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Discussion Starter #122
Spanish GP Results:

1 F. Alonso Renault 1:26:21.759 10
2 M. Schumacher Ferrari + 18.502 8
3 G. Fisichella Renault + 23.951 6
4 F. Massa Ferrari + 29.859 5
5 K. Räikkönen McLaren + 56.875 4
6 J. Button Honda + 58.347 3
7 R. Barrichello Honda + 1 laps 2
8 N. Heidfeld BMW + 1 laps 1
9 M. Webber Williams + 1 laps
10 J. Trulli Toyota + 1 laps
11 N. Rosberg Williams + 1 laps
12 J. Villeneuve BMW + 1 laps
13 C. Klien Red Bull + 1 laps
14 D. Coulthard Red Bull + 1 laps
15 V. Liuzzi Scuderia Toro Rosso + 1 laps
16 T. Monteiro Midland F1 + 3 laps
17 T. Sato Super Aguri + 4 laps
Did not finish
18 C. Albers Midland F1 + 17 laps
19 S. Speed Scuderia Toro Rosso + 19 laps
20 R. Schumacher Toyota + 35 laps
21 JP. Montoya McLaren + 48 laps
22 F. Montagny Super Aguri + 55 laps

The Renault strategy worked to perfection, although to be fair it did not appear that Fisi held Michael up enough in the first segment to have changed the outcome. Alonso had the pace and the strategy and although Michael was within 9 seconds after the second stops it was clear he would not be able to close up so he turned it down and drove for second. It was clear once again that no one has the pace of Renault and Ferrari at the moment - Kimi never challenged and the Hondas were also well off the pace. A great drive by Alonso and a well-deserved victory.
 

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Discussion Starter #123
Interestingly enough Massa turned in the fastest lap of the race - here are the top 10:

Pos No Driver Team Lap Time Of Day Average Speed Time

1 6 Felipe Massa Ferrari 42 14:58:40 217.320 1:16.648

2 1 Fernando Alonso Renault 39 14:54:23 217.108 1:16.723

3 5 Michael Schumacher Ferrari 43 14:59:45 216.546 1:16.922

4 2 Giancarlo Fisichella Renault 38 14:53:27 216.094 1:17.083

5 3 Kimi Räikkönen McLaren-Mercedes 40 14:56:24 215.328 1:17.357

6 12 Jenson Button Honda 40 14:56:29 215.301 1:17.367

7 11 Rubens Barrichello Honda 40 14:56:35 215.212 1:17.399

8 10 Nico Rosberg Williams-Cosworth 51 15:12:00 213.935 1:17.861

9 14 David Coulthard Red Bull Racing 55 15:17:48 213.932 1:17.862

10 16 Nick Heidfeld Sauber-BMW 49 15:08:47 213.913 1:17.869
 

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alfa_164s said:
I don t understand what you mean. He is french canadian and was raised in Monaco, that is french also. So more french than english background.

When Michael has a good car he is the best driver around. When he has to think to catch up instead of keeping the lead, he lose everything and this is not he s only bad move. Everytime there is pressure, he collapses in his head
i am sorry but monaco is not french !

on another point of vew , i agree with the fact that more and more f1 teams
choose the pilots considering the impact on markets , renault wich has probably the best car nowdays has no french pilot , why , if alonzo win they
will sell cars to spanish people if a french guy win , no intrest , they already have sold cars to the french guys . THATs BUSINESS !

considering shum 's attitude in qualifying at monaco , your opinion please ?
 

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Monaco is independant but is more french that any other language, nationality or whatsoever. They speack french there, the streets name are french and they are part of ligue 1:D . if you need more info please read this on wikipedia.
Saying this was just to show that Villeneuve is NO english at all . Even if he is canadian. Canada is 2 languages and 2 different people leaving together.


Btw a big L for schumi Looser all the way.
 

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that's very nice of you to teach me where is monaco and what language they speack :)

regarde ma signature , fier ami canadien ,:) penses tu que j'ignore ce qu est monaco (j y suis allez trés régulierement !)
 

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schumi couillon , i agree , after such a career , he did that !

i would be able to understand ,if he was a young pilott , but it seems to me that now it would be possible for him to be fair and gentleman , surprising
isn't it ?
 

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I don't know guys... I'm not exeactly a Schmi fan, but given that we were not in the car... or his head for that matter... I think that it is very difficult to judge. We all know that he is a true competitor and that he knows that in order to have a chance at the World championships, he has to push very hard... and he is human after all, and is there for going to make mistakes. I feel that as hard as he has to push, he may very well went into that corner too hot. Regardless... should we give him the bennifit of the dout and call it an honest mistake... he should not be able to reap rewards by making a mistake and hindering everyone else. I feel he should be penalized. The stewards might want to implement some sort of rule that in order to take pole your car has to complete the session without causing delays.
 

