Alfa Romeo Forums banner

1 - 20 of 30 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hello everybody,

My name is Arda and I am from Turkey. I will start my studies in Mechanical Engineering this year in RWTH Aachen, Germany. I am a long time Bertone 105 series lover, I always watch youtube videos read some articles etc. But I have never went into details. There are hardly any Bertone Coupes in Turkey but recently I found a 1750 GTV 1970 in red (sorry for not knowing the italian name) and I am going to take look at it next week! This will be my first Alfa and Classic if I do end up buying it.

It has been my dream to own one of them since I was 15. Now that I found one in Turkey; I am looking to get some buying tips. I searched older threads and all but I found it hard to find good information since in my case I need specific information about one car. So I am not asking for a general buying advice for all 105 series. Although I found out that they are pretty similar between models.

To start with I don't even know where the chassis/engine numbers are located on the Alfa.

The seller didn't post any photos of the engine, or the luggage department which scares me to be honest. But the car overall looks good in my opinion. What do you guys think?

This is my first thread, I hope I didn't do anything wrong :/
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
293 Posts
First of all welcome to the forum Arda, you came to the right place for information! The chassis and engine numbers are highlighted on the attachted pictures. As far as the pictures of car, not a lot I think anyone can say about it. It looks good om the pictures though. It looks to me the car has an aftermarket suspension (a common upgrade), as it looks to me lower than stock, especially the back.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Hello Tim! I am so excited about the Alfa, this might be the only 1750 GTV in Turkey and I would be so lucky if it is a good one. I will try to take better pics of the car and have a better look at it next week. And maybe they will share even more details about the car.

I am trying to create a checklist about the things I need to check. I will take a look at the body to see if there are any excessive rust. I guess the engine engine bay and boot doesn't look good since they didn't post any pictures of those.

All the labels are in Italian, I guess the car was imported from Italy. Should I be worried if it had any accidents etc? Is there way to check up on this?

The chassis and engine numbers are highlighted on the attachted pictures.
I don't get what you mean by that :( Where is it highlighted?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
293 Posts
I forgot to add the images:hammer: I can't seem to add two at a time on the ipad, so the other one is below this post.

Rust is definitely THE thing to check, the mechanicals are retively inexpensive to sort out or have someone sort it out for you. The missing pictures could indeed hide something, but that could also not be the case... You will know for sure when you've had a look yourself.

The car could very well be imported from Italy, although I think most of the stickers were in Italian for all cars. I'm sure someone else will confirm or deny that.

The factory has a service on the build data you can request. But since last year it's not free anymore and above all very slow. I don't know how you could know of any prior accident damage in Turkey apart from evidence on the car itself. But as you live there I guess you would know if and where it would be registered.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
411 Posts
Hello everybody,
The seller didn't post any photos of the engine, or the luggage department which scares me to be honest. But the car overall looks good in my opinion. What do you guys think?
What frightens you about the engine, or is it the luggage department?

From the images in your first thread, the car appears to be in good overall shape, at least someone is maintaining it cosmetically. Hopefully, they are also attending to the mechanical maintenance.

I was Istanbul last May to attend a wedding. We then took a one week vacation in Cappadocia. The owner of a bakery in the village we stayed in had a 1965 GT that was well maintained and very original. It was his dad's. He said that like his dad, he had alway ordered parts for this car from a parts dealer in Italy. He said it took at least eight weeks to arrive after he placed an order. I showed him the Classic Alfa website, he ordered a couple of parts from them, and he said that they arrived in seven days.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
What frightens you about the engine, or is it the luggage department?
The mechanical condition frightens me because there are no pictures in that aspect.

From the images in your first thread, the car appears to be in good overall shape, at least someone is maintaining it cosmetically. Hopefully, they are also attending to the mechanical maintenance.
I hope so. I believe this car was privately owned in a garage before they sold it to this dealer. I will learn more about the car this week.

I would love to learn more about the 1750 GTV 1970 (I guess it is Series 2) models though. Are there any problems with them? any chronical issues? What will fail? What needs attention?

I was Istanbul last May to attend a wedding. We then took a one week vacation in Cappadocia. The owner of a bakery in the village we stayed in had a 1965 GT that was well maintained and very original. It was his dad's.
Wow it was a rare find! I have never seen one in Turkey. There are 3 of them on sale right now. And I think there are 2 other Coupes that are in private collections.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
146 Posts
The car looks great from the pictures. I guess why wouldn't you buy it - as has been suggested above things to look for would be rust in structure elements or poorly repaired crash damage. Other mechanical or electrical things can be fixed.

