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Filed under: Tech, Hatchbacks, Alfa Romeo, FIAT
It's been bandied about for some time, but Valeo is looking to finally make it a reality. The supplier is developing a camless engine that utilizes electromagnetic solenoids to drive the camshafts, providing unlimited control of the valves, reducing emissions by up to 20-percent and improving performance in the process.

The system, which is also being developed by both Jacobs Vehicle Systems of Connecticut and Lotus Engineering, has had its share of fits and starts. Packaging issues have caused problems for all involved, particularly on engines with three or four valves per cylinder.

Although Valeo has yet to get an automaker to sign on, industry sources claim that Fiat is looking to employ a similar system, dubbed Multiair, on the 2009 900cc 500 and possibly some of its diesel offerings. Alfa Romeo might get in the game as well, when it releases the "Junior" model with a turbocharged inline four.

[Source: Automotive News - Sub. Req.]

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if you havnt seen the vid of the big rig running up pikes peak with this setup..go digging

its a wicked setup for sure..but is it just one more high tech thing to fail?...i have to wonder about its life span under "normal" human abusive conditions
 

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if you havnt seen the vid of the big rig running up pikes peak with this setup..go digging

its a wicked setup for sure..but is it just one more high tech thing to fail?...i have to wonder about its life span under "normal" human abusive conditions
Who cares. It's not like Fiat builds a reliable product anyway. This is just another innovative experiment in the vein of the old Citroen DS hydraulic system and/or Alfa's old Spica fuel injection system from the 70's. It's cool...it will give the cars more character.
 

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where's Sakiss ??
 

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if you havnt seen the vid of the big rig running up pikes peak with this setup..go digging

its a wicked setup for sure..but is it just one more high tech thing to fail?...i have to wonder about its life span under "normal" human abusive conditions
That's a rather negative look at things :D
Remember those who doupted turbos? How about those complicated double overhead cam thingies? Even more troublesome when they have twice as many valves than you need :p.
Car manufacturers spend big dollars to develop cars so that they are reliable in the real world. Maybe Toyota, Nissan, Mazda, Honda or BMW could develop it. After all, they've implimented some of the most inovative engines in the las 20 years
 

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Who cares. It's not like Fiat builds a reliable product anyway. This is just another innovative experiment in the vein of the old Citroen DS hydraulic system and/or Alfa's old Spica fuel injection system from the 70's. It's cool...it will give the cars more character.
What's wrong with Fiats? The new line of cars is quite stunning.
 

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don't the Indy/F1 cars have camless engines?
 

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F1 cars have pneumatic systems instead of springs to close the valves. I think that it was pioneered by Renault. But they still use cams to open the valves (I think).
Ed Prytherch
 

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i didnt mean to sound so negitive...i just question the human element of neglect and abuse in the form of reliability and life span...lets face it most cars today are designed to last only a few years

i was quite impressed with the design when i saw the vid of it in a big rig running pikes peak
 

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F1 cars have pneumatic systems instead of springs to close the valves. I think that it was pioneered by Renault. But they still use cams to open the valves (I think).
Ed Prytherch
Ducati uses the same technilogy I think. The 'Desmodromic' valve train...
 

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Ducati uses the same technilogy I think. The 'Desmodromic' valve train...
The Desmodromonic system used the camshaft lobe to both open and close the valves.They used a top rocker arm to push the valve open, and a bottom rocker arm to push it closed. Springs were used to keep the rocker arms in contact with the cam lobes. It was kind :rolleyes: of like having a crankshaft mechanism to operate the valves. You really need a drawing of to understand the set up. Desmodromic valve - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As for the human ellement of automotive reliabillity. Not many general purpose car drivers touch their cars, especially with mandatory dealler servicing for warranty.
No cam lobes and camshaft bearing journals to require oil, no timing belt to replace or chain to lube and eventually get stretched and noisey.

Potentially a valve opening time period for every single possible engine rev/load condition.
Much easier application of Dispacement on Demand.
To me, the potential is enormous :D
 

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i agree the potential is there....but is said potential going to last say 5+ year or even 10+ years...at wich point i might lay my hands on one LOL

that ducati setup is cool
 

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i agree the potential is there....but is said potential going to last say 5+ year or even 10+ years...at wich point i might lay my hands on one LOL

that ducati setup is cool
I don't see why they would/couldn't last that long. So long as the sliding section of the solenoids are wear resistant, lubricated or self lubricated and the solenoids themselves are well specified for opperating force and temperature resistance. The control circuitry shouldn't be an issue.

No offence shOrtlife, but you sound abit like a bloke (typical narrow minded "Giz a big cube, carby, push rod v8, real engine!" bogan, this particular guy) I had a dicussion (argument ;)) with about overhead cam engins. He didn't like them because he thought they were too complicated. I said "What, having fewer moving parts is more complicated, is it?". He didn't say much after that ;)
Hope you get my drift :D
 

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LOL yeah im an old fashion gear head..and have just come to start respecting EFI and turbo's ...but ive ALWAYS respected the overhead cam since before they were mainstream and were mostly prototypes of BIG v8's

my biggest complaint about EFI is the sheer amount of "required" wireing...one of the reasons i love my 58 ford..2 wires for the alt 2 wires for the starter 1 for the points 2 mech feeds for oil/water....keeps the engine bay nice and clutter free

i only worry about lifespan since the majority of cars are designed to be DEAD after 5 years..in general it seems like a very sound design with the potential to be re-programed into the wickedest profiles imagineable....id only trust it after seeing it used in a race aplication for atleast 1 year and then going to a "normal" car without ANY modifications
 

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i only worry about lifespan since the majority of cars are designed to be DEAD after 5 years..in general it seems like a very sound design with the potential to be re-programed into the wickedest profiles imagineable....id only trust it after seeing it used in a race aplication for atleast 1 year and then going to a "normal" car without ANY modifications
Now you torquing :D. Formula 1 probably wouldn't allow it due to rule, but maybe they could change said rules. Just guessing about that, tho.
Some other class or manufacture could use it in an existing class of racing. Hopefully the rule makers could see the potential and allow it to run unrestricted. Remember the end of the turbo era of F1........ I was a bit young, but still Honda was kicking *** with some rediculous hp figures apparently over 1000hp from a 1.5ltr engine. They were innovators. How about a joint venture between some of the greatest automotive innovators we have ever seen. Honda, BMW and Cosworth :D

Would love to see custom heads for alsorts of engines. Big cube old v8s could be brought into the now without the inconveniance of redesigning the block to accomidate overhead cams.
Same for other solid bottom end engines (ALFA'S :D) that would bennefit from this technollogy.
 

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totaly agree..a retro fit for "classic" stuff would be wicked...but lets be serious...the only engines that would be likely to get the retro fit would be the "popular" stuff EG gm350 ford 302 mopar small block(all use the same head)

toss the setup on a test mule in the baja 1000...i would say dakar but well...
maybe some good old fashin circle track stuff....basicaly run the races to prove it works NOT FOR THE WIN!!!!....hell setup a F1 car with it..allow it to run with the pack but NOT count if it wins

i think the only test bed that would probably allow it would be hill climbs and rallycross
 
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