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Discussion Starter #1
I've been thinking about this one a lot since I saw it earlier today:

Giuiia SS on eBay

I wanted to know what some of the experts here on the AlfaBB think. Some of my thoughts:
-- Beautiful car and seems to be well done by experts
-- Likely a GREAT driver
-- But value?? Is this really collectible? It seems like a half and half proposition -- the drivetrain is all that, but the body mods, while "tasteful" seem to spoil the collectibility. It seems to be reversible, but would you do that? (Spoiling the great work by the builders?) Don't get me wrong: I actually think the body modifications maybe make the car look better than original, but I don't know if I would invest big $ in this because the upside has to be limited.
-- The car is so clean and well done that it is no surprise the bidding is where it is at this point
Seems like the bidding has stalled just shy of $70k and I'll bet the mixed bag of collectible features keep it just about there. In my humble opinion, this is no six-figure car.

Discuss please!
 

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I think you answered many of your own questions. For what it is worth, I really like it as well, but not for an unaltered SS price. Buy it with the idea of a fun, attractive car you're going to use and enjoy. Not as an investment that remains garaged and covered. Unfortunately, it will be always be the target of criticism with SS purists.

Purchase it with the attitude that you want it and you couldn't care less what others may think. Tom Zat would love it.


-Doug
 

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As an owner of an SS, I'll just say I like the look of this car. The body work makes the car cleaner, maybe more racecar, less production car (for the record, I am a fan of the Zat cars). Especially the removal of the eyebrow on the front wheel arches. I don't like the flare on the rear fender wheel arches - they're puny and who the heck would run that wide of tires on the car.

If purchased, I can attest that 99% of people won't know what kind of car it is but will ask. The bodywork really won't matter.

The one area that I think hits this car hard is the interior, especially the seats. If the only mods were to the body I think people would be a bit more kind.

JMHO of course. At the right price (like about where its at) it'd be a great pick up as a hobby car. Maybe not so much for a show car. I'd bet even at an Alfa club meeting people would (mostly) approve as in person the lines on the SS cars are pretty hard to complain about.
 

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This car was at the Sonoma AROC convention last year, in pearl yellow, for sale. It then belonged to a Marinite, sold to LA, now for sale again. There isn't any actual Zat connection on this car as far as I know, other than inspiration, if you want to call it that.

Andrew
 

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giulia ss?

sorry, but i also think it's a Kim Karda-chiant'SS (french guys will understand).

Too bad for a SS.
 

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The difference between a real steel 1932 ford 5 window V8 coupe and the same car chopped and channeled with mustang steering rack, rolled and pleated interior and a small block Chevy? Both cars will bring the same money, but depending on what one collects, one may be more "collectable" to some than the other. Myself, I want this one.
Alfa Romeo Other Giulia Sprint Speciale 1600 | eBay
 

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But value?? Is this really collectible? It seems like a half and half proposition -- the drivetrain is all that, but the body mods, while "tasteful" seem to spoil the collectibility. It seems to be reversible, but...
It could be a fun driver and it will turn heads. But, you couldn't seriously show it and it won't appreciate like the cream SS currently on ebay. Reversing the mods might not be so easy; SS trim parts (like the bumpers) are pretty scarce.

Myself, I want this one. Alfa Romeo Other Giulia Sprint Speciale 1600 | eBay
It will be interesting to see what the two cars go for. I predict that the red "hot rod" will stall around $75K while the cream one could approach $200K. The cream car is really too nice to be on ebay; I would have thought that a reputable auction company, with a venue like Monterey, Amelia Island, or Scottsdale, would have been more appropriate.
 

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.... I would have thought that a reputable auction company, with a venue like Monterey, Amelia Island, or Scottsdale, would have been more appropriate.
I agree BUT.. a very good video production on the car can get it done for a lot less then the commission and hassle of dealing with the auction house bloodsuckers.. Can you tell I rank them right up there with the three least admired professions. It takes some ingenuity and effort more than putting a For Sale sign on it, at least, in most cases. Dover ID isn't exactly easy to get to. The big auctions are a convenience for buyers, not sellers. If you are going to use E-bay, on a piece this nice, I would have exhausted the grapevine first. Quiet sales get the job done when you are in record breaking territory.
 

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I think that this car is an improvement over the stock appearance, as nearly as I can tell from the photos. I am not a fan of the Sprint Speciale, however, so you can take my opinion to be misguided.
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Well, I have been hepped up over the red SS since yesterday, but this article I found on Petrolicious by Yoav Gilad sobered me up. I think I'll stick to my "non-special" Giuliettas and Giulias:

