[Alfar7]

Drool!!
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071016/FREE/71016005/-1/newsletter01

 

[Zunige]

It's a stunning car for sure - much better in person than in pics... Thanks for sharing.

Best regards,

 

[Craig LNU]

Thanks for posting that link to the article.

 

[Arna]

Why does that article say Alfa is going to return in 2010? I thought that Fiat moved up the relaunch to the 2009 model year.

Interesting though to find out that the 8C doesn't have a functioning trunk. It almost seems pointless to have a 23-gallon fuel tank if you can't really carry anything for such a long distance. This car is definitely unique. When I began reading the article I was still under the impression that the car might still be more Maserati than Alfa...but after I read that tidbit, I knew it was an Alfa.

 

[DaveH]

"Arrive at a corner too fast and the front end eventually pushes as traction wanes. However, that initial understeer is quickly neutralized by lifting the right foot "

That ain't how you drive an Alfa!

 

[Zunige]

...Interesting though to find out that the 8C doesn't have a functioning trunk. It almost seems pointless to have a 23-gallon fuel tank if you can't really carry anything for such a long distance. ...

Being someone who actually drives his cars long distances, I was equally interested (not that I can afford one, though. ) in the 8C's ability to carry luggage. Two of my standing complaints about many modern two-seaters is their small luggage capacity and their inability to recline a seat to any significant degree. The 8C actually comes with real leather luggage, that is fitted to the area behind the seats (which you really can't recline ), so you could certainly carry more clothes than you need for being out on the road on a vacation. With the 8C being such a great car the overall reaction is to excuse this limitation, but it's hard to imagine that they couldn't find a way to close off a luggage area. I don't know if this is a "super-car" trend, as I've seen Ferrari do something similar in one of their models, but it is certainly a very awkward way to provide an area for luggage. That was the only flaw that I saw (and still excused ) in such a great car, when I had the opportunity to see the 8C up close and personal at the Detroit Convention this past August.

Best regards,

 

[RussianM3_dude]

When I began reading the article I was still under the impression that the car might still be more Maserati than Alfa...but after I read that tidbit, I knew it was an Alfa.

It's a Maserati chasis/suspension. Maserati gearbox. Maserati engine. Built by Maserati in a Maserati factory. It's no more an Alfa then a 360 Modena is a PininFarina.

The only things I can think of that the 8C has from Alfa are the instruments, the digital screen, the badges and the Centro Stile designed body.

It's basically a Maserati Gransport Challenge Stradale.

 

[Zunige]

When a concept car is brought into production, it is not uncommon for a manufacturer to base it on something that already exists. It doesn't turn the concept into a different marque. As stated in the article (as well as other previous reports): "However, just about every part been altered during development. The 8C has a unique driving character; the track widths, for example, have been extended by a respective 2.6 and 2 inches front and rear to provide the 8C with a confident stance."

Best regards,

 

[RussianM3_dude]

So they played around with the suspension... Big deal. The Alfa SZ used pretty much 100% Alfa tech, what does the 8C prove or show??? That Alfa Romeo has a good design studio and not much engineering muscle???

 

[Zunige]

Russian,
I think we are hijacking this thread into a much broader discussion, which will never end. I've re-read the title of this thread, and will simply remain respectful of it...

Best regards,

 

[Arna]

So they played around with the suspension... Big deal. The Alfa SZ used pretty much 100% Alfa tech, what does the 8C prove or show??? That Alfa Romeo has a good design studio and not much engineering muscle???

This is a big deal. The 8C is the first product to come from Maserati's new alliance with Alfa. In the future, Maserati will use the 169 architecture to make an entry level Maserati. Alfa, it seems, will use some of that engineering muscle from Maserati to create better engines. Alfas product will get better in time and without crappy designers like Bangle in the mix, their appeal will probably grow instead of turn buyers away with cars that look like the crusher got them before they hit the showroom. Alfa does have an opportunity here. The 8C shows they are taking advantage of. This is why its a big deal. It's a benchmark in a way.

 

[HenryKrinkle]

It's a Maserati chasis/suspension. Maserati gearbox. Maserati engine. Built by Maserati in a Maserati factory. It's no more an Alfa then a 360 Modena is a PininFarina.

