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Discussion Starter #1
How much heat should I expect from a Berlina Heater? I've put a 190 deg thermostat in to try to get more heat, but it produces pretty minimal heat.

Lets say at 25 deg F outside temp, should the heater have to run wide open to just barely take the chill off?
 

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Mine warms up pretty quick, and usually its on low, lets say 20-30 deg weather.
It might be that your heather core is clogged.

Giorgio
 

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In my experience 105/115 heaters do not crank out a lot of heat. Making sure the hoses and heater radiator are clear helps, as does having a working valve. The 105 metal valve's rubber bladder can swell closed, preventing any water from getting through, but I'm not sure what's inside a 115 plastic valve and if they have the same problems.
Andrew
 

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I have two spare Berlina heaters if you decide to try another one. None of my Eyetallian cars have put out much warm air except in the hottest days of summer when the entire cabin seems to radiate heat.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
RC,
Thanks, I've got a spare.
One disadvantage is you can't recirculate inside air, just heat up outside air.
I also suspect the core is an older inefficient design. My 164 core is roughly the same size. It really pumps out the heat.
 

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I've had good luck with 105/115 heaters being very warm except my current 69 Spider, but I can see the box is full of leaves so I have low expectations. Anyway, my Giulietta Sprint gave out almost no heat so I took the system apart, flushed out the core, checked flow through the heater valve, installed a new fan motor and made sure everything fit together tight so I am only getting air through the ducting that has been through the heater core and now, without even turning on the fan motor I get a lot of heat. I would take the hose off the valve and make sure you're getting a good flow of water when your heater control is where it is when you think it should be open, then make sure the cold air coming in isn't getting around the core by sealing up and cracks etc. Murphys law says the air will go around the core rather than through it given the opportunity. I hope this helps.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I had it apart a month or so ago. At that time I hooked the kitchen fauset up to the valve. There seemed to be a good flow of water through it. I think I'll check to make sure the valve is going wide open. The flappers seal tight at least with the heater box off the car. I'm not getting much heat out of it, so something's wrong.
 

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Are all the heaters the same from Spider to GTV to Berlina? My '69 Spider will light my socks on fire. My GTV will maybe produce enough heat to register a rise in temperature if it's not that cold outside. I am looking at a Berlina whose heater blower is inoperable at this time. None leak fluid so that is a good sign.

I did have my '69 heater serviced about 9 years but could not tell you what they did - except that it works. The nice thing about the '69 is that it has that little trap dorr to dump heat directly out of the box.
 

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Norm Riffle asked me to post this:

New replacement blower motors seem to come w/ squirrel cage fans as opposed to the older "propeller" type fan. The difference in airflow is dramatic.

I got mine from alfa Parts in Berkeley.
 

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berlina heater

Are all the heaters the same from Spider to GTV to Berlina? My '69 Spider will light my socks on fire. My GTV will maybe produce enough heat to register a rise in temperature if it's not that cold outside. I am looking at a Berlina whose heater blower is inoperable at this time. None leak fluid so that is a good sign.

I did have my '69 heater serviced about 9 years but could not tell you what they did - except that it works. The nice thing about the '69 is that it has that little trap dorr to dump heat directly out of the box.
1750/2000 Berlina and GTV heaters are basically the same, although piping to the core is different. Duetto heaters are simpler and similar to earlier Giulia GT's.

I ran a Berlina one winter in Quebec in sub zero weather. As long as I kept the holes in the floor covered, heat was pretty good. With 4 snow tires, a Berlina is actually a lot of fun to drive in snow.:D
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
I used to live in Montreal, but in those days I had a front wheel drive 1972 Fiat 128...not as much fun in the snow as a rear wheel drive. I had a 1959 Mercedes 220S that would do donuts in the snow.

Andrew...It would be nice to have more air volume, but the problem is the temperature of the air even at a lower flow rate.
 

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This is from Norm, who I'm posting for, not from me:

A 195 deg thermostat is pretty easy.
When was the last time you bled the air out of the cooling system.

New heater valve, removing the leaves or pine needles covering the core, having a radiator shop redo the core, new blower motor w/ a squirrel cage fan, have already been suggested.

What's going to have the most effect, depends on what most screwed up on your car.

