Alfa Romeo 164 until they put me in the ground, God Willing!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
So sad to see what is has become. It is to bad when it becomes improbable to keep a nice car going because of crazy laws designed to make the consumer consume more than he wants to consume.

Even though car manufactures would love to have us crazy Americans junk our "clunkers" and buy new and take on enormous monthly car payments to keep the corporate world humming along, we have a choice.

My choice is to drive an Alfa Romeo 164 until they put me in the ground, God Willing!
Very true indeed Steve. The 164 is a masterpiece, I never drove nothing like this car. Simply amazing.
 

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I will be doing the same the day I have to retire it.
 

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"My choice is to drive an Alfa Romeo 164 until they put me in the ground, God Willing"

Beginning to sound like a nice idea.
 

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Should be easy ... just remove engine and gearbox and suspension from front, cut out rear of the car's internal panelling and stick engine assembly there. Weld a few things and sort out front suspension and away you go :D.

You have a great opportunity to get your suspension right, so I'd be doing lots of research on roll centres as now is the time to make these changes.
Pete
 

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If your looking to get the car back on the road I can help you restore it to it
s glorious past?
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Updates !! :)

Hello All,

Just a quick update on the project.

I started the transformation today, after a while. The project changed a little bit, it will not be RWD anymore... :(

The conversion would be really expensive to keep the excellent body rigidity we already have in our 164s. So no changes to the layout.

Next steps are the complete removal of everything which is useless to save weight (I was impressed to see how heavy the A/C and heating system was), engine overhaul and a new ECU. Hopefully I would have a curb weight of ~1000kg and 260hp with race cams, head, straight exhaust and the ECU fully calibrated.

By the way, anyone has experience with the RPM limits on the 12v? I was thinking about 7500 RPM. I know 24v engines easily go to this figure, not sure about the 12v.

Here are some pics of the work done so far, I will keep you all posted.

Thanks,
Micael.
 

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rev limit and cams for 12V

Firstly, very cool project. I think you'll find the 164 chassis to be rather athletic and rigid once all the comfort weight is gone...

Maybe RJ (AlfaR7) will chime in. I don't know if he frequents the 164 section, but I would listen to his advice if he is to chime in on cams, fuel injection tuning (what motronic version are you running, anyway?), and rev limit parameters. He has very valuable experience with the motor that you are asking about.

I'm sure you've seen this video of a 12V 164 racer:
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Hi Rob,

Yes I checked this video, for sure it's a 12v.

I'm planning to use a FuelTech FT-400 as ECU, it's a brazilian aftermarket ECU used a lot in caring cars here in Brazil. The good thing is that settings and adjustments can be done in the car on real time, there is no need to have a computer to change injecting curves or timing. All on the fly and there is a data-logger included.

For more info:
FuelTech - Performance em suas mos (site only in portuguese, sorry)

The original Motronic is too "closed", as I'm planning to use other injectors and ignition system the only way is to go for another ECU.

Next week I may have some more updates on the project, I will have some time to play a little with it.

Thanks,
Micael.
 
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