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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Let's have another agree to disagree session OK.

I don't care what the cross-reference books say is correct plugs for 164 12v V6 engines they are usually wrong.

My take on using correct style sparkplug is this and it is based on three or so things:

1. The original plug hex head size is 13/16" and so is the plug wrench in the tool kit. Cross reference books usually say now to use a 5/8" hex head sparkplug.

2. The 5/8" hex head plugs not only require 5/8" socket set up to remove/install but also usually are not as tall as the 13/16" hex head size plugs. Now that size wrench maybe in a 24v 164 tool kit but we know it is not in the 12v 164 tool kit.

3. Shorter plugs cause issue with original 12v style plug wires in that if you can't remove sealing hat on top of long ceramic/resistor (and why would you want too) you can't get a positive lock onto terminal end of the plug.

Just recently had to have Tra change the wrong shorter plugs in his 164L as it ran like crap and sparkplug wires were not reaching shorter plugs so he had arcing to plugs and then weaker spark at plug tip.

Here is my story thread:

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/164-168-1991-1995/201105-del-my-old-new-sparkplug-story.html

So my advise is do not use NGK 5/8" hex head BKR6EIX (6418) plugs in 164S or the BKR7EIX in the 164B/L.

Do use correct 13/16" hex longer NGK BPR6EIX in 164S (6637) and BPR7EIX (4055) in 164B/L The "P" letter is for 13/16" and the "K" is for 5/8" hex head.
 

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"So my advise(sic) is do not use NGK 5/8" hex head BKR6EIX (6418) plugs in 164S"

Interesting. Have never had problems as you describe (have never used the Alfa plug tool in any Alfa). Also use this plug in the LS as required.
 

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...3. Shorter plugs cause issue with original 12v style plug wires in that if you can't remove sealing hat on top of long ceramic/resistor (and why would you want too) you can't get a positive lock onto terminal end of the plug...
AHA! So that's what's going on there. When I first got Blackie I got all of my parts from Jon Norman in Berkeley. He recommended Bosch Plat4's so that's what I put in. When I got Red I put in NGK's but I also got my new plug wires off of eBay and all this time I've been convinced it was the wires that were causing that issue.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
"So my advise(sic) is do not use NGK 5/8" hex head BKR6EIX (6418) plugs in 164S"

Interesting. Have never had problems as you describe (have never used the Alfa plug tool in any Alfa). Also use this plug in the LS as required.
Yes the BKR6EIX is correct plug for 24v 164. If you tried to use the BPR6 longer one in a 24v you couldn't bolt coil packs down to head either.
 

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"He recommended Bosch Plat4's "

Could never get those to work in the S, tended to foul up after 4/5k miles. I think wrong heat range.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
"He recommended Bosch Plat4's "

Could never get those to work in the S, tended to foul up after 4/5k miles. I think wrong heat range.
Plat 4s no and go plat 2s work better but still not the best for 164B/L/S models.
 

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So far no trouble with them, maybe about 4k on them now but hard to tell since the speed sensor has been intermittently inop (mostly inop) In fact I'll pull them out and have a look-see while it's in the garage.
 

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Do use correct 13/16" hex longer NGK BPR6EIX in 164S
I have them in the 164S motor in my GTV6. I am perfectly happy with them.
 

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I ran them in my 1st 164S and like them. The down side was that they lasted a long time, but when they stopped firing they did so quickly.
 

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NOW you tell me!

Great. I just ordered the "K" plugs for my 164S, not the "P" plugs. So I wasted my money?
 

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Let's do an experiment!

OK, rather than grouse about having ordered the allegedly incorrect plug, I'm going to take one for the team and find out conclusively (on my car at least) which version of NGK Iridium plug is "correct". I just ordered a second set of plugs, this time getting the BPR6EIX (6637) recommended by Steve.

I'll try test-fitting both that type and the "incorrect" BKR6EIX (6418) plugs I ordered yesterday, and let the world know which fits/works better in the 164S (12V).

Let us snatch defeat from the jaws of victory!
 

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Save yourself the trouble and return the K's. I can tell you right now that the plug wires won't lock on just like Steve said. Ask me how I know.
 

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"Great. I just ordered the "K" plugs for my 164S, not the "P" plugs. So I wasted my money?"

Not necessarily, as many of us with S's have no problems with them at all. Quite happy with them. This with the OEM plug cables and connectors. But try one, if it doesn't work, send them back.
 

