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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
TL;DR in later post, found correct studs to replace the ones I pulled from the timing cover on the donor engine years ago, to quote myself retroactively...

While ordering other parts I needed, I found suitable replacement studs at Bel-Metric. If you haven't heard of them - amazing safe haven of uncommon metric hardware in the USA. I ordered 1x S6X52DPLN and 6x S6X37DBLK. Looks like it will fit exactly as required.
I'm overhauling an engine which does not have any water pump studs - bolts were used in place of all studs here. I plan to replace these bolts with long pieces of threaded rod cut to the appropriate lengths. Is this for any reason a bad idea?

Also... how do you know when you need to replace the water pump? I always understood it would be a good idea when overhauling the engine, but the only place I can find one in stock is Centerline for $300. This is a little pricey if it is not a necessary replacement. Thoughts? I have two used spares I know are not leaky, is there anything else I need to evaluate on them to consider use?
 

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stevespiderguy said:
the only place I can find one in stock is Centerline for $300. This is a little pricey
See this thread: Water pump source?

I typically replace the pump when it begins to leak, or when I'm doing a rebuild (which I guess is where you are at now), and am worried about the pump's age. That thread I cited suggests some places to have your existing pumps rebuilt.
 

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Sounds like a rather bad idea. A stud is designed to install to a set depth and stop so that you can tighten a nut on the other end. With threaded rod there's nothing stopping the rod from rotating into the chain cover as you're trying to tighten the outer nut. It seems like a worse solution than the bolts you've got.

Why wouldn't you just get the correct studs? If you want to keep it easy to remove, you can stick with bolts for the bottom two holes and use studs on all the others. Or just install the lower studs with plenty of anti-seize so they're easy to remove next water pump change.
 

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I'm overhauling an engine which does not have any water pump studs - bolts were used in place of all studs here. I plan to replace these bolts with long pieces of threaded rod cut to the appropriate lengths. Is this for any reason a bad idea?

Also... how do you know when you need to replace the water pump? I always understood it would be a good idea when overhauling the engine, but the only place I can find one in stock is Centerline for $300. This is a little pricey if it is not a necessary replacement. Thoughts? I have two used spares I know are not leaky, is there anything else I need to evaluate on them to consider use?
$300 is not pricey for GTV owners and their $50K GTVs. Some Spider owners a different story. Sorry

Stay well

ken
 

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But Mad North-Northwest
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Also I believe those studs are coarse into the block and fine on the nut. The below is why.

You can use bolts, a lot of people do, but you have to be really careful not to strip the holes in the cover.

1621236
 

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Sounds like a rather bad idea. A stud is designed to install to a set depth and stop so that you can tighten a nut on the other end. With threaded rod there's nothing stopping the rod from rotating into the chain cover as you're trying to tighten the outer nut. It seems like a worse solution than the bolts you've got.

Why wouldn't you just get the correct studs? If you want to keep it easy to remove, you can stick with bolts for the bottom two holes and use studs on all the others. Or just install the lower studs with plenty of anti-seize so they're easy to remove next water pump change.
This is a very suggestion.

K
 

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Also I believe those studs are coarse into the block and fine on the nut. The below is why.

You can use bolts, a lot of people do, but you have to be really careful not to strip the holes in the cover.

View attachment 1621236
Most Alfa studs are that way, coarse/fine but not the 6 mm studs . They are M6-1.0 both sides.
 

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But Mad North-Northwest
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Most Alfa studs are that way, coarse/fine but not the 6 mm studs . They are M6-1.0 both sides.
Cool, I did the job last year but couldn't remember. Mine came to me with bolts on the bottom two holes so I didn't need to remove any studs.
 

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I'm overhauling an engine which does not have any water pump studs - bolts were used in place of all studs here. I plan to replace these bolts with long pieces of threaded rod cut to the appropriate lengths. Is this for any reason a bad idea?

Also... how do you know when you need to replace the water pump? I always understood it would be a good idea when overhauling the engine, but the only place I can find one in stock is Centerline for $300. This is a little pricey if it is not a necessary replacement. Thoughts? I have two used spares I know are not leaky, is there anything else I need to evaluate on them to consider use?
The reason studs are used in Aluminum is to ensure proper long enough thread engagement and to avoid thread pull out by repeated use of bolts. Thread pullout is fixed or avoided by the use of thread certs or heli coil or the like.