It is impossible to consider the Alfa Romeo Giulia (and Giulietta, whose appearance is the same) Sprint Speciale without mentioning Bertone’s BAT cars of the 1950s. Designed by Mr. Franco Scaglione as aerodynamic test vehicles, the Berlinetta Aerodinamica Technica 5, 7, and 9, were masterpieces of aerodynamic design—the BAT 7 somehow achieved a coefficient of drag of 0.19! But besides improving on the science of aerodynamics, the BAT cars also helped yield the Sprint Speciale.
The BATs were debuted every year from 1953 through ’55 at the Torino Auto Show to an amazed crowd. So it was fitting that the first prototype for the Sprint Speciale debuted there in 1957. While the production version took another two years it was clearly influenced by the more production-aimed BAT 9. And while the BAT series was fantastic, almost like fantasy-sketches in appearance, they were successful in one place where the Sprint Speciale failed. One of a few failures, in fact.
Proportionally, the Sprint Speciale has a traditional front-engine rear-wheel drive layout, as it should. Although, much like the Jaguar E-type it suffers a bit from very long overhangs (on the Jaguar they’re more successful however, as they’re rounded which gives them less visual mass). But the Alfa’s overhangs are squared off with a fairly blunt nose (much like Alfa’s earlier C52 ‘Disco Volante’) and Kamm-tail that helps to accentuate the overhangs, visually shrinking the car’s wheelbase.
Now, Scaglione’s BATs had fairly tight greenhouses in terms of tumble-home and height. But to say that they were tight would be a dramatic understatement. They more closely resemble modern cars in terms of the canopies’ packages than cars from the early 1950s. And while it might have been a bit claustrophobic, in appearance they were very successful. This is where the Sprint Speciale fails. Or succeeds depending on your perspective.
It has a light, tall, airy greenhouse that has great outward visibility. It also looks a bit tall and, coupled with the Alfa’s visually short wheelbase, a bit ungainly.
The stance is also a bit awkward because of those long overhangs combined with its skinny tires tucked into the body due to the body’s sectional curvature. The surfacing is obviously very organic and like most Italian cars of the era, masterful. But some of the surfaces at the rear are also a bit odd. If you consider it in profile, the Sprint Speciale suffers from a heavy-appearing rear. The first reason for this is that the bottom of the car, as you follow the line towards the back, accelerates up much more slowly than the top of the fender accelerates down giving the appearance of an Art Deco-era streamliner with a thoroughly modern front end. For a counterpoint consider the Jaguar XK-E once more. On the Jag, the bottom of the car rises to meet the shoulder at the back of the car rather than vice versa, lending it a fast, light feeling. Secondly, the center-line of the headlights is higher than the tail lights. It’s actually higher than any part of the back.
You can tell that Bertone tried to alleviate this by mounting the rear bumper in line with the scallop surrounding the front wheel-well and higher than the front bumper. Unfortunately, it doesn’t get the job done.
Regardless, the most impressive surfaces on the Sprint Speciale are the windshield and backlight. They’re so well integrated into the form of the roof and trunk (and almost the hood too) that it’s easy to understand how the car achieves such a low coefficient of drag (0.28). And styling aside, that is what this Alfa is all about.
Detailing is perfectly balanced, with badges breaking up the large front fenders along with the turn indicators. Accordingly, most brightwork is appropriately limited to the grille and tail. But the two most interesting details relate to the Sprint Speciale’s design brief. First, the clear, plastic wind deflector protruding from the back of the hood was necessary to channel air over the wipers (to keep them front lifting at higher speeds). And second is the door pull that was molded into the rear quarter panel to avoid adding an external pull (which would no doubt hurt the aerodynamics a bit and might increase weight).
There is no question that the Alfa Giulia Sprint Speciale is indeed special. It is indubitably an event wherever it goes. It has presence and looks like the flying saucer (Disco Volante) that may have inspired it. But it sacrificed too much for aerodynamics, namely its rear-end. I’d love to know how much raising the rear would have affected lift and drag.
 

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For every design there are critics.. I don't know how this guy self-anointed himself but he did. .... The surfacing is obviously very organic and like most Italian cars of the era, masterful. But some of the surfaces at the rear are also a bit odd. Organic? hmmmmmm?

I find it odd he has any persuasive influence any anyone.

He would probably say a Lockheed Super Connie would never get off the ground. Uncle

PS I wonder if he has designed anything beyond his signature
 

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Uncle....I agree completely. I don't mind differing opinions nor criticisms but something about the tone or attempt at highbrow nature of that article made me think the author was a bit of a tool (to co-opt a phrase from my teenage nephews).
 

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Better yet... VERY ITALIAN! I owned an SS some years ago that was a Giulietta version and had a blown engine. It was at AUSCA for an engine replacement, but sat unloved and abandoned by the owner for a couple of years. At a point, it became necessary to "dispose" of a cheater GTA engine that was actually built from an Autodelta 1750 prototype block. That engine with a 1600 single plug head went in the SS, and the car was mine, complete with new title.
This was a WONDERFUL car! It had the power it needed, drove well, stopped well, nothing not to like AND it caught peoples attention! I walked around that SS for years looking at the body, as I have with my 275GTB Ferrari, wondering exactly what it was that made it so interesting. I believe it has to do with the lack of any straight lines on the body. The whole thing, like my 275, was drawn with not a French Curve, but an Italian Curve, which if it existed, is much more femmine, (female body curves), something new and different from every possible angle.
I understand why some like and others dislike the body design. It took me some time to recognize how it could be underappreciated. Mine was red, but I once saw a black one. In daylight I walked around it for a long time looking at the body curves. Completely unique. Nothing like it. VERY ITALIAN!
 

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Better yet... VERY ITALIAN! I owned an SS some years ago that was a Giulietta version and had a blown engine. It was at AUSCA for an engine replacement, but sat unloved and abandoned by the owner for a couple of years. At a point, it became necessary to "dispose" of a cheater GTA engine that was actually built from an Autodelta 1750 prototype block. That engine with a 1600 single plug head went in the SS, and the car was mine, complete with new title.
This was a WONDERFUL car! It had the power it needed, drove well, stopped well, nothing not to like AND it caught peoples attention! I walked around that SS for years looking at the body, as I have with my 275GTB Ferrari, wondering exactly what it was that made it so interesting. I believe it has to do with the lack of any straight lines on the body. The whole thing, like my 275, was drawn with not a French Curve, but an Italian Curve, which if it existed, is much more femmine, (female body curves), something new and different from every possible angle.
I understand why some like and others dislike the body design. It took me some time to recognize how it could be underappreciated. Mine was red, but I once saw a black one. In daylight I walked around it for a long time looking at the body curves. Completely unique. Nothing like it. VERY ITALIAN!
That's probably the car Keith Hellon, who lived in my hood, gave me a ride in.
 

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Nice wasn't it?
 
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