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What weight do you guys up north recommend using? I'd like to drive my 83 spider till there's snow on the ground then put it up for the season. Thanks!
Fall Oil Weight ???
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10W40 Castrol GTX is my choice.
The car should go into hibernation with fresh oil.
Good to lift the car off the ground, I support the rear axle and the front spring pans. That allows me to start and "run" the car. I also take the battery indoors.
TTFN Elio
The car should go into hibernation with fresh oil.
Good to lift the car off the ground, I support the rear axle and the front spring pans. That allows me to start and "run" the car. I also take the battery indoors.
TTFN Elio
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I agree, 'cept for the off the ground part.
I kinda like the thought of being able to drag the car out of the garage in the event of a fire or roof about to collapse (hey, we get a lot of snow here
) without having to worry about getting it back on the floor quickly and not destroying the undercarriage while at it.
If flatspotting the tires is the concern, mayhaps a set of beater tires and rims out of a junkyard would be handy for the storage period. (and give a really good excuse to have your nice wheels in the house on the kitchen table for cleaning and polishing all winter long )
I kinda like the thought of being able to drag the car out of the garage in the event of a fire or roof about to collapse (hey, we get a lot of snow here
) without having to worry about getting it back on the floor quickly and not destroying the undercarriage while at it.If flatspotting the tires is the concern, mayhaps a set of beater tires and rims out of a junkyard would be handy for the storage period. (and give a really good excuse to have your nice wheels in the house on the kitchen table for cleaning and polishing all winter long
)
1973 GTV, 1969 GTV, TR4 & 1969 Roadrunner (long gone), 1967 & 1969 Corvettes
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I don't agree with going with any 10w-40 oil. If you think 20w-50 is too thick, I'd go with 15w-40 Chevron Delo 400 - a much better oil than 10w-40 GTX IMO FWIW and of course, taking it easy until the engine is warmed up. And put the battery on a "Tender" which will not only keep it fully charged but will also extend its life 2x. I do agree with the Tifose on being able to move it around especially in the event of a fire or other diaster.
1973 GTV, 1969 GTV, TR4 & 1969 Roadrunner (long gone), 1967 & 1969 Corvettes
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7,178 Posts
I to was using dino 10w-40 for many years in another vehicle I had. Then all reports came out about the 10-40 having a spread of too many #'s and its use of too many VII (Viscosity Index Improvers) to achieve its function. The use of these is not good (I will be able to prove a link later today which will explain much better than I can do now). With the searches I did, the Delo 400 (or the DelVac 15w-40 and probably the Rotella 15w-40) seemed to be the best out there of all the 15w-40's.
While this isn't specifically the article I was referring to:
http://www.bmcno.org/techtip_motor_oil.htm
"10W-40 and 5W-30 require a lot of polymers (synthetics excluded) to achieve that range. The polymers can shear and burn, forming deposits that can cause ring sticking and other problems. This has caused problems in diesel engines, but fewer polymers are better for all engines. The wide viscosity range oils, in general, are more prone to viscosity and thermal breakdown due to the high polymer content. It is the oil that lubricates, not the additives. Oils that can do their job with the fewest additives are the best.
Very few manufactures recommend 10W-40 any more, and some threaten to void warranties if it is used. It was not included in this article for that reason. 20W-50 is the same 30 point spread, but because it starts with a heavier base it requires less viscosity index improvers (polymers) to do the job"
Here is another:
http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Oils1.html
10w-30 oil increases its viscosity at high temperatures by a factor of three, which requires a significant amount of these VII molecules. 10w-40 oil increases its high temperature viscosity by a factor of four, which requires even more even longer molecules. 20w-50, which sounds a lot like 10w-40, only increases its high temperature viscosity by a factor of two and a half, so it requires fewer of these molecules than even 10w-30. 15w-40 also increases its high temperature viscosity by about two and a half, so this oil is also substantially more stable than 10w-40. Most passenger car oils today use inexpensive VII molecules that break apart relatively easily. Conversely, most diesel engine oil VIIs are chosen from more expensive chemicals that are more shear stable, since an oil change in a large diesel is expected to last for 15,000 to 150,000 miles.
While this isn't specifically the article I was referring to:
http://www.bmcno.org/techtip_motor_oil.htm
"10W-40 and 5W-30 require a lot of polymers (synthetics excluded) to achieve that range. The polymers can shear and burn, forming deposits that can cause ring sticking and other problems. This has caused problems in diesel engines, but fewer polymers are better for all engines. The wide viscosity range oils, in general, are more prone to viscosity and thermal breakdown due to the high polymer content. It is the oil that lubricates, not the additives. Oils that can do their job with the fewest additives are the best.
