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1973 2000 GTV
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Discussion Starter #1
OK, so I've already found my rear fuel pump needs replaced on my 73' Spica GTV. However, centerline kicked my order out within a couple hours stating the pump they sell is out of stock. I really need to get this car running this week so I can begin the tear down to bare metal. Does anyone know a proper part number for a pump that can be used safely with the spica system? I've seen alot of discussions that the bosch pumps for later spiders will work and I've heard others say they produce too much pressure. Does anyone know a Bosch or other brand part number that i can source elsewhere in the US to have in a reasonable amount of time?
 

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As I mentioned in your other thread, this is the one Centerline was selling
If you search for any of the cars listed as compatible (possibly BMWs over there) you'll get a multitude of results.
Eg here:

Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk
 

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1973 2000 GTV
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Discussion Starter #3
As I mentioned in your other thread, this is the one Centerline was selling
If you search for any of the cars listed as compatible (possibly BMWs over there) you'll get a multitude of results.
Eg here:

Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk
Once again though, that pump is stated use for a later bosch injected spider. I have a 73 Spica GTV. Will that pump be suitable?
 

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My car is a 1968 1750 with a later 2000 spica engine. Two port pump.
I replaced the pump that came with the car (same style) with a new same spec with the ones I sent you. Engine is running fine with good measurements and no fuel supply issues. I also used a brand new in line fuel filter from Centerline at the same time.
There's also a second fuel filter at the front before the spica pump.
Make sure you renew all of them at the same time.



Sent from my GM1913 using Tapatalk
 

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Are you looking for a 3 port pump? If so I have a NOS 3 port pump. Let me know if that is what you need.

- Drew
 

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There’s a difference in just getting the car to run and achieving all of the original specs.

if your goal is just getting the car to drive from where it is parked to the location where it will be torn down for restoration, almost any Chinese knockoff of a 2-port L-Jet pump will get you there for about $50.

If your goal is to provide a long term pump solution that will be on-spec for both pressure and flow, that’s about a $150-$200 solution, and somewhat more installation time.
 

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1973 2000 GTV
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Discussion Starter #7
There’s a difference in just getting the car to run and achieving all of the original specs.

if your goal is just getting the car to drive from where it is parked to the location where it will be torn down for restoration, almost any Chinese knockoff of a 2-port L-Jet pump will get you there for about $50.

If your goal is to provide a long term pump solution that will be on-spec for both pressure and flow, that’s about a $150-$200 solution, and somewhat more installation time.
The car is being is restored where it sits. My only concern was as Wes Ingrams website specifies the Spica system is to be between 10-20 PSI. It appears around 17psi is preferred. But these late model bosch pumps do upwards up 50. Spruell recommends the pump with an additional regulator though I understand there’s a regulator at the injection pump. I’m not particularly concerned with the cost as much the time frame. I’d like to start disassembly this week and that’s not happening until I confirm the engine runs (or does not). I ordered a fuel pump from centerline just to be refunded several hours later due to being out of stock.
 

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The Spica pump does NOT have a built in regulator. However, some early cars have a regulator built into the main fuel filter assembly, which is mounted on the right, front inner wheel well.

So, the first step is to look at that fuel filter assembly. If it has two hoses, one in and one out, then it does NOT have a regulator. If it has three hoses, one from the tank, one to the Spica pump, and a third returning to the tank, then it DOES have a built in regulator.

I have not had the pleasure of dealing with the three-hose filter/regulator system, so my guidance there is limited. If you have the two-hose filter, then my recommendation is to fabricate a pump-regulator assembly and mount it at the rear in the original location. I posted some pics of my solution here on the BB.

Before you get confused by pressure specs on modern pumps, be forewarned that the question is related to both pressure and flow. You might find a pump rated at 50 psi, but when it is mated to a system that needs a high flow rate, the pressure could drop to 5 psi.

If you have a three hose filter/regulator, then we need to know it’s flow/pressure chart before choosing the pump. Much like with the two-hose filter-only system, a pump with a high pressure rating, but at a too-low flow rate, will result in insufficient pressure and/or flow through the Spica.

So... which filter assy do you have?
 

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1973 2000 GTV
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Discussion Starter #10
Are you looking for a 3 port pump? If so I have a NOS 3 port pump. Let me know if that is what you need.

- Drew
The Spica pump does NOT have a built in regulator. However, some early cars have a regulator built into the main fuel filter assembly, which is mounted on the right, front inner wheel well.

So, the first step is to look at that fuel filter assembly. If it has two hoses, one in and one out, then it does NOT have a regulator. If it has three hoses, one from the tank, one to the Spica pump, and a third returning to the tank, then it DOES have a built in regulator.

I have not had the pleasure of dealing with the three-hose filter/regulator system, so my guidance there is limited. If you have the two-hose filter, then my recommendation is to fabricate a pump-regulator assembly and mount it at the rear in the original location. I posted some pics of my solution here on the BB.

Before you get confused by pressure specs on modern pumps, be forewarned that the question is related to both pressure and flow. You might find a pump rated at 50 psi, but when it is mated to a system that needs a high flow rate, the pressure could drop to 5 psi.

If you have a three hose filter/regulator, then we need to know it’s flow/pressure chart before choosing the pump. Much like with the two-hose filter-only system, a pump with a high pressure rating, but at a too-low flow rate, will result in insufficient pressure and/or flow through the Spica.

So... which filter assy do you have?
The Spica pump does NOT have a built in regulator. However, some early cars have a regulator built into the main fuel filter assembly, which is mounted on the right, front inner wheel well.

