drive shaft? (milano/gtv6)

2546 Views 14 Replies 8 Participants Last post by alfaparticle, Nov 14, 2007

sh0rtlife

Discussion Starter · Nov 3, 2007

ok ive doen the searching but cant realy find anything..strange..

anyway i was wondering if anyone could walk me thru a driveshaft swap for getting rid of the stupid rubber joints and if there was anything bad from going this method.(i swear i kept seeing "chevy line swap")....as it stands i have to have the current driveshaft shortened by 20 inches.....soooooo if ive got to pay to have a line cut i might as well see what my otheer options are

give me the good the bad and the ugly

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

JoeCab

· #2 · Nov 3, 2007

sh0rtlife said:
soooooo if ive got to pay to have a line cut i might as well see what my otheer options are

give me the good the bad and the ugly

Well, as you know the Alfa transaxle setup is unique in that the driveshaft spins at engine speed all the time. This is the reason Alfa engineered 3 rubber flex discs into the setup - to dampen driveshaft vibrations caused by this design.

Over the years, various other options - such as traditional u-joints have been tried. The consensus was that even for all out race cars, the vibrations were too severe and the rubber flex discs had to be retained.

Now, I'm not saying eliminating the 3 flex discs CAN'T be done, just that up to this point is hasn't been done sucessfully.

Joe

sh0rtlife

Discussion Starter · #3 · Nov 3, 2007

realy no one has sucsessfully changed the setup with any lengthy results?

ooook...hopefully someone will speak up but either way.....

sooo if im stuck with the stock line..and im shortening it 20 inches is there anything special i need to know to tell the line shop for balanceing ect...do i need to re-balance the flywheel and clutch assy?

alfavirusnz

· #4 · Nov 3, 2007

Only thing you need to check is that yoke on shortened driveshaft is square. Driveshaft only needs to be balanced and can be balanced in its two parts. Key is that it is installed properly with everything as in line as you can get it.

Richard J
`65 Giulia Ti 1600, `69 GT Junior, `74 GTV 2000, `76 Alfetta GTV, `77 Alfetta GTV, `84 GTV6.

JoeCab

· #5 · Nov 3, 2007

sh0rtlife said:
realy no one has sucsessfully changed the setup with any lengthy results?

I know that both Alfa factory race teams and Tom Zat/Alfaheaven tried to change to traditional u-joints on their GTV/6 race cars but gave up because the vibrations were terrible.

Some very high HP GTV/6 race cars have eliminated the transaxle entirely and mounted a gearbox in the front, but that really isn't what you were after, is it?

Joe

sh0rtlife

Discussion Starter · #6 · Nov 3, 2007

ohh god no!!!...the thought of loseing the transaxle ...well to go that way i wouldnt have chosen to run alfa suspension and drive trane..im after that 50/50 balance and actualy love the alfa setup short of the rubberband drive shaft....by the sounds of it im stuck with em ...ive lived with worse designs on worse things

only 2 things i could ever think of changing on the gtv6/milano design is the rubberband drive shaft and the silly looking plenum...and maybe a 6th gear but it MUST be in transaxle form......

rcess

· #7 · Nov 3, 2007

Just curious; why do you have to shorten the drive shaft by 20 inches?

sh0rtlife

Discussion Starter · #8 · Nov 4, 2007

im cross breading a 58 lloyd with a milano...the end result should be fast nible small and a total blast to drive..hopeing for about 1800-2000lbs...obviously purists would love to hang me about now......the lloyd is 9 foot long bumper to bumper with ruffly a 8 foot wheel base EXACTLY 20 inches shorter than a milly...course i have some width issues but nothing some flares and a lil fender stretching wont fix

