[shipskind]

My power window on my 1985 Veloce is ripping itself apart as the cables are so very, very tight I am surprised that the plastic pulleys have not snapped. The three holes that hold the electric motor are no longer circular as they are eating the sheet metal because the cables are so tight.

I have greased and lubed the tracks, but the cables get tighter as the window goes down. I have the interior panel out so it is easy to notice. I thought I might find a way to 'loosen' the cables, but nothing seems to an adjustment.

I am at wits end with this. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[joe]

1989 spider veloce window

there is an adjustment at the bottom of the window track. You can try to lossen the bracket and take off some pressure. If not the cable may have been reworked by someone else and it is to short. there are a lot of good threads on replacing cable or just buy a new regulator from IAP. Hope that helps

 

[alfaparticle]

I think that there should be some adjustment on the top pulleys. Slacken the bolts that go through the center and see if the pulleys will slide down a little.
Ed Prytherch

 

[shipskind]

Thanks for the reply. I have loosen the adjustments and it still does not go all the way down because the cable becomes too tight to go any further down.

The adjustments you suggested loosen the cable when the window is all the way up, but it is still very tight on the bottom.

thanks again.

 

[John M]

I thought your initial post didn't make sense and now I know why!

The cable is supposed to be without slack...not guitar string tight...but again no slack. The pulleys are metal. Its still a very good ideal to get some white lithium grease and lube the wire, the pulleys, etc.

Why your initial post didn't make sense.....you didn't mention the window wouldn't go down as you just let out of the bag in your last post. Now that is very important. I know exactly your problem. Your regulator has fouled itself with the cable. You must be off one of the pulleys for starters. There are five pulleys and the main spool at the motor. Three top and two bottom. What happens is that the cable jumps one or two of these creating slack in the cable which then gets spooled over itself at the regulator motor.

The fix:

1. At the bottom of the glass...there are two attachments for the window glass to the cable. Note the original position of the cable relative to the bolt for later reassembly...in other words...is the cable positioned forward or aft the bolt by the retaining washer. NOW...Loosen and remove both fastener assemblies to remove the glass from the car door. This will make it much easier to complete this repair.

2. Now with power to your window switch, find whether going up or going down will provide more slack to the cable while you pull at the cable with your free hand. Gather the newly freed cable to keep it from getting retangled in the regulator spool. Keep working the cable until its untangled at the spool.

3. Ready to put the cable back on all the pulleys. Now again if memory serves me....one end of the cable from the spool/regulator motor goes to the upper forward pulley, down to the lower forward pulley, up to the upper middle pulley, across to the upper aft pulley, down to the lower aft pulley, through a protective sheath, and back to the spool/regulator motor.

4. Now adjust the pulleys so that the cable is without slack.

5. Back to the power window switch. Roll the cable all the way up. Now roll the cable all the way down. Recheck the pulley/cable orientation. If all good move on.

6. Reinsert your window. Hold it mid way and loosely attach the hardware that secures the window to the cable. Leave it just loose enough to slide the window up and down the cable, while still keeping the cable to fastener bolt orientation correct. Slide the window down to the bottom of the door.

7. Your regulator motor should be in the rolled down position. Now roll it up just an inch. Watch the cable travel. Again...the window is not secured to the cable just yet allowing it to remain in the bottom of the door.

8. Now tighten up the fasteners on the glass to secure the window to the cable. Don't overtighten and break your glass. But tight enough to keep the cable from traveling through the fastener.

9. That should be it. Make sure your hardware (i.e. pulleys, tracks, regulator motor) are all tight. Test it and make sure its traveling all the way up and down. The door/window assembly has adjustments for glass height via stops, and glass cant in and out down at the bottom of the door.

Hope that helps,
John M

 

[Bill77]

Excellent post, John! I printed it for my shop manual. Thanks.

 

[john.harrill]

Alignment

Great thread!
I had an issue with the passenger window going down and not coming up on the '88 recently. After removing the the door panel and loosening the screws that attach the window to the cable, I was unable to move the window up manually.

Adjusting the track enabled me to move the glass. When I put it all back together, the window moved up and down with ease. The motor made no sounds of slowing or strain.

As soon as I have an excuse to open the driver's door, I'll adjust it's tracks, as well.

 

[shipskind]

John,

Thanks, makes perfect sense. I will take the door apart tonite and report back to the group.

Stefan

 

[aralfa8589]

John-
Thanks so much for your post. I'm tired of looking like Nanook of the North. My driver side window was stuck down. The motor was shot. I got another from a BB'er. I found it 100% impossibile to push the window button and spool the cable. None of my friends were available. It is now 2" short of up. That is perfect for now.

 

[Bozz]

What to do with the old wire.

I just picked up a power window regulator to replace my burnt one. I have a couple questions. The wire was cut and it has a couple bends in it. I'm assuming I should replace it with new wire. Do I connect both ends of the wire? If so what do I use to do this? Any help wiould be appreciated. Thanks, Bozz

 

[John M]

Bozz:

I haven't replaced cable so I could tell you without a picture of the regulator spool on the motor. I would imagine that the cable has two terminus at the spool. In static position the spool has one end of the wire wrapped one way...counter clockwise around the spool....the other end of the wire wrapped clockwise around the spool. As you travel up or down, one end of the wire wraps further, one end spools out.

