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If you want modern suspension, get a modern rally car?
Milano uses suspension designed in early 70's. It's just not realistic to expect it to perform like modern rally suspension.

For road racing there are setups (e.g. RSR) that work well.

As for rallies, the front is pretty versatile, for gravel roads I would guess that you don't even need coilover's - just a soft adjustable front roll bar, but on other surfaces you would need adjustable coilovers, just like any modern rally car does.

On gravel, the rear suspension will always be handicapped against fully independent suspension, adjustable spring height and rollbars can't really compensate for the fact that both wheels are interconnected and will lose traction on bumpy roads.
 

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Discussion Starter · #23 ·
If you want modern suspension, get a modern rally car?
Milano uses suspension designed in early 70's. It's just not realistic to expect it to perform like modern rally suspension.

For road racing there are setups (e.g. RSR) that work well.

As for rallies, the front is pretty versatile, for gravel roads I would guess that you don't even need coilover's - just a soft adjustable front roll bar, but on other surfaces you would need adjustable coilovers, just like any modern rally car does.

On gravel, the rear suspension will always be handicapped against fully independent suspension, adjustable spring height and rollbars can't really compensate for the fact that both wheels are interconnected and will lose traction on bumpy roads.
So rsr is basically manditory for the t/a cars and yeah its true but even so many 70s cars were rally monsters hell the fiat 124 ripped it, and i dont see why an alfa cant, haha but seriously rsr sounds like a good company super pricy but worth it, i think the milano excels in unique places to say the least.
 

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So rsr is basically manditory for the t/a cars and yeah its true but even so many 70s cars were rally monsters hell the fiat 124 ripped it, and i dont see why an alfa cant, haha but seriously rsr sounds like a good company super pricy but worth it, i think the milano excels in unique places to say the least.
Keep in mind that in some countries Alfetta GT's, GTV's and 75's were championship leading cars in rallies (e.g. France, Italy, Australia). So at the time, transaxle cars were competitive, although not in B group, of course.
 

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As a friend of mine said the other day in relation to mods to the engine he is re-building for his 3 litre 75 Potenziata race car; the biggest and cheapest performance mod he can make is improving his driving skills. He can lop seconds off his lap times with nothing more than practise. His son, who is in his late 20s, is already three seconds faster than him. That is why my 22 year old son and I are starting out with the standard 3 litre engine tuned well, with some modest suspension mods. As our skills improve and we have the budget, we will go further. He will always be faster than me in the same car of course.
 
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So rsr is basically manditory for the t/a cars and yeah its true but even so many 70s cars were rally monsters hell the fiat 124 ripped it, and i dont see why an alfa cant, haha but seriously rsr sounds like a good company super pricy but worth it, i think the milano excels in unique places to say the least.
The Fiat 124 rally cars had independent rear suspension so they weren't ripping it with a clunky old beam axle. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
So rsr is basically manditory for the t/a cars and yeah its true but even so many 70s cars were rally monsters hell the fiat 124 ripped it, and i dont see why an alfa cant, haha but seriously rsr sounds like a good company super pricy but worth it, i think the milano excels in unique places to say the least.
The Fiat 124 rally cars had independent rear suspension so they weren't ripping it with a clunky old beam axle.
My point being alfa was supposed to be the sporting brand, and much better than what is essentially italys budget car company, im honestly losing faith in the alfas.
 

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Your Alfa is what you make it. You'll loose faith in it because you gave up on it [budget, unrealistic expectations, mechanical limitations, skills]. At some point you won't be able to push more from it and other cars will excel.

You could just mock the guys for sticking with the tiny market of parts [which suits most needs actually] or you could step up and pioneer some new ideas or develop better parts. I'd like to think I've developed some of my own solutions for problems that no one else has offered for sale before, but do remember, there are a lot of Alfa nuts out there who have wild cars but zero desire to chase internet fame points. A lot of things are out there that Google can't find you, or often hidden behind the language barrier.

Also, purist attitudes will stifle a lot from ever seeing the dim light of a computer screen... I can't stand purists but that's just about where you take your ideas, which forums you join and who you share your ideas with.
 

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"Also, purist attitudes will stifle a lot from ever seeing the dim light of a computer screen... I can't stand purists but that's just about where you take your ideas, which forums you join and who you share your ideas with"

Your comment is coming from a country where newer Alfas have been available, so perhaps not as much desire to maintain the marque in reasonable originality, but the purists have basically kept Alfa alive in the USA for the most part through the decades, esp since Alfa left in 95. We tend not to knock them as much here because they help to keep the cars running more or less as Alfa intended.