The only things I can think of that the 8C has from Alfa are the instruments, the digital screen, the badges and the Centro Stile designed body.

It's basically a Maserati Gransport Challenge Stradale.

Oh no.. He's back?.. Do we have to drudge this up...again Russian? Please dont make me go find threads where you admitted being wrong calling the 8C engine a masi engine, when we all know good well where Masi gets their v8....

Youve never proven the 8C is built by Maserati in a Maserati Factory.. and probably never will.. (yet youve stated it as fact more then a few times). Not to mention how fuzzy the lines cross under the umbrella of Fiat.... I've seen recent clips of Maserati's being constructed IN the Ferrari Factory.. (at least in part) Where what is done exactly will never be proven by you and your temporary pass to the Ferrari Challenge events..

You somehow get off on calling the 8C a Maserati.. knowing the reactions it incites on this board, disregarding what the current Maserati has taken from others. Probably exactly how you seem to get off by referring to the alfa enthusiasts on this board as terrorists as you have in the past.

Again..20th time? The Pagani would be a mercedes, and McLaren F1 a BMW (U wish and im sure how you refer it as) and so on and so forth by your logic.

Bytheway, werent you kicked off this board for referring to the Alfa Enthusiasts on this board as terrorists, and then trying to deflate your comments by defending the very terrorist group you compared us to ?? No..we didnt easily forget.

I would say Arna is basically spot on in this matter.

 

[jess]

Uh...

the 8C is indeed made by Maserati in Modena factory...

But that's irrelevant.

The engine was sourced from ferrari, by maserati, and Alfa took it and tuned it to alfa way, much like it did to the fiat blocks and the holden blocks. Do you prefer a fiat/holden based alfa engine or ferrari based alfa engine?

So is the suspension department. It has been tuned by Alfa to drive like an Alfa. It may share parts, but it's still designed by Alfa engineering.

In today's world sharing manufacturing, a company takes advantage of best parts available and use to their advantage... some times the source of parts are limited.... just try make the best out of it. With Maserati / Alfa alliance, it's obvious where Alfa is sourcing the best of the parts from for the new super car.

Is 8C an Alfa? Absolutely. Is it a Maserati? It may share many parts. Do I want one? ABSOLUTELY!!

Jess

 

[GVVGTV6]

It's a Maserati chasis/suspension. Maserati gearbox. Maserati engine. Built by Maserati in a Maserati factory. It's no more an Alfa then a 360 Modena is a PininFarina.

The only things I can think of that the 8C has from Alfa are the instruments, the digital screen, the badges and the Centro Stile designed body.

It's basically a Maserati Gransport Challenge Stradale.

Get off the pot - you know I am soooooo freakin tired of this same old crap on the newer Alfas not being real Alfas, etc. Whether something has a Maserati frame and engine, a Fiat whatever ... I mean who the hell cares, who here is really buying a freakin 8c anyway! And if you were, would you even care? Probably NOT.

This is all B.S. until you go to drive the car and then you are judging (I would think) on the whole package, how it looks and how it drives - I could really care less where what is made or designed, when I go to buy either I like the aspects of the car or I don't.

Way off topic.

GV

 

[RussianM3_dude]

Uh...

the 8C is indeed made by Maserati in Modena factory...

But that's irrelevant.

The engine was sourced from ferrari, by maserati, and Alfa took it and tuned it to alfa way, much like it did to the fiat blocks and the holden blocks. Do you prefer a fiat/holden based alfa engine or ferrari based alfa engine?

So is the suspension department. It has been tuned by Alfa to drive like an Alfa. It may share parts, but it's still designed by Alfa engineering.

In today's world sharing manufacturing, a company takes advantage of best parts available and use to their advantage... some times the source of parts are limited.... just try make the best out of it. With Maserati / Alfa alliance, it's obvious where Alfa is sourcing the best of the parts from for the new super car.

Is 8C an Alfa? Absolutely. Is it a Maserati? It may share many parts. Do I want one? ABSOLUTELY!!