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Villeneuve's comments on Schumi's antics

Villeneuve's comments on Michael's incident at Monaco today in qualifying from itv-f1.com:

Michael Schumacher’s claims that his miscue in the final moments of qualifying was accidental have not convinced all of his fellow drivers.

Soon after moving to the top of the timing charts the Ferrari driver ran wide at Rascasse and brought out the yellow flags, just as his key rivals were in the midst of their final flying laps.

Schumacher insisted he had simply made a mistake, but several of his competitors felt that explanation was stretching credulity.

Jacques Villeneuve, a nemesis of Schumacher’s since their notorious clash at Jerez in 1997, ridiculed the German’s pleas of innocence.

And while he maintained that Schumacher’s actions were intentional, Villeneuve said he couldn’t understand the logic behind them as they were bound to backfire.

“I hope it was deliberate, because if that was a mistake he should not even have an F1 superlicence,” JV told reporters.

“If you can make a mistake like that, you shouldn’t drive a race car. There’s no way you could make a mistake like that.

“It’s the kind of thing I couldn’t dream of doing myself.

“I don’t know what goes through your mind when you decide to do that, when you know that the rest of the world can see.

“I don’t understand it, it’s stupid. He didn’t need to do that, he’s a seven-times world champion, he was on pole position.

“Why do that? It’s only going to make him look bad.

“This is embarrassing. Embarrassing for a world champion. It would even be embarrassing for [Yuji] Ide [who had his superlicence removed earlier in the season].”

and Mark Webber:

Mark Webber was more circumspect in his comments, saying that only Schumacher would know whether he had blocked the track on purpose or not.

“I understand the second sector was well down,” Webber was quoted as saying by autosport.com.

“You could say he was trying very, very hard in the last sector, but it looks like there’s been two moves on the steering wheel from what I’ve heard.

“Obviously if it is intentional it is childish, isn’t it? It looks a bit tricky to be honest.

“Senna did some pretty wild things because he believed that was right. But will Michael sleep well tonight? Who knows?”

But Webber said that if Schumacher was found guilty of foul play the FIA should throw the book at him.

“If it’s deliberate it’s absolutely rubbish,” he said.

“It’s massively below the belt and if that’s the case he should definitely lose all his qualifying.”

Kimi & Juan:

“I don’t believe that he really had any problems,” Raikkonen was quoted as saying by Reuters.

Montoya added: “Was it really a mistake? I’m not so sure.”
 

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Once again Michael shows why he will never be regarded as one of the true greats along with the team of people he drives for. They have simply become cheats, no more no less. From the flexi rear wing in the last few races to todays blatant gamesmanship they have shown no they have no interest in any kind of sporting attitude. Don't anyone be fooled into thinking these people care a jot about the history of the badge they wear. Hopefully tommorow will see some justice done.
 

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Does anyone have a clip of the incident that they can post? The move must have looked blatently obvious for so many people to think it was on purpose. Like Villeneuve says... WHy would he do something like that on purpose??? There is no way he could gain by it.?.?
 

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Michael sent to back of grid

From www.itv-f1.com

Michael Schumacher has been sent to the back of the grid for Sunday’s Monaco Grand Prix.

The sensational ruling came at 10.45 pm local time following eight hours of deliberations by FIA-appointed stewards, who found Schumacher guilty of deliberately bringing his Ferrari to a stop in the dying minutes of qualifying.

The German’s actions immediately stoked a furore in the paddock, with rival teams and drivers alleging that they were designed to disrupt competitors’ final flying laps and prevent his own pace-setting time from being bettered.

After viewing video evidence, data traces supplied by Ferrari and testimonials from key members of the Italian squad, the stewards agreed that Schumacher’s actions were premeditated.

They therefore deleted all of Schumacher’s qualifying times, relegating him to 22nd and last place on the grid.

The stewards issued the following statement explaining their verdict.

“Having set a fast time in sector one, the driver lost time in sector two, arrived at turn 18 [Rascasse] at a speed little if any different from his previous fastest lap, and braked with such force that his front wheels locked up, requiring the driver to regain control of the car.

“The driver ultimately did so without hitting the barrier on the outside of turn 18.

“The engine of the car subsequently stalled, with the result that the car partially blocked the track.

