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Discussion Starter #1
While enjoying my allotted weekly hour with the Alfa last week I noticed some fuel leaking from the FISPA mechanical pump (dome top). Now I see why I must prime the carburetor every time I start the car.

So, after attempting to find a gasket kit with no success, I've settled on cutting my own gaskets out of paper gasket material. Is there a preferred type of gasket material (and/or pre-made gaskets that I've missed) for this application?
 

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Chad
If you're having fuel leakage from a mechanical FISPA pump ... you have a serious problem that should not be patched with a "Band-aid" repair.

If you are referring to leakage at the gasket between the pump body and the expansion dome cover - (part #1315.50.411/2 in the attached diagram ) - it is likely that the pump needs to be rebuilt or replaced.
The original materials used in these pumps for diaphragms and gaskets are not compatible with today's fuels. They all fail, sooner or later.

Viton seems to be the only flexible synthetic material available which can tolerate present fuel formulas.

PS - If you send out your pump for rebuilding ... In My Opinion - you want to stay away from Then and Now.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
GTD,

thank you for the tip. That's exactly the information I was looking for and I appreciate the help from the Alfa community. We'll see what the issue is when we get the pump apart. I fear as you do that it's the diaphragm, which if leaking could cause issues (gas in oil?). However, where I saw it leaking from appeared to be around a gasket on the side. In either case, probably a good time for a full rebuild thanks to our modern fuel additives.

I've seen recommendations on the BB for: FerrariParts.com and Antique Auto Parts Cellar. So, hopefully one of those works out and I can stay away from the vendor you've mentioned.
 

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Making Your Own Gaskets

When and if you need to make your own gasket, most parts stores (NAPA, Pep Boys, etc) sell a kit that contains an assortment of sheets of different type gasket material (cork, thin paper, thick paper, etc) for just a few bucks. The kit I bought decades ago has served me well numerous times over the years, and there is still plenty of gasket material remaining for future use. With scissors and a hole punch you can make any simple gasket in minutes!

Good luck with your fuel pump project.

OldAlfaGuy
 

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Discussion Starter #5
OldAlfaGuy,

thanks for the encouragement. I do have a small assortment of gasket material in my arsenal from old projects. I have had no issues cutting gaskets for all sorts of applications as long as it's from the proper material. So that is still an option on this(and my initail thought), if the diaphragm isn't an issue.
 

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Does anyone know if it is possble to find a repair kit for the Giulia 101Mechanical Fuel Pump and if so where?

I had a new one installed, giving some problems, and would like to revert to the original one.

Regards

A V
 

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Discussion Starter #7
AV,

not knowing the type of fuel pump your car has, I have found several suppliers who claim they are capable of rebuilding the pump, but only 2 which claim they can send me a rebuild kit or part of a kit for my SUP.80. They are as mentioned above:

FerrariParts.com (Ferrari Parts from PARTSOURCE)
and Antique Auto Parts Cellar, also known as Then and Now (Antique Auto Parts Cellar)

Per the Alfa Parts Manual, there are 3 pumps: SUP.60, SUP.80 and SUP.81 (which GTD has graciously posted and looks similar to the SUP.80).
 

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mach5rider

Many thanks for your reply. The pump is a SUP. 81, should have detailed this in my question.

Any experience with these rebuild kits, are they OK?

Best regards

A V
 

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Discussion Starter #9
AV,

I personally have no experience with the rebuild kit from either supplier, however, a fellow board member has had some positive experiences with "Then and Now" rebuild kits, so I ordered one based on his experience and their kit seems fairly complete compared to the other supplier mentioned. I just received it in the mail yesterday and hopefully will be able to get it installed in the next week or so.

Chad
 

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to avoid any confusion ...

The diagram posted above by mach5rider is a Sup 60. I call it a "tea kettle type" for obvious reasons. It was (originally) only used on the early normales and sedans. It was replaced by the FISPA Sup 80 sometime in 1957. These pumps are cylinder head-mounted and exhaust cam driven. As such, they are interchangeable.