So, the first step is to look at that fuel filter assembly. If it has two hoses, one in and one out, then it does NOT have a regulator. If it has three hoses, one from the tank, one to the Spica pump, and a third returning to the tank, then it DOES have a built in regulator.

I have not had the pleasure of dealing with the three-hose filter/regulator system, so my guidance there is limited. If you have the two-hose filter, then my recommendation is to fabricate a pump-regulator assembly and mount it at the rear in the original location. I posted some pics of my solution here on the BB.

Before you get confused by pressure specs on modern pumps, be forewarned that the question is related to both pressure and flow. You might find a pump rated at 50 psi, but when it is mated to a system that needs a high flow rate, the pressure could drop to 5 psi.

If you have a three hose filter/regulator, then we need to know it’s flow/pressure chart before choosing the pump. Much like with the two-hose filter-only system, a pump with a high pressure rating, but at a too-low flow rate, will result in insufficient pressure and/or flow through the Spica.

So... which filter assy do you have?
Hose into filter housing from tank, house out to Spica, and then another two hoses that are banjo bolted in for the return system
 

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Hose into filter housing from tank, house out to Spica, and then another two hoses that are banjo bolted in for the return system
Harry,

Andy seems certain that your filter housing in the three-hose type. That would probably be correct for a 1750, but as you said you've got a swapped-in 2000, it seems wise to double check what is actually under your hood, rather than assume it's still original.

However, your reply isn't clear. You've described FOUR hoses, which doesn't match anything we know about.

I'm speaking of ONLY the under-hood filter assembly. Does it have two or three hoses connected to it?

I am NOT asking how many hoses are connected to the Spica pump, or how they are attached. Some have two banjo-bolt connections, some have one banjo and one nipple, and my Montreal had two nipples (IIRC)
 

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Osso's picture above shows three hoses, and thus has an internal pressure release valve. I don't know the capacity of that release valve. It was intended to play nicely with the original pump, delivering more or less 15-17 psi to the Spica and dumping the overflow back to the tank.

When I do a replacement on a Spica main pump, I'm fond of using some version of the Bosch 044, which puts out a ton of pressure and flow. My experience with the L-Jet pump is that, while it can achieve the desired pressure, the flow required by the engine with its correctly-sized return orifice causes the pressure to drop lower than you'd like. Some people solder up the orifice and drill a smaller hole, which keeps the pressure up, but it also reduces the flow THROUGH the Spica, which reduces the cooling provided by the fuel. I'd rather keep the flow to the amount calculated by Alfa as being necessary to keep the Spica happy for a long time.

So - standing by for your report on your filter - or maybe a picture like Osso provided.
 

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That filter housing has a return checkvalve on the banjo fitting for the fuel to return to the tank in a over 15 lb pressure fault. That filter would go with the early 2 l F I fuel pump with 2 fittings. The later cars had a 3 line fuel pump with a built in pressure relief in it. With that pump the later fuel filters don't have a pressure relief on them. Good luck
 

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Ah, I get it. Like I said, I've not played with the in-filter regulator system. Four connections. One being a flow-through from the Spica and picking up any bypass from the filter, and continuing back to the tank. Nice system.

So, Harry, you were right. Four hoses. De sculpe.

I would recommend either an OE Bosch 044, or an Evil Energy clone. So long as the passages in the regulator assembly can handle the flow, you'll be good. After hooking it all up, I'd do a tee-fitting with pressure gauge in the feed line from the filter to the Spica and watch how the pressure behaves from idle up to high power. I actually have a rig that brings the gauge into the passenger area so I can drive along and confirm I've got good behavior at all power settings.

I've got a spare Evil Energy pump I bought to design my current kit around. I'd sell it for something less than I paid.
 

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1973 2000 GTV
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Discussion Starter #19
Harry,

Andy seems certain that your filter housing in the three-hose type. That would probably be correct for a 1750, but as you said you've got a swapped-in 2000, it seems wise to double check what is actually under your hood, rather than assume it's still original.

However, your reply isn't clear. You've described FOUR hoses, which doesn't match anything we know about.

I'm speaking of ONLY the under-hood filter assembly. Does it have two or three hoses connected to it?

I am NOT asking how many hoses are connected to the Spica pump, or how they are attached. Some have two banjo-bolt connections, some have one banjo and one nipple, and my Montreal had two nipples (IIRC)
1652026

1652028

I know the drawing is crude but am I high? Four hoses guys.Pump to filter, filter to Spica, spica return to filter, filter return to tank....
 

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Premium Member
1973 2000 GTV
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Discussion Starter #20
Harry,

Andy seems certain that your filter housing in the three-hose type. That would probably be correct for a 1750, but as you said you've got a swapped-in 2000, it seems wise to double check what is actually under your hood, rather than assume it's still original.

However, your reply isn't clear. You've described FOUR hoses, which doesn't match anything we know about.

I'm speaking of ONLY the under-hood filter assembly. Does it have two or three hoses connected to it?

I am NOT asking how many hoses are connected to the Spica pump, or how they are attached. Some have two banjo-bolt connections, some have one banjo and one nipple, and my Montreal had two nipples (IIRC)
P.S. it’s a 73’ 2000 GTV. Not swapped or anything, been in a garage since 89’ so no modifications or repairs of any sort since then. I’ve been an Alfa fan for life but this is legitimately my first hands on experience despite a life of euro car experience. Just trying to get some clarification of what fuel pump I can use as a replacement reliably without waiting for centerline to get theirs back in stock.
 
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