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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hello everyone,

I have been asked if my car is a matching numbers Giulia Sprint GT Veloce. According to Mr. Fuzio at the Alfa Archives, it is an original Veloce. However, the engine number is the correct 536 designation, but it does not fall quite within the series for my year (engine approximately from Sept 1966, car was built in Mar 1967). Is it possible it is, in fact, a matching numbers car, or is it more likely that the car had the engine replaced with exactly what should have been in it if it had only been a few months older?

Any help would be appreciated. I'd like to get this right so I don't spread the wrong information.

Thank you!!!
 

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There's no specific documentation on the 105 series of which engine with which car, unless you have it written on a dealer invoice, owner's manual, or something like that. But the ID plates on the car, and the Alfa archives, don't list it. Engines were taken out of a pile and numbers are not exactly sequential with chassis numbers, but I wouldn't expect that big a variation in time. Others might know more.

Back in the day when these were real cars, no one worried about engine numbers and chassis numbers. Engine problem? Solve in the most expedient way, which might be another handy block or running engine.

Andrew
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Chuck is right about the car. It is the car in question and those are the numbers. Someone has mentioned that if I also have Weber 40DCOE27s on the car then it is likely correct and original. I'll check on those tomorrow.

Also, Andrew, you have an interesting point. Is it possible engines were just produced, placed somewhere, then installed in cars with seemingly no order?

It seems as though it would be difficult to both 100% prove or dis-prove whether or not it is the original drive train.

Again, as you said Andrew, not many people car about it, especially Alfa people. Probably for this reason. However, either way it does not matter to me, I just don't want to spread mis-information. The car has the correct drive train with only a 6 month-ish gap between engine and body production dates. If someone was able to swap in another engine and get it that close, I'm impressed.

To some people, this is a big deal. I am not one of those people. I just want to provide the most correct information I can to those interested in the car.

Thanks everyone for your help!
 

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I know that the Fusi info listing 102 chassis along with their engine numbers is incorrect. The earliest cars had "matching numbers", but then they diverged, and Alfa stopped listing the engine number on the data plate. Fusi's list makes it look like they tracked together into future years. Nope.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if a late 66 engine found its way into an early 67 car. The production planner certainly would plan to have engines on-hand as the chassis rolled down the production line, and engines would have been delivered to the assembly line in large lumps, not one at a time.
 

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It looks like your car sold on Ebay, so this may be moot as far as you're concerned, but for the record -again - and in case the new owner finds this thread, SKAI is the high-end German vinyl used by Alfa (and others) and "leather" is the color of that vinyl.

Your "leather Skai" interior material was vinyl, not leather.

Transportation - skai

Chuck
 

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For those of us that can remember back far enough the 1600's were not real reliable in the sense of having blown head gaskets, corroded blocks from not using antifreeze, spun mounting studs from soft blocks, thrown rods/spun bearings from lack of adequate oiling to the rear part of the crank. Some of the oiling issues came when the oil filter was changed and the bottom part that sealed the cartridge drop in filter would get tossed out. Then the oil pressure would drop. You could still drive the car but the results were not good as the oil would not pass through the filter and resulting loss in pressure.

If you still have the original block you are blessed. For us here in the USA, it isn't much of a matter as long as it came from the correct period. In Europe where they have ASI standards, to get a gold certification, the original engine is very important.

To add to the comment about building engines, there were two separate parts to the factory, the foundry and the assembly line. The engines were built, tested and stock piled in a mounting fixture, in a warehouse. When the car came down the assembly line what ever was the next one in line is what got dropped in to the body. There are pictures of engines stacked to the ceiling from the factory that we have seen on here.
 

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On thre other hand,

My experience with 1600s, especially 105 types is quite different.
Very robust. Very rare to have a head gasket let go. Compared to the early 1300s, they would live a long happy life with normal maintenance.
Also, the electrical systems had few problems once the shift to Bosch came about.
I've driven my '64 Spider 50,000 miles since 1977 and maybe 75,000 miles on my '67 GTV bought in 1974.Great cars !
 

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Discussion Starter #12
How do the folks in Europe verify if it is the original engine or not? What other information is there besides the Fusi books and the Alfa Archives?
 

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I had a Giulia sedan that came from the original owner in Florence, Italy with all of the Italian paperwork.
Chassis number and engine number were listed on the documents.
Maybe some other countries do the same.
 
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