Subsequent cars (both Giulietta and Giulias) used the FISPA Sup 81, 83, etc... These pumps are block mounted and are operated by a horizontal pin motion. They cannot interchange with the head-mounted pumps but have similar internal components.

Regarding rebuild kits ... the original diaphragms and gasket material used by FISPA does not survive today's fuel formulas. Any replacement part needs to be modern fuel tolerant.

My experience with Then and Now aka: Antique Auto Parts Cellar has been less than satisfactory.
 

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Since apparently the original Fispa diaphragms, and the Then and Now replacements are unsatisfactory for today's fuel, has anybody found a satisfactory replacement source?

I am trying to overhaul my SUP 81 pump.

Joe Bartusek
Michigan
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
Joe,

my experience so far has shown the following:

-Parts Source can deliver a diaphragm and fuel filter gauze (1315.50.411/4?)
-Then and Now can deliver a "rebuild kit" which contains check valves, springs, paper gaskets and diaprhagm. It looks nothing like the original equipment and mostly doesn't fit out of the box, but with assorted Viton O-Rings and copper gaskets from the parts store and some ingenuity can be made to work (for how long remains to be seen, but I've heard good reports from at least one Alfisti).
-the inlet and outlet threads on either side of the fuel pump can easily strip
-the sealing surfaces (including the "banjo" connection on the fuel line) must all be clean, 280 grit sandpaper seems to do nicely
 

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A while back a friend supplied me with membrane material from Germany that is resistant to modern fuels. With what I was supplied with I was just able to make a three layered membrane. I earlier had used another scrap to make an accelerator pump gasket for a Solex that is still running, 5-6 years now? There was some talk of acquiring more, but I don't think anything further transpired. I will look to see what the scraps are labeled with.
-Steve
 

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I purchased a kit from Then and Now. I have not used the pump yet because my car is a restoration project and a ways from complete. As Chad mentioned it looked nothing like the parts in the pump...after I called Then and Now and told them my concern.. they requested I send them my pump for a free rebuild.. This I did. We shall wait and see how it works.

btw, I leave for Italy next week to attend Auto e moto d' epoca in Padova. Cicognani will be there and I plan to buy parts from them. They now offer a "fuel filter rubber seal" for Fispa part#10040236. I plan to take a look at this seal and may buy one or two.

Todd
 

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I know there are concerns about ethan-crap causing issues especially in the marine business. I had my pump done by Tand N and it works ok. They returned the old valves so that is always a fall back position and the valves are pretty bulletproof. The two variables are the real issues I think... the diaphram and the valves. I don't know what George's isssue was with them but it seems to be ok in Stinky.... knock on wood.
 

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Hi divotandtralee,

I told Then and Now I wanted all my old pump parts returned....The pump is not that complicated to rebuild... just the parts looked different then the original parts and when I called them they suggested a free rebuild... sooo, off it went. I received it about 5-4 days later rebuilt with all the old parts.

best,
Todd
 

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btw, I leave for Italy next week to attend Auto e moto d' epoca in Padova. Cicognani will be there and I plan to buy parts from them. They now offer a "fuel filter rubber seal" for Fispa part#10040236. I plan to take a look at this seal and may buy one or two.

Todd
Todd,

Sorry for being a bit off topic, but on your trips to Padova market and possibly others, have you ever seen a left front fender for late 101 Sprint (1600) for sale? I need one, but haven´t found one for years now....and in case of yes, who sells or can fabricate them?
Dennis
 

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Hi Dennis,

No problem, I would guess that one could be found there... The meet is huge and with the dirty finger nail guys outside selling used scrap parts you could probably find almost anything!...This will be our 2nd year and from our friend who goes every year, he said last year was one of the best...I can look around for you and report back...Great swap meet.

After the Spider is done a Sprint is on my list!
 
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