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Discussion Starter #1
My 78 Spider has some issues with the Weber carbs so I decided to go back with a Spica fuel injection pump recently, which I bought used off a running spider. Well, after days of setting it up by following manuals and such, but still having issues. So, I had the car towed down to a place called F & D Motorworks that specialized in Fiats and Alfas. To make the long story short, they told me that it will cost me $500 to make it run right. That's the bottom line!! They said, the settings were not correct and the fuel pump that a pinched in the fuel line and everything went in went in backwards. How can that be, I asked my self??? The car was running great until the Webers started to be almost impossible to deal with and no one here in town can or will work on them, so I had no choice but to converted back to the Spica setup. Now, do you guys think $500 is a fair price to pay?? The car is has faded silver paint and the body starting to have some bubbles at the rear fenders. Any feedback would greatly appreciate it.

Q-man
78 Alfa Romeo Spider
 

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It sounds like either they are REALLY good with Spica setup and charge according to what they know, not what they do or they want you to pay for them to research on how to do it. $500 , to me, seems very high for a job that can be done, with the knowledge and the proper tools, in less than an hour.
 

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Who re-installed the FI system?

It sounds as if the shop is planning on having to do everything all over again because they think the system was installed incorrectly. . . . Not just tuning the system. Shops really hate redoing a botched up job by an amateur mechanic, and in fact, I think some will turn the job down.

You may be able to recoup part of the cost by selling the weber setup, although if they weren't running right, you'd have to sell them as fixer-uppers. Weber setups are in pretty good demand.
 

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I think $500 is a real rip off. Considering
a totally rebuilt pump from Wes is about $800.

When I rebuilt my Spider, the injection had to
be reset correctly, and I let my old mechanic
take care of this cause he had the experience,
and correct tools. I think he charged me about
$150 to do this. He kept the car overnight, because
he told me he had to set up both cold and hot
adjustments. He also used an O2 sensor to get
the mixture correct.
It was really worth the money, cause the car ran
great!! Started evertime on the first try, and
idled perfect.

Now, seeing as you do not have a decent Alfa guy
near you, how about buying Wes's Spica book and
giving it another try? Im sure Wes could also
awnser any questions you have. Here's a link:

http://www.wesingram.com/

One more thing to consider is that you had problems
with the webers, and now you have problems with
the Spica, are you sure its not something else?

Good luck.
 

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Might be cheaper for you to fly Jim (PapaJam) up and have him do it than to let your garage guy. Plus have some good company for the weekend :D
 

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Discussion Starter #6
A friend of mine and my self did the installation. A friend of mine had done it a few times on his spider and thought it would be easy job. The shop F & D Motorworks supposely worked on Alfas & Fiats for over 30 years or so. They do have an attitude problem or just doesn't know how to interact with people. I've told them that $500 is way too much in the beginning of the converation. He said, that the $500 would cover parts & labor, meaning if the pump needs a rebuild, he would do it. He also said, that the car should better than it would before and he would have to reinstall everything that whoever f***ed before.

Thanks for all the great responses!! Anyone would like to see Mall of America and get a chance to work on a 78' Alfa let me know and we can work something out...
 

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Thanks for plug, Sarah.:p Although it would be nice to get get out of Jersey for a few days, I'll refer this one to Roadtrip - he's alot closer.
Then again, have it towed out here. That way, I could have an Alfa for a daily driver for a week or so (for testing purposes, of course).:D
 

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So, what is it that the car does, or doesn't do?
And Keven brings up a good point. Are the symptoms the same as when the carbs were on it?
What manuals did you use for the installation?
 

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Discussion Starter #9
It starts, but only if you have your foot on the gas pedal slightly and prepare to crank it over for about a minute or so. Also, to keep the engine running, you would have to play with the gas pedal. Oh, one last thing, the load pop sound coming out the intake when you give it gas.

The Webers that were in there before never ever performed right in the first place. My original Spica pump went out at the same time everyone on the BB was raving about the Webers, so I thought I try and see. I bought a used complete set from a fella that races Alfas for $200 - I figure $200 vs. $800 rebuilt pump, the used $200 Webers won the coin toss. I did the conversion and it went really well, suprisingly. From day one, I would get this empty spot under load when you're at a dead stop. I spent numerous months try to prefected, but same result. I brought the car to an independent shop which also worked on a lot of webers and Italian cars. After 3 days of diagnostic and $350.00 repair bill and the same problem resurface again after 2 days or driving. So, off I went back with a used Spica that was known good and sold off the Webers.

Sorry for such a long memo and the history of my Alfa.

Any ideas, please forward them on to me.

Again, thansk for a great site!!
 

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Q-man
This sounds like an ignition timing problem.
Sounds like the fuel is going in at the same time
the plug is sparking, thus the intake "pop".
I would double check your ignition timing, with
the valve cover off to check the position of the
cams, and double check that the Spica pump timing
mark is correct.

Im going to let Jim chime in on this one, since he
seems to know much more about the Spica and its timing.

Hope this helps
 

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Q-man-
How far from the airport do you live? I transit through MSP from Chicago to Rapid City about 3-4 times per month.
 

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John, what do you mean "airport"? I thought you'd be taking a "roadtrip"! :)

Actually that's an awesome offer! Set up shop in the airport parking lot. Just don't let the airport security get a gander at Q's Spica pump. They might consider it a suspicious device. :D
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Sorry for the late response, because my cable modem was down and out due to the storm. I live about 5 minutes from the airport (Bloomington).

Let me know.

Thanks,
Q-man

Roadtrip said:
Q-man-
How far from the airport do you live? I transit through MSP from Chicago to Rapid City about 3-4 times per month.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Thanks for all the suggestions, guys! I'm just going to bite the bullet and let the guy start working on it. After talking to him, basically, he quoted me $500 on the worst case scenario, otherwise it should be less. Besides, summer in Minnesota doesn't last very long and I intend to enjoy every minute of it. Again, thank you very much for all the responses. By far, this is the best Alfa resource BB.

Go to-pless!!

Q-man
78' Alfa Romeo Spider


Q-man said:
My 78 Spider has some issues with the Weber carbs so I decided to go back with a Spica fuel injection pump recently, which I bought used off a running spider. Well, after days of setting it up by following manuals and such, but still having issues. So, I had the car towed down to a place called F & D Motorworks that specialized in Fiats and Alfas. To make the long story short, they told me that it will cost me $500 to make it run right. That's the bottom line!! They said, the settings were not correct and the fuel pump that a pinched in the fuel line and everything went in went in backwards. How can that be, I asked my self??? The car was running great until the Webers started to be almost impossible to deal with and no one here in town can or will work on them, so I had no choice but to converted back to the Spica setup. Now, do you guys think $500 is a fair price to pay?? The car is has faded silver paint and the body starting to have some bubbles at the rear fenders. Any feedback would greatly appreciate it.

Q-man
78 Alfa Romeo Spider
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Re: Re: Does this price sound reasonable to you??

I meant to say GO TOP-LESS!!



Q-man said:
Thanks for all the suggestions, guys! I'm just going to bite the bullet and let the guy start working on it. After talking to him, basically, he quoted me $500 on the worst case scenario, otherwise it should be less. Besides, summer in Minnesota doesn't last very long and I intend to enjoy every minute of it. Again, thank you very much for all the responses. By far, this is the best Alfa resource BB.

Go to-pless!!

Q-man
78' Alfa Romeo Spider
 
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