K
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Sounds like a rather bad idea. A stud is designed to install to a set depth and stop so that you can tighten a nut on the other end. With threaded rod there's nothing stopping the rod from rotating into the chain cover as you're trying to tighten the outer nut. It seems like a worse solution than the bolts you've got.

Why wouldn't you just get the correct studs? If you want to keep it easy to remove, you can stick with bolts for the bottom two holes and use studs on all the others. Or just install the lower studs with plenty of anti-seize so they're easy to remove next water pump change.
I learned a few things today! Glad I started this discussion. Bolts were used by a less informed me about 4 years ago. Boy do I wish I had kept the studs. Actually.... they might be in the garage, I will check. If I knew where to get a set of them or have them made, I'd sooner do that, but I couldn't find anything on a quick internet search and a check of the usual places I order from (Centerline, Classic Alfa, and Alfaholics).

I plan to do an electric fan conversion so the engine driven fan failure will no longer be a concern. Neither will future replacement of the water pump, I'll just remove the radiator. It's so easy I don't know why I felt the need to avoid it in the past.
 

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If I knew where to get a set of them or have them made, I'd sooner do that, but I couldn't find anything on a quick internet search and a check of the usual places I order from (Centerline, Classic Alfa, and Alfaholics).

Reread post #9. They're not super expensive. Even if you don't own a GTA and a yacht. ;)

 

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Discussion Starter #14
Reread post #9. They're not super expensive. Even if you don't own a GTA and a yacht. ;)

I suppose that will work. Feels odd to buy an entire timing cover just for a few bolts, but it's a good lesson in its own right. Sadly no yacht in my life, I was about to buy a 25' sailboat before I found my first Alfa Romeo on Craigslist. I knew boats are real money pits after owning one in my youth... maybe it will happen in my retirement.
 

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Reread post #9. They're not super expensive. Even if you don't own a GTA and a yacht. ;)

Ok, what I meant was the increasing value of these cars does have some effect on the cost (value) of parts NOS, replacement, repro or used.

Stay Well

Ken
 

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,,,,,and, replace the fan blades with a new one. Old yellowed ones have been know to lose a blade or two ant the most inconvenient time. When they let loose, you're looking at some damage to the hood and possible the radiator.

My philosophy is, if it moves don't scrimp on the $$.
True! I had my fan explode on my way to the Monterey Historics 20 years ago. It did significant damage to my hood (new paint job). I was lucky to find a guy in Sand City who not only worked on Alfa's but also happened to have a new OEM fan in stock. That isn't going to happen these days.
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
True! I had my fan explode on my way to the Monterey Historics 20 years ago. It did significant damage to my hood (new paint job). I was lucky to find a guy in Sand City who not only worked on Alfa's but also happened to have a new OEM fan in stock. That isn't going to happen these days.
I had a similar experience on tour last summer looking for a replacement starter motor (and more importantly, a shop to do the replacement). The Alfa mechanic I happened to find was a true grace from G-d. Very fortunate to find him. At any rate I'm getting a new radiator and a 12" fan, I'll post pictures here when I begin to put everything together.

I tried working out how to fit a shroud to pull air through the entire radiator, it does not seem practical unless I make a mold and vacuum form something. So, I'll accept based on other experiences reported on the BB that a fan which covers 68.5% of the radiator (approximately.... 12" of 17.5" total exposed width of radiator) will be effective to keep the engine cool.

Edit: I measured 3" clearance between the radiator and the pulley for the engine driven fan. Looks like using a fan like this will be a little risky but should fit. I'm worried about a small clearance but I suppose as long as the radiator fan is a good half inch away from the pulley, it will be fine? Guess we'll find out.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
While ordering other parts I needed, I found suitable replacement studs at Bel-Metric. If you haven't heard of them - amazing safe haven of uncommon metric hardware in the USA. I ordered 1x S6X52DPLN and 6x S6X37DBLK. Looks like it will fit exactly as required.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Most Alfa studs are that way, coarse/fine but not the 6 mm studs . They are M6-1.0 both sides.
Thanks for pointing this out, I was really put to the test when I put in an order for studs today and realized I should know already how uncommon M6x0.8 is. Well, I suppose I can rest easy now knowing I have found studs which match OEM specification.
 
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