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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I;ve been looking for one for a while now - I;ve done a lot of posting on 164 forum and a bit on GT , having just finished motor and trans on the GTV. So anyway I found this spider on craigslist and bought it sight unseen. I find that what I thought was a minimal rust car (had been stored indoors for 10+ years) is actually pretty bad. See photos.

Heres a partial list of whats bad
1. Wrong motor -- has a later 2L that is the dirtiest motor I;ve seen
2. Brakes frozen
3. Clutch frozen (prob stuck in bellhousing)
3. missing misc parts (wipers, headlight buckets, door cars and interior handles, ext door handle, trunk release assembly, pass headrest, tonneau cover, etc etc)
4. Unknown trans and differential except known that they both leak and are absolutely filthy!
5. Frame / suspension has surface rust everywhere
6. Every rubber part is bad. Every one. Suspension, body, etc Except trunk seal -- it seals!
7. Seats ripped.
8. Folding top hardware worn and rusting in some spots, missing some pivot pins/bolts
9. Carpet obviously no good
10. Fuel system unknown but assume tank has to come out and get boiled, unsure about fuel pump/lines etc.
11. Body tub. Rusted out. Not sure about the frame below it but could have rust too
12. Pass side A arm mounting in fender-- missing the wheel well guard there. Could be really bad in there, I cleaned out three handfuls of sand and am sure I didn't get it all.

The Good
1. new canvas top
2. Brightwork good and I think its all present except headlight rings
3. Body looks pretty straight
4. Dash has only two small cracks
5. Instruments seem complete except for water gauge, later model installed but original is in the trunk
6. Glass good
7. Doors look decent on the inside , regulators work
8. Trunk in good shape except for small rust thru in spare wheel well


After seeing the damage to the tub and realizing the magnitude of what I am up against, I am wondering if this car is worth saving (for me) or should I part it/sell it as is, etc and take my lumps? If I do it 'on the cheap' I think I can have it as a decent driver for 16K or so, not including paint (8 for body and frame clean up, 3 for motor, 2 for trans, 3 for interior/brakes, misc stuff). Add paint that's another 5K minimum. For a really good resto job (not concourse) add another 6 to 8 K.

I figure its 3K so far, 16 plus paint for decent = 24K
for really good lets call it 30-32K

I'm not sure what the 'bare minimum' would be to make it a reliable driver. I would have to do everything and I am not good at sheet metal work or welding really -- would have to learn 'on the job'. Seat pans and a ton of sweat labor plus motor/trans, brakes interior, etc -- maybe 7K ? add paint and its 12 + my 3 already in it. 15K and I get to do only the minimum to make this a runner and cosmetics come later. If I later decide to 'do it properly' much of this work would need to be repeated by a pro. Oh yeah needs new tires in both cases!

Thoughts? I can probably find a really nice one for ?25k? and not hassle with it. When I bought it, I was thinking 10K would get me to 'decent' -- man was I way off!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
few more -- I really like the bullhorns on front!

a few more before I go back out and get some more of the underside (if I can)
 

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Yikes! I've seen near-mint S2s go for ~$20k, so you can definitely save some money by going that route. That said, there's definitely value in building one up yourself, where you know what's done and what's not.

For me, that rust looks terminal. Definitely a full strip and rotisserie job, at which point you may as well replace everything a do a full-on restoration. Given that you're not an experienced welder or bodyman, that seems like an expensive endeavor.

Not to sway you either way, but if you do choose to part it, please PM me. I need a few things.
 

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Depends on what you want. I'd explore the local area for votech programs in high schools or other, that could do the body work for a greatly reduced rate in exchange for the training. From reading your adventures with the GTV I imagine the mech stuff you have well at hand.

I personally don't want something I have to fix rust on. I get nothing from that process. A bit of surface rust underneath and so on is cool, major body rust? I'll pass. Again it depends on what you want. This will be interesting. Ciao, chris
 
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The S2's are nice cars, so will you really be happy just welding patches over area you know will rust out again? The sills look at risk. Where do you start, and where do you stop.