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I have found NGK product finder the most reliable source for correct NGK applications:

http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/part_finder/index.asp?mode=nml

For the 12 valve B or L. The link to the actual page does not copy so you have to enter your specific data each search.

The platinum plug is not even recommended by NGK for the B or L engines. In my experience if NGK doesn't recommend it don't even try using it, something won't be quite right.

The S for some reason runs a slightly hotter plug which is counter intuitive until you realize the S is just a paper tiger. The S engine actually runs slightly less stressed than the L because the S drives a shorter final drive ratio.

NGK does in fact recommend the PF series for the LS 24 valve, but note only for its platinum plug series. NGK claims the platinum is the OEM spec.

All other types are K, including the IX iridium plug (an excellent plug BTW).

This page is handy also :

http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/docs/tech/design_symbols_plugs.pdf

I do note the only difference between the BK and the PF series is the hex head which is 5/8 instead of 13/16. This should not affect the boot fit.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
"I do note the only difference between the BK and the PF series is the hex head which is 5/8 instead of 13/16. This should not affect the boot fit."

However, comma the overall height of 5/8" hex size plug is shorter and that is what affects proper fit of sparkplug wire connector to a downright and clicked in place condition.
 

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Thanks, Michael. Note that the NGK chart lists the "incorrect" BKR6EIX (6418) plugs for my 12V 164S, rather than the "correct" BPR6EIX (6637) plugs suggested by Steve. I've got both types on order, will try them and see.
 

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"I don't care what the cross-reference books say is correct plugs for 164 12v V6 engines they are usually wrong."

Just went to Amazon for the BPR7EIX (4055) and sure enough, they say does not fit my 164L.
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
for the 164 super 1994 3.0 v6 24 v its ngk PFR6B and not what you have wrote steve.
Note: Title of my thread used the word IRIDIUM SPARKPLUG

I wrote CORRECT NGK number for 24v Iridium plug.

Now if you want Laser Platinum plug then yes your number PFR6B is correct but if you want Iridium then Iridium BKR6EIX (6418) is correct number


See the choices NGK lists in this post:

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/1182297-post7.html

1994-95 ALFA ROMEO 164 QUADRIFOGLIO 3.0 V6 FI QUADRIFOGLIO

Spark Plug Part No. Stock No. Plug Gap Photo
Standard BKR6ES 6364 .024
V-Power BKR6E 6962 .024
G-Power BKR6EGP 7092 .024
Laser Platinum PFR6B * # 3500 .024
Iridium IX BKR6EIX 6418 .024
* “Laser Series” Platinum center electrode, and Platinum pad ground electrode
# Original Equipment Manufacturer, and/or Original Equipment Service Part
^ “Laser Series” Iridium center electrode, and Platinum pad ground electrode


1994-95 ALFA ROMEO 164 LS 3.0 V6 FI

Spark Plug Part No. Stock No. Plug Gap Photo
Standard BKR6ES 6364 .025
V-Power BKR6E 6962 .025
G-Power BKR6EGP 7092 .025
Laser Platinum PFR6B * # 3500 .025
Iridium IX BKR6EIX 6418 .025
* “Laser Series” Platinum center electrode, and Platinum pad ground electrode
# Original Equipment Manufacturer, and/or Original Equipment Service Part
^ “Laser Series” Iridium center electrode, and Platinum pad ground electrode

1991 ALFA ROMEO 164 3.0 V6 FI L-MODEL

Spark Plug Part No. Stock No. Plug Gap Photo
Standard BPR7ES 5534 .025
Iridium IX BPR7EIX 4055 .025



1991 ALFA ROMEO 164 SPORT 3.0 V6 FI

Spark Plug Part No. Stock No. Plug Gap Photo
Standard BKR6ES 6364 .025
V-Power BKR6E 6962 .025
G-Power BKR6EGP 7092 .025
Laser Platinum PFR6B * # 3500 .025
Iridium IX BKR6EIX 6418 .025 I think BPR6EIX with 13/16" socket size better so you can use factory tool kit socket wrench
* “Laser Series” Platinum center electrode, and Platinum pad ground electrode
# Original Equipment Manufacturer, and/or Original Equipment Service Part
^ “Laser Series” Iridium center electrode, and Platinum pad ground electrode
 
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