The heater valve can be replace w/o removing the heater box but the other operations require that it be removed. Personally, I wouldn't want to go to that effort unless I was willing to spend the money to do it right. (i.e. heater core to rad shop, new blower motor and fan. new heater valve CAN be done later.)
If you've ever used that self seal temporary radiator stop leaking stuff I'd definitely do all that.

I assume in bellingham you'd like a heater that will "catch your socks on fire". Now you know how.

Or, do what you can afford and live w/ the results.
 

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I just saw a reference in one of the Giulietta Register newsletters comparing the output of a Giulietta heater to your aged aunt blowing gently on your knees. I don't think 105/115 heaters got a lot better than that.

It's not that big a deal on a 2000 Berlina to pull the heater out; get the console out of the way and out it comes without removing anything else, though working under/behind the dash is never exactly a vacation. Then, as Norm says, make sure you have a clear heater radiator, working valve, and strong fan motor. A higher thermostat will help, but I personally in Calif weather wouldn't change mine. Farther north, maybe.

You can also block off part of the radiator when it's cold to get the engine to run warmer. This was a normal thing on early Alfas, witness the aftermarket rubber flap winter grille covers you see on Italian ebay for Giulias, GTVs.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Thanks for the suggestions :)
Right now I'm in the midst of an electrical up grade including a Painless Wiring fuse box and relays everywhere. If I can get this figured out It should make quite an improvement in electrical reliability. I've had a number of electrical problems.

I've had the heater box out, so know what's involved. Not an easy job, but I've done worse. The upper left hand forward nut is the hardest, but I eventially got it. I cleaned out the leaves, etc. Like I said, the first thing I did was to install the 190deg thermostat. The valve worked when I tested it in the kitchen sink.

I'm thinking it might be an adjustment thing where the valve isn't going wide open.
 

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I don't know if anyone has suggested it yet, but you might try bypassing the heater valve entirely for a while and seeing what kind of heat you get. I think you can get one of those barbed brass adapters at a hardware store for a couple of bucks that would make it a simple operation.

As for a Giulietta heater being like warm breath from a human I can easily disprove that with a quick demonstration drive for anyone interested, and no, my car doesn't run hot or any nonsense. Last year on the coldest winter days when I was driving it to work it was uncomfortably warm with the fan on.
 

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Ok, I can now speak from experience: The heater on my '71 Berlina blows hot! It was 18 degrees here this morning and I had to turn the fan to the lower speed and eventually throttle back the heat. I don't know much about the car's history as I just got it but I noticed in a box with a bunch of parts was an empty box for the heater valve. I'm guessing the valve was replaced in the last five years and while they were at it, probably renewed the core. This would explain its performance.
 

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From much experience Alfa 105/115 heaters will blow lots of hot air. As noted you need a good heater valve and the core must be in good shape. The cores are brass so a radiator shop can "rod" them out to bring it back to top condition. On a related note the big brother, the 2600 also makes alot of heat, though it may be of interest to note when operating at freeway speeds in below freeazing tempertures, the air cleaner ram intake tube similar. to the one found on the 105, has an adjutable door/blind that must be closed or the cold ram air will keep the 2600 engine from getting up to full operating temperture, hence its heater never gets hot.
 

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Good point Rogerspeed, some things to check here are:-
*Is the engine actually reaching a good steady operating temp?
*Is the thermostat opening and giving good flow when open?
*Do both pipes to the heater core get hot? if only one does, is there and air lock or blockage?

Weather the fan blows strong or not there should still be heat coming into the car when in motion, just from the air passing thru,so I think its more of a heat than a blower problem here.

If this car is having its electrics rewired, have the engine cooling fan removed and fit an electric one while your at it (if you havn't already that is). The car will run more efficeintly and warm up quicker. I've been running mine for 12 months now with no fan at all:eek:, with no problems, I just have to keep a good eye on the temp when sitting in traffic. I know it not big and its not clever, but its not been a problem so far, before removing the fan, the stat' would rarely open although being a "good 'un", and the heater obviously took longer to get hot. I get toasted toes now, even in cold weather. One day i'll get round to fitting an electric fan to the rad. My blower only works on the higher speed, thats another little job that needs looking at.

PS, The engine is quieter when revved without the fan blades on too.
 
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