Very few manufactures recommend 10W-40 any more, and some threaten to void warranties if it is used. It was not included in this article for that reason. 20W-50 is the same 30 point spread, but because it starts with a heavier base it requires less viscosity index improvers (polymers) to do the job"
Here is another:
http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Oils1.html
10w-30 oil increases its viscosity at high temperatures by a factor of three, which requires a significant amount of these VII molecules. 10w-40 oil increases its high temperature viscosity by a factor of four, which requires even more even longer molecules. 20w-50, which sounds a lot like 10w-40, only increases its high temperature viscosity by a factor of two and a half, so it requires fewer of these molecules than even 10w-30. 15w-40 also increases its high temperature viscosity by about two and a half, so this oil is also substantially more stable than 10w-40. Most passenger car oils today use inexpensive VII molecules that break apart relatively easily. Conversely, most diesel engine oil VIIs are chosen from more expensive chemicals that are more shear stable, since an oil change in a large diesel is expected to last for 15,000 to 150,000 miles.
1973 GTV, 1969 GTV, TR4 & 1969 Roadrunner (long gone), 1967 & 1969 Corvettes
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7,178 Posts
1973 GTV, 1969 GTV, TR4 & 1969 Roadrunner (long gone), 1967 & 1969 Corvettes
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7,178 Posts
Good stuff too -
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I don't have any difficulty with what lowmileage is recommending.
I was a controls engineer with Esso/Exxon and did instrument design for VI units and other lube processes. I also asked many, many questions of the PhD chemists that populated the worldwide lube research facility and engine testing areas where I worked.
What I learned is that the oil needs to flow and lube during startup. That is the most important issue.
Yes VI breaks down, but a typical "nothern" Alfista does 3 to 5K miles per year, so not likely an issue.
10W 30 can be light at engine operating temperatures, hence the preference for 10W 40.
15W 40 is good oil, but to my mind the 10 is "better" than 15 low end.
My factory manual for the 85 to 89 Spider lists recommended engine oils ;
SAE SE, API SF: Agip Sint 2000, SAE 10W50; IP Sintiax SAE 10W40; Shell, Super plus Motor Oil 10W50.
These oils are recommended for ambient temp of 0F to 104 F.
You will note ALL like the "10" for the reason I state.
For the nothern climate the 10W40 GTX is the oil, if you prefer 15W40, formulated for diesel service, that's OK too.
Main rules: use "good oil", change frequently, use good filter, put your car away to hibernate with NEW CLEAN oil.
Best regards, Elio
I was a controls engineer with Esso/Exxon and did instrument design for VI units and other lube processes. I also asked many, many questions of the PhD chemists that populated the worldwide lube research facility and engine testing areas where I worked.
What I learned is that the oil needs to flow and lube during startup. That is the most important issue.
Yes VI breaks down, but a typical "nothern" Alfista does 3 to 5K miles per year, so not likely an issue.
10W 30 can be light at engine operating temperatures, hence the preference for 10W 40.
15W 40 is good oil, but to my mind the 10 is "better" than 15 low end.
My factory manual for the 85 to 89 Spider lists recommended engine oils ;
SAE SE, API SF: Agip Sint 2000, SAE 10W50; IP Sintiax SAE 10W40; Shell, Super plus Motor Oil 10W50.
These oils are recommended for ambient temp of 0F to 104 F.
You will note ALL like the "10" for the reason I state.
For the nothern climate the 10W40 GTX is the oil, if you prefer 15W40, formulated for diesel service, that's OK too.
Main rules: use "good oil", change frequently, use good filter, put your car away to hibernate with NEW CLEAN oil.
Best regards, Elio
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Speaking of Agip... I saw some at a local WaWa convenient store/gas station. I don't remember off hand what grade it was, but thought it interesting that I even saw it here in the states.
I always used Castrol GTX 20W50, but switched to Shell Rotella 15W40 after reports of decreasing zinc in most dino oils, excepts a few like Rotella. It's been fine for me, but I'm in a much warmer climate, so O guess I don't need the 10....sometimes worried that the 40 is a little on the low side, but oil pressure actually seems better than with the Castol even in hot weather
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Good point Elio. I know its an old thread, but since this issue wont go away, might as well add to it......Most important thing in oil, as Elio stated, is something not seen discussed very much, and it is oil FLOW during COLD startup. Everything else is of secondary importance. A cold started engine receives as much wear as driving the car for 500 miles!!!!!!!
20w-50 is thicker, so flows slower during cold engine start up. Where the idea of "more protection" from a 20w-50 applies here is very hmmmmmmm, I dunno........
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