AR4me

· #9 · Nov 4, 2007

The 116 drive shaft and couplings are fine for most reasonable usages. If driven with some mechanical sympathy and consideration it does ok IMHO. Same thing with the engine - wait for it to warm up before giving it a workout.
Jes

sh0rtlife

Discussion Starter · #10 · Nov 4, 2007

ive had a great time with the gtv6..course i was the one who finished installing the rubber joints when i got it..so i dont need to worry about em LOL

whats your definition of mechanical sympathy?..im a fairly over agressive driver and love to stretch the legs of EVERYTHING i drive...and must admit i love the note's the 2.5 sings just befor the rev limiter kicks in requireing a shift

alfavirusnz

· #11 · Nov 4, 2007

As long as everything is lined up right and the rubber is in good condition the driveshaft is more than up to it for the power that a std 2.5 or 3.0 V6 puts out. The service life depends on setup(it pays to spend time on this) and perhaps climate. I also make it a service item to use rubber protectant/revitaliser to keep the rubber in good condition and will marinate a coupling in the stuff before installation for a couple of days. So far in 20 plus yrs of owning & working on 116`s (used to own a Euro wkshop) I haven`t had to replace a coupling I`ve installed and all my own cars see the redline. I`ve also chopped saloon driveshafts to fit coupes much the same as you are intending to do-no problem if executed correctly.

Richard J

`65 Giulia Ti 1600, `69 GT Junior, `74 GTV 2000,`76 Alfetta GTV, `77 Alfetta GTV, `84 GTV6.

Greg Gordon

· #12 · Nov 4, 2007

A 58' Lloyd with a Milano driveline. I guess you plan to challenge Vipers in the stoplight grand prix.

I don't know of anyone who has successfully eliminated all the Guibos in a Milano/GTV6 driveline. I really can't understand why you would want to anyways. They don't limit your power (because the transaxle is the limitation), they last a long time (certainly longer than U-joints from cars of that era), and they don't vibrate.

We put 200,000 miles on a set of USED Guibos, 20,000 of those were with a supercharger. If they are aligned correctly and you don't abuse them, they last.

Greg Gordon,
hiperformancestore

sh0rtlife

Discussion Starter · #13 · Nov 5, 2007 (Edited)

thats impresive info...on a previous forum all i heard was complaint after complaint about the rubber joints and figured it would just be wiser to eliminate them...guess i was WAY OFF

now if im loseing 20 inches of line i have to ask...the center uhh bearing? should i eliminate it or move its location or??????...as i see it 20 inches out of the rear drive shaft pretty much eliminates the rear shaft...2 coupleings and about 1 inch of shaft ROFL....just wondering if id be far better off just shortening the rear shaft or to move the center ?bearing? and take 10 out of each shaft?.............would be FAR easyer on me if that center support bearing stayed right where it was

id post up pic's of the lloyd project but im afraid it would cause a masive heart attack in the purist end of the forum...not planing on postin any pics till the milly setup is down sized and the lloyd is starting to mate to it.....stop light warrior(if i wanted to go in a straight line id have droped in a v8 and forgot about it....but the gtv6 showed me the joy of corners)..well yeah somewhat but i would LOVE to meet up with the local alfa club on a track day and see what it could realy do when done...planing on cageing most of the car anyway.....the milly will live on just it wont look like a milly....

as for balanceing the shafts should it be balanced as a single unit or each piece seperatly?....

also the center support are they still availible?...mine looks pretty hammered as the shaft is more or less sitting to the passenger side bottom of the car as in its not "centered"...yet all of the joints look great like they were replaced not long ago befor the car sat

See less See more

whitecar67

· #14 · Nov 13, 2007

I am new in ABB, BUT, I race a 76 Alfetta GT. I bought the car 4 years ago. The drive shaft had a U joint at the rear. I was told it was an Autodelta race part. I broke two (2) clutch input shafts trying to use it. I changed to the GTV6 shaft with trick donut stiffners from Larry JR at APE. No more broken shafts and it is not a rubber band. Next, balance everything together IF the drive line guy can do it. Mark everything and double check alignment on assembly. I turn 7500 to 8000 sometimes and it is pretty smooth.
Have a nice day. PW

alfaparticle

· #15 · Nov 14, 2007

Al Mitchell has a one piece carbon Fiber driveshaft in his EP GTV6 race car. It has been in for a season and I think that he is very happy with it. He went to great lengths to align the engine and transaxle before he installed it. Besides being much lighter, carbon fiber shafts have the advantage of not coming throught the floor of the car when they let go.
Ed Prytherch
79 Spider
2 x 88 Milano Verde's

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.