Jess

So which Alfa components does the 8C use? Ermmm not a whole lot. So why call it an Alfa? They don't even build it.

 

[RussianM3_dude]

Oh no.. He's back?.. Do we have to drudge this up...again Russian? Please dont make me go find threads where you admitted being wrong calling the 8C engine a masi engine, when we all know good well where Masi gets their v8....

Youve never proven the 8C is built by Maserati in a Maserati Factory.. and probably never will.. (yet youve stated it as fact more then a few times). Not to mention how fuzzy the lines cross under the umbrella of Fiat.... I've seen recent clips of Maserati's being constructed IN the Ferrari Factory.. (at least in part) Where what is done exactly will never be proven by you and your temporary pass to the Ferrari Challenge events..

You somehow get off on calling the 8C a Maserati.. knowing the reactions it incites on this board, disregarding what the current Maserati has taken from others. Probably exactly how you seem to get off by referring to the alfa enthusiasts on this board as terrorists as you have in the past.

Again..20th time? The Pagani would be a mercedes, and McLaren F1 a BMW (U wish and im sure how you refer it as) and so on and so forth by your logic.

Bytheway, werent you kicked off this board for referring to the Alfa Enthusiasts on this board as terrorists, and then trying to deflate your comments by defending the very terrorist group you compared us to ?? No..we didnt easily forget.

I would say Arna is basically spot on in this matter.

The Maserai engine is a Ferrari developed engine, I never claimed they weren't.

I don't have to prove anything, just ring up Alfa and enquire as to where the 8C will be built... In Modena... (the engines are assembled in Maranello by Ferrari, I know, I've been to the factory.) The Ferrari production line in Maranello only builds Ferraris.

So where do YOU think the 8C is built? Please enlighten us.

The 8C does not ONLY use the Maser/Ferrari engine. It uses EVERYTHING from Maserati and is even BUILT by them. Under your logic, I can take and Audi RS4, stick the VW badges on it and claim that VW just built an ultra fast Passat????

 

[HenryKrinkle]

I don't have to prove anything,

Yea... that's kinda what we've wanted for awhile.. good to know.

just ring up Alfa and enquire as to where the 8C will be built... In Modena...

Oh good idea, or better yet, i'll ring up Sergio (whose probably still recovering) and say hey, can you please tell me the entire construction history of the 8C, from the top down.. When exactly do you transfer the engine's (probably complete) from maranello to modena.. oh but wait Alfa completely rebuilds them (at least the head).. so again Sergio, explain to me, forget about any Confidentiality agreement you may have with Fiat.. or any workman's unions you may or may not want to know who does what. and please tell me where and how everything is built in one room, how the carbon fiber is baked in a maserati factory, with people in maserati garb, and only maserati name tags (not to mention Maserati's are painted in Maranello heh) so the Russian can be right about his mantra that Alfa didnt "build" the 8C... rofl Russian youre a joke, and the people who follow you I feel sympathy for.

What's sad is we've had this same argument (if you can even call it that) about? .. 20 times. always leading to the pics Im now going to show you.....again. which basically shut you up for awhile until you try and "fool" the latest readers.

The development of the 8C chassis by Alfa Romeo.

The development of the 8C body and design by Centro Stilo (Alfa Romeo)

Wind tunnel testing...By Alfa Romeo.

You've always thrown around the blanket statements, "its a maserati engine, it's build by Maserati", you did it in this THREAD! which i responded to.. Show me the word Ferrari in your first post in this thread? You had to be called on it....again.

Thats the blanket statements you try and further your mantra but really couldnt apply to any current carmaker today. Meaning, you'd be hard-pressed to find one car company whom builds and constructs every component on their car... If you start to look at who exactly creates and develops things like suspension systems, (Delphi anyone?) chassis, etc. you'll see very fancy names of companies which specialize in science and innovations of design and architecture of things like metal, complex pressings, etc. Oh wait accept for your precious BMW..we know.. its all bespoke.

Under your logic, I can take and Audi RS4, stick the VW badges on it and claim that VW just built an ultra fast Passat????

