[rimouski]

Hey guys... I was out driving my Alfa and I heard this coming from my engine bay last night. I topped off the oil and it's still doing this:

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Specs: 1991 Alfa Romeo 164 v6 12v automatic transmission.

Also, the previous owner told me that he upgraded the cam at one point in time. I'm not sure how true this is and whether or not that piece of information makes a difference (I bought the car almost ten years ago, and never heard the noise before). Thanks again!

 

[Alfisto Steve]

Sounds like exhaust valve rocker arm chattering. I would pull front valve cover first and check valve clearances and inspect cam lobes for intake and exhaust for wear.

I set exhaust rocker arm clearances to .0.009". You need to be able to rotate engine clockwise with a 1 5/8" aka 41mm socket to rotate cams into position for heel of lobe to be against tappet face you are checking and adjusting.

Intake clearances should be 0.019" max and min 0.018" but I do go less as you have to remove cams to shim intakes.

You need a 11mm wrench for exhaust rocker jam nut and a small adjustable to adjust set screw as nobody hardly has factory tool for that.

If front cam settings to loose (cam to tappet clearances) rear cam probably will need setting/checking too and intake plenum has to come off first.

You say you added oil did you run engine low on oil? If so that coiuld cause lower end bearing noise and that will be more serious.

OBTW this is a 12v V6 engine not 8v.

 

[rimouski]

Thanks for the swift reply steve. Sorry, about that 8v bit... It's been a long day.

When I checked the oil today, the level was right in the middle of the two dots on the dip stick. Would that be considered low oil?

Also, I used a screwdriver as a stethoscope to check around to see where the noise was coming from, and it sounds like its coming from the rear portion of the engine. How hard is it to take off the intake plenum?

I'm going to get a quote from my mechanic who works on italian cars sometime in the next few days... If he wants too much then I might consider doing it myself.

Thanks for the help.

 

[Richard2]

Your oil level wouldn't cause that noise. It's ok. In addition to what Steve suggested, I'd also check the valve timing with the template just to be sure.

 

[SpiralArchitect]

That's a loud clatter. Mine did a little with one brand of oil I was using, I guess it got to thin when hot and that resulted in a lower oil pressure. Has the belt been changed? I remember years ago when the diesel ZX had a loud clatter like that and I warned my dad that the engine might skip time and valves would collide with the pistons. But then again the "what does the kid know?" attitude made him learn the hard way: engine rebuild when the engine did skip time and bent two valves.

 

[rimouski]

Thanks for the replies guys. I'm taking the car to the shop tomorrow... I'm hardly aggressive with anything that has an engine, but I figured "you know, this isn't just any ordinary car... I have a 3.0 Alfa v6 under the hood. Let's hear it" so I got on the freeway with a little too much zest (I guess) and started hearing this noise once I parked it back in the driveway.

I haven't driven it since that night in fear of making the problem any worse. Just to comment on your post spiral, I do my own oil changes and use Castrol 10w40. The timing belt was changed 5000 miles ago.

Hear's to hoping it's just an adjustment. I'll update you guys if anything interesting happens...

 

[SpiralArchitect]

I'm hardly aggressive with anything that has an engine, but I figured "you know, this isn't just any ordinary car... I have a 3.0 Alfa v6 under the hood. Let's hear it" so I got on the freeway with a little too much zest (I guess) and started hearing this noise once I parked it back in the driveway.

It's hard to resist isn't it? The 4C turbo also has a very unique, deep engine noise that sounds even better at high revs. Makes you turn down the radio to listen to the sound of it.

Yesterday I changed the air filter on mine and I'm still getting low boost. The day before I had a pinhole leak on the thermostat to radiator hose right where the clamp was. Indeed our cars are now about twenty years old and will show some signs of age. One last advice is to be wary of mechanics who aren't familiar with these sort of engines. I know I've seen a lot scratching their heads at mine.

 

[SpiralArchitect]

Oh, and about the oil: last week I was at the wrecker's and the guy next to me brought a cam from a seat ibiza fr (one of the most popular new hot hatches here,I don't like it) and all the cams were OK except the last one that was worn to half it's size. He also brought the hydraulic lifter with him. He reckons the oil that got to the lifter wasn't lifting it high enough so the cam kept hitting it.

 

[rimouski]

Ok guys. I got some new updates...

Just got off the phone with the mechanic. He told me that I have either a worn cam or that I have a bad cam follower. He wants to charge me a pretty penny to remove the intake plenum in order to have access to the rear of the engine (and that charge is just to have access to my valves, I don't think the cost includes either a replacement cam or follower).

Also, he told me that the valves in my car are non adjustable.....

Feel free to chime in, anyone...

 

[SpiralArchitect]

Ok guys. I got some new updates...

Just got off the phone with the mechanic. He told me that I have either a worn cam or that I have a bad cam follower. He wants to charge me a pretty penny to remove the intake plenum in order to have access to the rear of the engine (and that charge is just to have access to my valves, I don't think the cost includes either a replacement cam or follower).

Also, he told me that the valves in my car are non adjustable.....

Feel free to chime in, anyone...

Did he check anything at all? Is he aware this engine has hydraulic lifters?

You do know most common mechanics (at least in my area) don't get along with Alfas, right? Consult various mechanics before taking a decision if you can't do it at home.

 

[Alfisto Steve]

Exhaust valve rocker arms are adjustable with 11mm wrench and smaller adjustable one about 1/4" so find another mechanic - yourself!

As for front and rear cam covers yes you need some tools and more for the intake removal but not really to hard.

We can walk you through it.

Intake valves usually aren't the problem when you have valve chatter and yes you do need to remove cams to adjust intakes by replacing shim caps so some more tools needs which your mech sounds like he may not have if he is just a 4 banger Alfa engine guy.

 

[rimouski]

Just got off the phone with the mechanic today. Now he's telling me the problem is more serious than he thought. Originally he said the issue was a loose valve guide. Now he's telling me the engine is going to have to be rebuilt. He's quoting me $2500 parts and labor to install a used engine or something like $5000 to compleley rebuild the old one.

I think I should've bought a golf. :/