“Having compared all relevant data, the stewards can find no justifiable reason for the driver to have braked with such undue, excessive and unusual pressure at this part of the circuit, and are therefore left with no alternative but to conclude that the driver deliberately stopped his car on the circuit in the last few minutes of qualifying, at a time at which he had thus far set the fastest lap time.

“The stewards accordingly directed that the qualifying times of Michael Schumacher be deleted.

“The effect of this is that he will start from the back of the grid.”

The stewards said Schumacher’s actions were in breach of Article 112 of F1’s sporting regulations and that the ruling was final and would not be subject to appeal.

Schumacher will share the final row of the grid with Ferrari team-mate Felipe Massa, who crashed out of the first knockout qualifying session.
 

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AllthingsZagato said:
Once again Michael shows why he will never be regarded as one of the true greats along with the team of people he drives for. They have simply become cheats, no more no less. From the flexi rear wing in the last few races to todays blatant gamesmanship they have shown no they have no interest in any kind of sporting attitude. Don't anyone be fooled into thinking these people care a jot about the history of the badge they wear. Hopefully tommorow will see some justice done.
Schumacher and these people created Ferrari's golden era and reestablished Ferrari's prestige.Like it or not.
Sorry i forgot it.F1's spirit of fair competition is Suzuka's 89 and 90 incidents.
 

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Discussion Starter #136
GTV116 said:
Schumacher and these people created Ferrari's golden era and reestablished Ferrari's prestige.Like it or not.
Sorry i forgot it.F1's spirit of fair competition is Suzuka's 89 and 90 incidents.
Exactly. Somehow Senna punting Prost off in 1990, which he admitted he did deliberately to secure the championship, is fine, but Michael is a villain for shunting and stalling and shouldn't be in F1. Coming from JV, the (slowly) moving chicane, makes it even more of a joke. If Ferrari does something, like ask Rubens to move over, it is a scandal, but when Renault order Fisi to pull over for Alonso on the radio for the entire world TV audience to hear it isn't a problem.

Regarding blocking and traffic, go to the official F1 site and read the selected driver quotes after qualification: 13 of the drivers interviewed say they were blocked or had problems with traffic (including Michael's stalled car). Somehow only Michael and Fisi are punished.

I, for one, have a hard time believing it was deliberate, simply because there was so little to gain. If the worst happens, Alonso gets the pole, Michael starts P2 and hopefully finishes there. So why deliberately stage a "fake" accident that will at best save 2 points and at worst wreck the car or, as it did, result in a DQ? The potential costs far outweigh the benefits, and Michael's strength has always been strategy. IMHO, this is F1 politics at its worst, nothing more, nothing less.

Now if Michael patiently waits in P22 for the leading Renault to come up to lap him and there is a "racing incident," that I will believe was deliberate!
 

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Discussion Starter #137
Ferrari’s Jean Todt expressed the team's displeasure at the stewards' findings, saying: “We totally disagree with it. Such a decision creates a very serious precedent, ruling out the possibility of driver error. Michael was on his final timed lap and he was trying to put his first place beyond doubt, as could be seen from the fact that his first split time was the best and could have seen him do another very good lap. With no real evidence, the stewards have assumed he is guilty."
 

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Just because of his reputation. If he would have been clean i don t think any will have suspicion. The commentators here were like "Ho what happen? Don t tell me he did it purposefully!"
 

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Okay... I saw the footage. Michaels line and speed through that double apex turn was just totally OFF! If he would have come in too hot, as he says he did, there is no way he would have been able to hug the inside of that section of the track at such a slow speed! He was way off the racing line... to the inside of it!!!! He would have pushed to the outside if he would have locked the fronts up! That was just strange. On purpose or not... it was right for him to be penalized for blocking traffic and prohibiting others from setting a fast lap.
 

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Re the Todt quote, what he fails to mention is that after sector 2 Michael was DOWN on his best time, he was not going to improve and would have known that Alonso, Weber, Fisichella and Raikonnen were on hot laps. It was not the difference between P1 & P2 but P1 and probably P5, with Alonso on pole that he was thinking of I suspect. Michael entered the corner at his usual speed, not way too fast and yet makes an incrdible mistake not matched by even the GP2 runners let alone another F1 driver.
As for re-establishing the 'golden era' for sure they brought incredible success back but think of;
Barichello being told to pull over in '02 on the last lap
The same happening to Salo for Irvines benefit in 99
Cynical holding up of Hakinnen by Schumacher to allow Irvine to win and stay in the championship in Malaysia '99
The 'oversize' barge boards to distract people from what was really being done again in '99
and course Villeneuve in '97.
Let us also not forget the the team is now an internationally run team, the days of the great Italians is long gone.
 
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