Many young guys today, since 95 at least in the US, don't have the same attitude toward the car, perhaps looking for a different thrill. Alfa may not be the car for them, whereas many 'purists' here try to keep what we have, in decent more or less original condition because, well, it's all we have.

At least, that's how I've tended to see it. Others may differ, and that's fine.

As well, of course, we do know what a computer screen is, lol.
 

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If people genuinely want to go out there and create something different, then it's time to either spend a lot of money or do a lot of learning, developing your understanding (that is a never ending task right there :nerd: ), skills, tools and equipment.
Start reading! And read book and articles about things that aren't about Alfa's, but could be applied to Alfa's.
If you don't like to read, then start liking to read.

Jazig has made some excellent points.

The best solutions for these cars are quite often custom made. If you don't know why something should be upgraded, then it's time to learn.
Adding relays to the headlights is a good example (of many!). But it's all custom work, because there's no real practical way for someone to make any sort of kit to sell.

It easy to bight off more than you can chew.
Starting something with great intentions and motivation, only to realise that it's a lot more work than first thought, it'll cost more money than first thought or that the results for the effort/money won't actually be what you first thought they'd be. When that happens, motivation and momentum can drop massively and progress grinds to a halt rather quickly................. :whistling:
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 ·
Your Alfa is what you make it. You'll loose faith in it because you gave up on it [budget, unrealistic expectations, mechanical limitations, skills]. At some point you won't be able to push more from it and other cars will excel.

You could just mock the guys for sticking with the tiny market of parts [which suits most needs actually] or you could step up and pioneer some new ideas or develop better parts. I'd like to think I've developed some of my own solutions for problems that no one else has offered for sale before, but do remember, there are a lot of Alfa nuts out there who have wild cars but zero desire to chase internet fame points. A lot of things are out there that Google can't find you, or often hidden behind the language barrier.

Also, purist attitudes will stifle a lot from ever seeing the dim light of a computer screen... I can't stand purists but that's just about where you take your ideas, which forums you join and who you share your ideas with.
A well written response that answers my frustrations, honestly i havent screwed around with the t/a cars but the spiders are always going to be one of my favourite cars by bar none, im currently looking into a way to turn a few ideas myself and others have had into fruition namely full poly bushings for a few cars, buuuut i really do think the milanos something im gonna have to think about deeply and i will trust me, i dont have enough fab equipt at my current shop but i hope to come up with something. Thanks man. Peace, oh and trust me i piss off aloooooot of purist in any car group...
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
"Also, purist attitudes will stifle a lot from ever seeing the dim light of a computer screen... I can't stand purists but that's just about where you take your ideas, which forums you join and who you share your ideas with"

Your comment is coming from a country where newer Alfas have been available, so perhaps not as much desire to maintain the marque in reasonable originality, but the purists have basically kept Alfa alive in the USA for the most part through the decades, esp since Alfa left in 95. We tend not to knock them as much here because they help to keep the cars running more or less as Alfa intended.

Many young guys today, since 95 at least in the US, don't have the same attitude toward the car, perhaps looking for a different thrill. Alfa may not be the car for them, whereas many 'purists' here try to keep what we have, in decent more or less original condition because, well, it's all we have.

At least, that's how I've tended to see it. Others may differ, and that's fine.

As well, of course, we do know what a computer screen is, lol.
Coming from a shop thats purist owned and purist supported i cant agree any more, the amount of time ive spent doing little things to preserve and restore to original condition speaks for itself, i even made an electroplate machine, because well if it was that way new by george who am i to argue, my own taste differ but if someone wants correct ill do it.
 

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I thought the 944 was just as weak.
As for full independent rear, that is what Alfa did when they raced.
It also gave a bit of rear turn in when the car leaned.
I would run the exhaust out the hood straight up.
as for a gear box I think the vett box might be the only way if you want to keep it in the back. Most seem to just go with a normal front box when making big power.

I have see the pics posted in the past. I would say look for them and copy what Alfa did.
ALFAGTV6.COM ? View topic - IRS setup with Transaxle?
Vehicle Auto part Car Muffler Rim

And some other stuff they did
Diagram
 

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I like pure... And the closer i get to it, the more grins i get behind the wheel... But i don't compete... Nothing is more fun than my Alfetta Sedan on a sunny, curvy, hilly, New Hampire road. Perfectly geared for the hills and curves, hungry to rev up the hills, and I cannot make it break free from traction. That 1.8 Euro loves making me smile.
 

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got mine to come loose this morning in the rear. Little opposite input and some feathering of the go pedal sorted him. The front was sticking like glue and doing exactly what I expected. I really want to get him on a track where I can really see what's what and what's stupid. I'm with Rob, I like the purity of what the factory put out with the subtle mods I've done. ciao jc
 
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