My experience of things to look for are electrical and things containing rubber, so wiper motor and linkage, blower fan and heater matrix, engine mounts, carb mounts, door and window seals, brake and clutch master cylinder, brake vacuum booster. Another area is the engine - does it sound good, any sign of burning oil (blue smoke), any sign of oil and coolant mixing.

Also check the gear change - if it crunches on up or downshifts, it may need rebuilding. When you drive it check for any whining noises from the rear axle.

Also check the gauges (speedo, rev, fuel, coolant, oil pressure) and dashboard lights work

Any problems with this stuff gives you room to bargain on price
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,752 Posts
If you take a test drive, don't judge the transmission until it gets warmed up. You'll find shifts are smoother when the oil is warm. Also, it is good not to rush gear changes.

The key is to be smooth with the clutch and shifter, and learn how to double-clutch and match engine revs when down shifting.

I suggest pausing for a fraction of a second between gears, as in the following example:
1. Shift out of first ...
2. Pause the shifter slightly between gears ... (a fraction of a second)
3. Finish the motion into second gear.

When you need to shift rapidly the pause is not necessary. In more than 50 years of driving Alfas, often at speed, I've never broken a tranny and always get long life out of clutches.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,344 Posts
Welcome! look inside the front wheel wells at the front and look for warped sheetmetal. I would take a tape measure and with the wheels straight ahead measure from the front center cap on the wheel to the center of the rear center cap on the rear wheel, do this on both sides. There will be a little difference just because this isn't a super accurate method simple because the front wheels might be turned slightly BUT it will tell you if the car has been bent if there is more than 10 mm difference. Look at the sheet metal on the boot floor. It should show no signs of being warped.
A magnet on the bodywork can tell you if there is a lot of plastic body filler.
If you can get under the car look for solid sheet metal.
Vintage Customs has a video on how to buy an Alfa which is worth looking at. It's for a Spider but that doesn't matter, it's all the same under the bodywork.


Lastly, price, are you are looking for a ready to go car or a car you would like to work on. I had an Alfa in college and loved every minute of it!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Great advices from everyone. Thank you so much!

Today I took my latest exam in highschool and I will hopefully see the Alfa tomorrow! I will now create a list of all the things you mentioned and I will try to check most of them.

The dealer is kinda strict though, I am not sure how they will react to my requests. We will see.

I will hopefully turn back with more photos, stay tuned!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,136 Posts
All of the comments here are very good, so pay attention! :) It's never a good idea to buy a car from photos alone so if you are serious about this car you really should go see it for yourself. Even better would be to have someone who works on European cars do a thorough inspection for you. I realize that Turkey probably doesn't have many Alfa mechanics (although I bet there are some) so, really, someone who works on Mercedes, BMW's, or other European cars will be able to give this car a thorough inspection. Buying a car you've always wanted is an exciting process, so having a knowledgeable third party cut through your romance and a good, hard look at the car can be a huge help. Good luck and keep us posted!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
293 Posts
The dealer is kinda strict though, I am not sure how they will react to my requests. We will see.
As long as they see you're serious, they shouldn't have any problem with any of your reasonable requests. Otherwise I would get suspicious...

Hope it is as good as it looks on the pictures!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Good luck! My first car was a 69 GTV in high school. I would check the floorboards where the driver seat attaches. It tends to rust there. Cheers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
With a bit of a delay, today I've seen the Alfa! Here are my first impressions:

- It sits low, really low. Aftermarket suspension, the dealer will ask the owner about more details.
- It looks as good as it looks on the pictures.
- I couldn't see any rust on the body, I checked most of the common rusting areas.
- The interior smelled petrol, it was kinda disturbing. Maybe it happens when the car stays in the same place for a long time?
- The interior is in pretty much perfect condition as seen in the pictures.
- The luggage department was restored. The carpets were just like new, I have photos to show that.
- The car didn't turn on because of the battery but the buttery wasn't plugged in before. That was odd, the dealer was also surprised.

Overall the car looks really solid, the dealer assured me that they will help me with all my requests. They said I can take the car to any mechanic too.

