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Discussion Starter #1
Hi guys:

I guess I have to admit the Alfa bug bit me.

Today, I commited to purchase my third Giulietta, in this case a 1957 Sprint, chassis AR1493-03136, engine AR1315-02808 and. I also have an earlier Spider restoration project and a slightly later, transitional Sprint under restoration: http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/giulietta-giulia-1954-65/202973-alfa-romeo-giulietta-sprint-ar-1493-07392-restoration-10.html

Back to the latest toy, I went to see the car Saturday to Mexico city… sad sight. It was left abandoned in a garden for 15 years, as the owner passed away and… long story, but now that the son needs to remove the car, he decided to sell it.

The car was a good buy for me, at what I consider an attractive price, and I am looking forward to restoring it, though I am hoping not as thoroughly as the other Sprint that I am working on now.

It appears to have been a good car, restored in the 80’s or so, a little on the race type, with emblems, white circles for numbers, colored wheels, etc., but on an either very good original car or at least one with little rust. The car appears to have been a dark blue color, and the paint almost still shines under the fenders, but now there is deffinately rust coming out from the places where they join other metal parts, but luckily not very evident on the outside of the car or even on floors… but I certainly fear the rust may be much more than I anticipate, as in my other Sprint… but anyhow I decided to take the risk.

The car is in Mexico and strangely, for cars down here, it has a speedometer in miles, so it may be an earlier car, not assembled by Wyllis Mexicana, but I can’t be sure of anything right now, other than it seems to be a Normale (regular doors and window lifts), with sealed beam lights (European cars sold down here generally used European lighting).

I haven’t been able to open the hood and check on mechanical components, but through the vent tube holes I was able to insert my hand with my cell phone camera and take a few pics which show that the car has, asides from two tons of spiders (yes, the little multi legged insects) a pair of Webers but apparently on the original engine, as the engine number does seem to match an engine from the era. I was able to check on the engine’s number without the front wheel in place, again by cleaning a bit and taking pics. My guess is that when it was turned into a “racer” a set of Weber carbs were fitted. Also, the gearbox has the raised gearbox lever, therefore I suspect that the gearbox might have been changed to a later unit. Also, a leather interior was fitted, which I believe I can save, though it may not be fully correct for the car.

It has a couple of things which were optional and are now somewhat attractive: a wood Nardi wheel with the two buttons for lights and horn, and a rear seat.

Again, I have not been able to open the hood as it is frozen. You will see in the pics that in the past they have tried to open it rather crudely but to no effect.

Anyhow, as to my questions, two basic ones that I can think of are:

1. The hood moulding and emblem it has, I haven’t seen it on other Sprints. Is this a regular item at some point of production, an option, or perhaps and aftermarket thing?

2. Most of the earlier Sprints that I have seen have the gearshift lever up in the column. This particular car has the floor shift. Was it common at this point of production (nr. 3136) to have the shift lever already on the floor? Or should it have it up in the steering column? With the emotion, I forgot to check if I saw any signs of the change.

As I said, I believe it was made into a “nice looking racer”, but probably just for the looks of it, but certainly may have been improved and updated a bit with carbs and gearbox… but more than theorizing myself, I am including a few pics so I can learn from the experts what may be wrong and not. I will appreciate your honest opinions of what you see may not be correct.

Thanks,
Victor
 

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Discussion Starter #2

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Discussion Starter #4
And still some more of the outside:
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Dashboard with incorrect knob and radio delete plate (is it correct for a Spider?), incorrect ignition switch, glove box lock and adapted lighter
 

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Discussion Starter #6
More dashboard and interior pics... a beautiful steering wheel and the missing ash tray. Incorrect glove box lock. Gear box lever of the newer taller type?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
And now the engine pics... without opening the hood and through small holes...
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Some chassis/underside pics...
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Asides from what the car has, there is an extra set of wheels, full hubcaps, front bumper and I think that is all.


Basic doubts, again:

Hood emblem

Gearbox lever on the floor? Correct type?

Plus whatever you can think of!

Thanks!
victor
 

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Asides from what the car has, there is an extra set of wheels, full hubcaps, front bumper and I think that is all.


Basic doubts, again:

Hood emblem

Gearbox lever on the floor? Correct type?

Plus whatever you can think of!

Thanks!
victor
Congrats. Looks failry complete. The radio delete is from a Duetto and the rear view mirror looks wrong but those are minor.

Chuck
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Thank you, Chuck. Yes, pretty complete... but I will have to wait till after the first good wash to see how restorable it is. I assume (better say hope) it will be!

Victor
 

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Hi Victor

To start 1493*03136 is a late '56, a rough calculation says circa October '56, but the archives will tell you for sure

Hood spear / emblem is wrong, the correct one does not have the upright 'wing' and goes from the front to 3/4 of the way along the bonnet

The gearbox is a later 5 speed, this car should have a 4 speed tunnel case - the sheet metal on the floor has been modified to fit the later box, but it's a easy fix.