It'll take 20k to 35k to bring it to excellent status. Are you in for that?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
and a few more to boot!

Posting all this so everyone sees what a rusty S2 looks like!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
and a few more to boot!

Posting all this so everyone sees what a rusty S2 looks like!!
 

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Well, as they say, "it ain't pretty". Trust me, I know. I'm part way through a complete restoration on another '71 S2, that looked remarkably similar to yours before we got started. Satisfying in the long run? Yes. Financially viable? Probably not.

As another guy said, if you decide to part out rather than restore, please contact me; there's some things I need.

/Gene
 

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Sounds like your committed, I understand. You're like me, no such thing as an Alfa that should not be restored. Good news, your'e in San Diego away from the coast. Rust never sleeps, but has certainly slowed. I have a 74 in nearby Carlsbad, let me if I can help, l sent you a PM. Great color!
 

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When you asked me about "goat horns" I was wondering, what the... is he talking about? But now that I've seen the pictures it's pretty obvious what you were talking about lol.

We all know you didn't get into this to make money and honestly there aren't that many really nice S2's out there that are for sale, in fact I rarely see any. I do see some that have been prettied up some and going for a lot of money but nothing outstanding. Buying any 45 year old car, no matter how nice it looks is gonna be a crap shoot.

Here's my take on the pictures:

Not as bad as you might be thinking. The floor pans can be completely replaced and when they are out it's easy to fix any rust in the underlying semi-frame structures. The only killer here is going to be the rockers and frankly they don't look bad but you're going to have to get medieval on them with an awl or sharp scribe to be sure. If they are solid, and there's a good chance they are because the floor pans are dishes that almost act as sacrificial components, then you have a good base to work with. If the rockers are rusted or partially destroyed then it's a whole different ball game.

So my advice, given good rockers is to take this goat by the horns!
 
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I just have one question here: Did you discuss this with your therapist before you bought this...sight unseen, no less?

You've made a real mistake..actually, a number of real mistakes. The best way of dealing with multiple, real mistakes is to recognize that and not make any more. Unless you are a glutton for punishment or actually enjoy that sort of thing, forget it.

Donate the car, take the tax break...part it out here to help other lost souls, donate it to a local high school....and call your psychologist before doing something like this again..actually, call him as soon as the germ of the idea sprouts inside so he can kill it immediately.

:grin2:
 

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Bah. If you don't want to do the whole resto then patch the floors, treat any surface rust you can find, then clean up the interior and drive the thing.

This is a '71 Spider, people! It's worth saving, and is by no means terminal from what I can see in the pics.

Best of luck,
Jason
 

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I have to agree, it doesn't look terminal to me, at least body-wise. The sills "seem" intact; the stuff you've circled looks like surface rust that accumulated under the rubber matting. The ends of the sills (inside wheelarch) look OK, and the seam on outside, below front edge of door, looks correct (not Bondo'd over)... but further exploration is called for, and in my book, this is the go/no go area. If sills are rotten / coated with Bondo, then that can sway your decisions, as replacing them is a total b*ll-ache.

By the way, no 'frame' to speak of - the body IS the frame (other than welded channels underneath it.)

You haven't mentioned much about the engine - is the Spica fuel injection still intact ? I see airbox is missing. If Spica is intact, it is probably gummed up and out of adjustment, and therefore in need of a re-build - $1000 to $1500 at the one and only specialist, just for the pump.
'71 has rarity value, but with non-original 2000CC engine.....not as much value.

Those front overriders have got to go, job 1.

The rest - well, it takes going through each element, system by system (brakes, clutch, suspension, electrics) before you get cranking on the cosmetics. I'd take a deep breath, and make sure the bodywork is sound before proceeding.

I've seen much, much worse, believe me !!
 

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My vote is KEEP IT! You have a nice GTV to drive while you slowly acquire the parts you need to get this one on the road again. It is already in your garage, it was once a fantastic car, and it can be again. You will have earned the immense satisfaction of nursing it back to health, which makes the eventual driving even more satisfying. You can even use it as an excuse to really get your welding skills honed. Consider yourself a savior, not the grim reaper.
 
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