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Discussion Starter #1
Hello Alfisti,

I am currently working on the rear suspension on my '86 Spider Graduate. I replaced the rear trailing arm bushings. This was the first job I ever did on a car (got the Spider november 2014), but with the help of the manual on this forum I managed to do the job. Now I am working on the anti roll bar bushings. I got the old anti-roll bar out and removed the old bushings. I also managed to get the new bushings into the droplinks, but when I wanted to put it all together I discovered the bushings I got slide onto the anti rollbar without any effort at all, while it should be a press fit.
Does anyone know how this could be possible? The only thing that I can think of is that someone replaced the anti rollbar on my car by one from an early generation Spider. Those early ones seem to have different bushing. Can someone tell me what the difference is?

With kind regards,

Niels
 

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Unfortunately you are not alone, as its happened to a few other guys including me. After much concern, researching the forum and discussions with people that I trust, I installed them with Loctite green which is a retaining compound that is capable of securing loosely fitting items with up to something like 0.015" of clearance, and the bushings haven't budged in almost 3 years.
 

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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Hmm okay. The old ones were definitely press fitted, so I would expect something is wrong with the innerdiameter of the new bushes. I will try to measure the gap tomorrow in order to get some idea of how big the problem is.

Edit: Maybe I could cut a very small groove into both the bushing and the anti rollbar and then push a metal pin in between the two (in combination with the Loctite) in order to guarantee it to stay located properly.
 

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Hmm okay. The old ones were definitely press fitted, so I would expect something is wrong with the innerdiameter of the new bushes. I will try to measure the gap tomorrow in order to get some idea of how big the problem is.

Edit: Maybe I could cut a very small groove into both the bushing and the anti rollbar and then push a metal pin in between the two (in combination with the Loctite) in order to guarantee it to stay located properly.
Yes, there are supposed to be a press fit, as were the ones that we struggled to remove. The problem is a lot of the aftermarket parts available to us these days are of questionable quality, and we get what we get. I'm in Canada so the disaster in having to return them to a supplier in the US wouldn't have been worth it, just to get another set that would likely have been equally loose, so I just lived with them and did what I did. I researched the retaining compound and its so strong, I might be better off replacing the entire links when its time to change the bushings again.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
That's a good point. I am in the Netherlands, so one would expect a better supply of AR parts, but that seems to be not necessarily the case. I am in contact with my supplier about the problem, but if that doesn't result in a solution I will go for the loctite option. It is definitely a good idea that is worth trying.
 

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Note that's Loctite #638 Green (bearing retainer compound), not the #290 Green (wicking) Loctite. They have a million of them!

And yeah, everybody seems to have bushings that are slightly loose right now. They all seem to have more-or-less the same suppliers on both sides of the pond.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks for the help. The loctite product range was indeed confusing me. Any thoughts about how much I need? Is a 10ml sufficient or do I need 50ml?
 

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I had the same issue last year when rebuilding the entire suspension.
The dealer claimed that many customers complained about not managing to get the new bushings on. So they started ordering bushings that had a slightly different size. (I personally don't believe that but that's what they claimed.).

I also fit them with red loctite 2700. The bushings are still in place...

/Jens
 

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I think it was Loctite 680 that I used.
Go to their retaining compounds page and look at the different ones and by description you will tell which ones work depending on application, etc. As for size, you literally only need a few drips per bushing, so I'd say you are good with 10ml.
 

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That's the "problem" Mike - you look at their retaining compounds and there are several there that would probably do the job. These parts are pretty close to being right. I agree though, the #680 seems like the most "sure thing". I had to look it up because I was familiar with the #290 Green and thought "that doesn't seem right at all". Great tip though either way!

I let mine just be loose which seems to work OK but I guess it will eventually wear the bar and make the situation worse. I went over to Centerline and we measured a couple of bushings from their stock and they were the same as mine (not surprising - mine were bought from them). Measured their poly bushing as well thinking that might be the solution but it was actually slightly worse!

Chris
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I reattached my droplinks yesterday evening, using Loctite 638. I seemed to work pretty well indeed.
@GV27: Does the anti rollbar still work if there’s a loose fit between the bar and the droplinks? I thought the whole idea behind it was to resist asymmetrical (vertical) movement between the right and the left wheel. So that would require a non-moving anti rollbar construction, or am I wrong?
 

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I reattached my droplinks yesterday evening, using Loctite 638. I seemed to work pretty well indeed.

@GV27: Does the anti rollbar still work if there’s a loose fit between the bar and the droplinks? I thought the whole idea behind it was to resist asymmetrical (vertical) movement between the right and the left wheel. So that would require a non-moving anti rollbar construction, or am I wrong?
Once the Loctite cures, they will be rock solid. I forgot to mention that I used zip ties to keep everything tight for a day until they cured.
 

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Sure but there's still a rubber bushing in there that allows some twisting movement. That's OK though - the ends of the bar are the levers that twist the center section of the bar. It works through the motion of the link pushing the end up, not on the link twisting the end of the bar. So it's OK if it can move a little or even a lot. Bump pushes up on suspension, suspension pushes on the link and since it can't go fore or aft since it's attached to the bar, it goes up. That connection is dependent on the pliability of the bushing, not the bushing's grip on the bar end.

Mine works fine where it's at but I have two problems. One of the bushings could slide off the end of the bar, and I'm concerned about it getting worse over time.

Another "fix" I've seen is to let the bushing slide and tack a weld on the end of the bar to keep it from sliding off. Retaining compound seems like a much better solution.
 

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I had the same issue a while back with bushes from Alfaholics in the UK. I phoned them and they said that, yes, the parts were a bit variable in quality. They measured some that they had on the shelf and sent me replacements that were a tight fit.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Sure but there's still a rubber bushing in there that allows some twisting movement. That's OK though - the ends of the bar are the levers that twist the center section of the bar. It works through the motion of the link pushing the end up, not on the link twisting the end of the bar. So it's OK if it can move a little or even a lot. Bump pushes up on suspension, suspension pushes on the link and since it can't go fore or aft since it's attached to the bar, it goes up. That connection is dependent on the pliability of the bushing, not the bushing's grip on the bar end.
You are right GV27. I was confusing it with some kind of torsion bar set-up. Thanks for the explanation.
 

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Hammer & Loctite

Hi,
i was told just recently from a supplier in the UK, that the bar ends are supposed to be hammered to keep the bushes in place. That in conjunction with Loctite should keep all in place.
 
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