Here are the photos : imgur. com/a/1yGsp (I am not allowed to post links so here you go)


The car was in a really bad spot, so I couldn't take any wide angle pictures.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
293 Posts
Here's a clickable link for easier viewing: https://m.imgur.com/gallery/1yGsp

Happy to hear the car did not disappoint.

Did you get the engine number? As the valve cover to me looks like one from an Alfetta (anyone correct me if I'm wronf he).

On the petrol smell. Did the fillerneck have the rubber boot around it? If the car doesn't have it, or it's incorrectly installed, some petrol may have ended up in the trunk that may explain the smell.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
The engine bay looks odd to me. Attached is a photo of my MarkII 1750, which is what your car appears to be. You will see it looks quite different in places. The cam cover on your car is incorrect (like Scalino1300 said) and there should be twin brake servos in the engine bay. It looks like there have been some substantial changes in the engine bay and unless you know for sure what has been done to it (and why) you could be buying something that is not what it seems. Maybe that doesn't matter to you if it drives well. The fact it wouldn't start shows the dealer doesn't know the car or has not paid much attention to it (it should not be a surprise to him, especially if you gave him advanced warning you were coming).

Several warning signs IMO. Make sure you go in with your eyes open, and also make sure you have money available to fix issues unless you can work on the car yourself. One thing I have learned from my own experience - take a torch and shine it up into the wheel arches and look at the paint above the wheel under the wing. Mine had been "restored" but that area had just been blown over with paint which did not adhere properly and was flaking and rusting. I didn't look that far under the wheelarches when I inspected mine......
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
9 Posts
Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
I will definitely ask the owner about the engine. I enjoyed the car as I always do. It really is a beauty and the dealer assured me that it runs fine.

The battery let us down though. The dealer has 500 cars stored in a 6 story building and they normally trade bentleys and ferraris etc. so I wouldn't go hard on them because they didn't check the poor little Alfa properly. They plugged out the battery hoping it won't die that way, it didn't help I guess.

Did the fillerneck have the rubber boot around it? If the car doesn't have it, or it's incorrectly installed, some petrol may have ended up in the trunk that may explain the smell.
Sadly, I didn't check.

To be honest, I wanted to take a look at this one because it looked really clean and it was ~10k euro cheaper than those in Europe. In Turkey, car prices are normally a lot more expensive than the Europe which makes the price even more attractive. I will move to Germany in two months and if it wasn't that cheap I wouldn't bother.

My first impressions were positive but I am not really satisfied with it simply because the history of the car is so blank. I will try to contact the owner but I am quite sceptical about its history. I will probably start focusing on the European market again.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
778 Posts
The cam cover on your car is incorrect (like Scalino1300 said) and there should be twin brake servos in the engine bay. It looks like there have been some substantial changes in the engine bay and unless you know for sure what has been done to it (and why) you could be buying something that is not what it seems.
1970 was a first year for hanging pedals on LHD GTs, so a single break booster is correct on that car. Headliner is incorrect and interior stainless steel trim above the door and around rear quarter window is missing. I think B pillar trim is also missing. Seat upholstery should have basketweave pieces. As others noted cam cover and intake manifold does not look like from 1970 GTV. Otherwise car looks great, good luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
To be honest, I wanted to take a look at this one because it looked really clean and it was ~10k euro cheaper than those in Europe. In Turkey, car prices are normally a lot more expensive than the Europe which makes the price even more attractive. I will move to Germany in two months and if it wasn't that cheap I wouldn't bother.
I may sound cynical but good examples of these cars are worth good money. If it is cheap, there will be a reason for it. However, the most important thing with these cars is the condition of the bodywork. Repairing the body is very expensive compared to replacing mechanical components unless you have the skills to do the bodywork yourself. So if the body is in really good shape, it may be worth buying at that price. If it turns out you have an incorrect engine (or maybe it is just the wrong cam cover), you can always fix that later if you want. People change the engines on these cars a lot. But if the body is in bad shape you will need to start spending money soon....

FYI here is a thread with the engine identification marks so you can see what type of engine it has. It looks like it may not have a 1750 engine (which is what makes the 1750 desirable to many people) but you can find out for sure next time you go to see the car: http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/engine-repair-diagnostics-rebuilding/434497-105-series-engine-identification.html
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
138 Posts
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
Top