That analogy made no sense, (as the pictures above prove, this car was developed by Alfa Romeo, not just badges, youve been told this 20 times) so no your analogy would not fall under anything I find logical. but thanks for trying.

(the engines are assembled in Maranello by Ferrari, I know, I've been to the factory.)

Something we all know...thanks.

The Ferrari production line in Maranello only builds Ferraris.

So, the Ferrari production line only build Ferrari's? haha wow. thanks for this clarity.

I think what you meant (wrongly), "the production line in Maranello only builds Ferrari's", then of course you'd be wrong. Again. But you went on your Challange Pass, you should know this. You just prove your ignorance time and time again.. So you've walked through the factory, and you still don't know what you're talking about.. how surprising.

So who REALLY should get credit for BUILDING any car in today's market? The tons and tons of men and women who build the cars "parts"? How about the tons and tons of men and women who put the pieces together? How about the designer who originally penned the "concept". Guess what, like most if not all cars which have ever been built, it goes to whoever the parent company or bank who paid for the cars to be built in the first place, decides, i.e Fiat, who has facilitated the money to Alfa Romeo to develop this car... The end. go away.

you're a proven Alfa hater, troll, who only posts negative things about Alfa to incite a reaction..

youve gone from annoying, to boring to outright offensive by referring to Alfa enthusiasts on this board as terrorists, as you have in the past.. even after being told by a few members they found it offensive.

 

[RussianM3_dude]

Calm, down there, don't want to pop a vein in the eyeball.

All you showed in the pics is the Centro Stile designing the car. I KNOW they designed it.
So you MR. Krinkle, have this inside knowledge, that Alfa technicians are dressed up as Maserati techs, smuggled to the factory along with Alfa build V8s, that are then re-assembled to make it look like they are Maserati engines..... Any more conspiracy theories? 9/11 was caused by the goverment? Nobody landed on the Moon?

 

[RussianM3_dude]

Alfa 8C Competizione | evo News | News | evo


First Drive: 2009 Alfa Romeo 8C Competizione

Quote


When faced with building 1,000 cars that bear no relation to anything already in your store cupboard, you can't simply start from scratch. You have to knock on a few doors. Given that Alfa Romeo now has overall control of Maserati, the door that opened widest was the one with a large trident on its front.

It would be hard indeed to underestimate the contribution that Maserati has made to the 8C. The floor is borrowed from a Quattroporte, then cut and shut to suit the 8C's wheelbase and adapted to Maserati's double-wishbone independent suspension. The engine is the Maserati V8, its displacement increased from 4.2 to 4.7 liters, presently a specification that is unique to the 8C for now but will soon be found in Maseratis as well. It's matched with the six-speed automated sequential manual transmission that came with the first version of the Maserati Quattroporte.

The whole thing is assembled not in Alfa Romeo's Turin, but instead at the Maserati factory in Modena. Which is why when you need your 8C Competizione serviced, it is to a Maserati dealer that you will drive.

 

[TorW]

The whole thing is assembled not in Alfa Romeo's Turin, but instead at the Maserati factory in Modena. Which is why when you need your 8C Competizione serviced, it is to a Maserati dealer that you will drive.

Apart from the facts everybody already know abouot, what are you trying to say? What is the point? What are you trying to teach us or tell us?

When someone points at the moon and says "Look!", there is always another meaning in it other than just a statement of the obvious "The moon is up there".

You remind me of a colleague of mine who drives a squeaky 5-series. He have never bothered to tell me why he thinks BMW is such a great marque, but he spends a lot of energy on what a terrible piece of junk my beat up 164 TS is. I agree, of course, because it IS a terrible piece of junk, but he's still annoying. His words are all negative statements. He's got no real argument or hints of an underlying car enjoyment philosophy or respect for people. I prodded him for tech specs and chit-chat on the Alpina B9 (which I think is a beautiful car), but still he managed to turn the conversation into annoying Alfa-bashing. The local bimmer boys are to a large extent much the same.

Your pointless negativity, arrogance and tireless bashing of fellow car enthusiasts annoys me to no end.

So please tell us why you're here. I'm curious. And leave the words "Modena" and "Maserati" out of your reply. We already know those things.