I cannot tell if it was column or floor shift, I need to see the passenger side of the steering column shroud, also the tail lights are 750 Spider so I can't tell from those either (only the column shift tunnel case cars had reverse lights = amber/red/white, while the floor shift cars were amber/red/amber)

The floor shift tunnel case was used from early to mid '56 as it arrived in March '56 with the Veloce's. The column shift continued to be fitted to the Sprints for the home (Italian) market and also sporadically up to chassis 7300 when the split case arrived

Door patterns are wrong, seat cover patterns are close, but not quite right, the rear seat is home made, the Bertone optional one had side arm rests and a pull down centre arm rest.

The headlight rims are correct, the headlight glasses have been adapted to fit

Inlet manifold is a 101 Veloce type - nice & rare

Dash mirror is wrong

Glove box lock is wrong - I have a spare for you

Nice buy, I can help you with all the in formation you need, I have three '57 Sprints, 05262 a column shift car, 05823 and 05880 a barn find reasonably unmolested condition and scores of pictures in my archives, both '56 and '57

Ciao
Greig

6 Sprints
3 Spiders
that Ti
Others
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Hi Greig:

Thanks a lot! Very informative. If it is an October 1956 car, that justifies that the paperwork says 1957 model year, particularly as the transit to Mexico and it's sale probably took at least a couple of months. I will write to Mr. Fazio and perhaps he can confirm if the car came originally to Mexico, as the speedometer in miles does puzzle me a bit.

I wonder where they got that aluminum hood trim. Actually, it looks nice! But I will have to find a correct piece... and thanks for offering the glove box lock and letting me know about wrong taillights, etc.

So, the car has the Veloce manifold with the two carbs (of course), plus a later 5 speed gearbox which confirms my theory of the 'update' at some point. I should get the car later in the week and wil send you pics of the steering column, passenger's side, to try to find out if it was originally a floor shift car or not.

If it was originally a column shift car, how difficult is it to get it back? Would a TI parts car have the correct parts? Honestly, I am not sure at this point if I would want to get it back to original or to keep it as updated (glad they apparently kept the original engine), but I ask in order to consider the change.

Another question that comes to mind is: if you take a Normale engine and add up manifold and carbs from a Veloce, do you end up having the same performance as in a Veloce or does a Veloce have different valves or cam?

Curious mind... but knowing will help determine what should I do with the car... get it back to original configuration or leave it as is.

I am attaching a pic I got today. The owner installed the wheels so the flatbed can pick it up this week. The front right one has one stud only as the others broke who knows when. I am hoping the other set of wheels will be more conservative and not widened, as these appear to be!

Thanks!
Victor
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Yesterday, the car arrived. We did some cleaning with a pressure water cleaner and removed tons of dirt and spiders. I got the car in my small shop and started checking on things. It does seem very complete and fully restorable. Some rust issues, but nothing too great or scary as to not do the car.

Anyhow... discoveries and questions:

1. The car is confirmed as numbers matching.

2. The car was indeed a steering column shift, but there is nothing there left. In case I consider getting it back, are parts of a TI the same? I may not do it as it would probably mean getting the older 4 speed gearbox and it may be too much swaping for me, but I would certainly like to know, as there might be a TI parts car available.

3. The engine head has no provision for the fuel pump at the front. I understand Veloces had electric fuel pumps. Would this mean it is a Veloce head? If my engine block checks with the plate, I mean numbers, does it mean I have the original engine but fitted with a Veloce head?

4. The car seems to be Azzuro Inverno, or Winter blue, which I read somewhere is a 1957 color only. I like it... but I may like another lighter shade of blue (but already have the 1958 Sprint being restored in Iseo blue). This one also shows having some electric metallic blue paint at some point of it's life, not nice. Would anybody have pics of Sprints in the lighter blue colors, Azzuro Capri (AR304) and Bleu Chiarisimo (AR310)?

As a small progress report: We already removed plugs and added very light oil, let it rest overnight and today just barely turned the engine by hand (5th and rocking the car). The engine is free, and I believe this will allow oil to penetrate better. We will start looking at things and see if we can turn it completely and start it by next week. We are already looking at the starter motor, which is not working.


A few pics...
 

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Discussion Starter #18
So... anybody wants to try an educated guess and tell me what the engine head I have is from? Is it from a Giulietta veloce? A friend tells me he thinks it is Giulia, but I have no idea and I would love to find out.

Thanks,
victor
 

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The cylinder head is a late 101 head and 101 engines used a mechanical fuel pump located on the bottom left side of the front cover. I am thinking about selling a column shift tunnel case transmission which could have been used on your car.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Kuni: Thanks for letting me know about the engine.

I am interested in uour column shift... if you decide to sell it, drop me a line at: vmilkeg at gmail dot com.

Thanks!
victor
 
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