As long as bends are not severe, a little bend here or there won't matter. But the cable being too short will make it unuseable. You'll have to get a new cable.

I hope this explains it. Post some pictures up of your new motor with the spool attached. I would imagine how to secure the cables at the spool will be self evident. The big problem that causes the motors to not work is one end of the wire wrapping over the other end of the wire at the spool...basically acting like a brake.

Best Regards,
John M

 

[norm_86veloce]

I had a similar problem on my 86 Spider Veloce and found that the cable got crossed where it wraps around the drum on the electric window winder mechanism probably because someone before me ran the winder with a slack cable or maybe it just got that way with age. I was able to slack the cable by removing the rear upper pulley, carefully fed it back onto the spool straight (spool is grooved to keep cable wrapping even), reattached the pulley and it has worked well for several years. Now, however, my cable snapped right where it goes through the winder drum. I'm speculating that the initial damage was done when the cable was crossed and not winding smoothly and continued use weakened the cable. Complete power window regulators are available but I'm stuborn and try to do things as cheaply as possible. 1/16" cable available at most hardware stores is about the right diameter but a little thicker than the stock cable. I carefully removed the old cable and measured a new piece of 1/16" cable to duplicate the length of the original, including the 1" piece that broke off. Hardware stores also sell the cable swedges and stops in the appropriate size to fit the cable. I fed the cable through the holes in the drum and attached a cable stop to each end, mashing the aluminum stop with a hammer. My problem now is figuring out the routing of the new cable. The most detailed diagram in the IAP shop manual appears to be a diagram of a manual window regulator, which appears to have more pulleys than the electric version. The IAP shop manual diagram for the electric regulator doesn't show the pulleys at all and there appears to be an extra cable run pictured than is possible with the pulleys available on my 86 (2 upper front & rear & 2 lower at each end of the bottom window track. Then too there is the problem of getting the cable rewound onto the spool so the cable has the proper tension and will not spool off the winder spool when it turns. I'd appreciate it if anyone has a detailed diagram of a Spider power window regulator installation showing all the pulleys and pivot/attachment points and has any tips on how to get the cable rewound and tensioned properly.

 

[mghamms]

I had a similar problem on my 86 Spider Veloce and found that the cable got crossed where it wraps around the drum on the electric window winder mechanism probably because someone before me ran the winder with a slack cable or maybe it just got that way with age. I was able to slack the cable by removing the rear upper pulley, carefully fed it back onto the spool straight (spool is grooved to keep cable wrapping even), reattached the pulley and it has worked well for several years. Now, however, my cable snapped right where it goes through the winder drum. I'm speculating that the initial damage was done when the cable was crossed and not winding smoothly and continued use weakened the cable. Complete power window regulators are available but I'm stuborn and try to do things as cheaply as possible. 1/16" cable available at most hardware stores is about the right diameter but a little thicker than the stock cable. I carefully removed the old cable and measured a new piece of 1/16" cable to duplicate the length of the original, including the 1" piece that broke off. Hardware stores also sell the cable swedges and stops in the appropriate size to fit the cable. I fed the cable through the holes in the drum and attached a cable stop to each end, mashing the aluminum stop with a hammer. My problem now is figuring out the routing of the new cable. The most detailed diagram in the IAP shop manual appears to be a diagram of a manual window regulator, which appears to have more pulleys than the electric version. The IAP shop manual diagram for the electric regulator doesn't show the pulleys at all and there appears to be an extra cable run pictured than is possible with the pulleys available on my 86 (2 upper front & rear & 2 lower at each end of the bottom window track. Then too there is the problem of getting the cable rewound onto the spool so the cable has the proper tension and will not spool off the winder spool when it turns. I'd appreciate it if anyone has a detailed diagram of a Spider power window regulator installation showing all the pulleys and pivot/attachment points and has any tips on how to get the cable rewound and tensioned properly.

I have a similar problem but someone replaced only one half of the wire and used one of the window screws as a point to splice (hold) the ends.
So my question is how long is the wire?

 

[norm_86veloce]

Alfa Power Window Regulator Cable

I don't recall the length of the original cable. I thought I made a note when I replaced the cable over a year ago but apparently not. I believe it was 30" or more. I used 1/8 inch cable available at most hardware stores. Although it is slightly thinner, I believe, that the metric cable used by Alfa, it is close enough to do the job. I tried to measure the original cable and allow for the little of mine that was damaged at the end but still under estimated and had to splice it using 1/8 in swedge connectors, also available at most hardware stores. I spliced it in the longest run of the cable where it wouldn't affect the operation by meeting a pulley over the entire traverse of the cable. However, getting the cable length exactly right is a trial and error process. I'm sure someone more knowledgeable than me could tell you the exact length. There is a little wiggle room given the mechanism has a bit of adjustment by way of slotted mounting. If I were to do it over, I would watch eBay for someone selling a complete power window regulator. I'm stubborn that way and repaired mine for the price of 30 inches or so of 1/8 in cable and a lot of sweat and a few choice words. Getting it right with the proper tension is important as with much use if it's too tight it will wear out the cable guides and too loose will result in it twisting and cross threading on the spool. Mine works and I don't use it much so for me it was a satisfactory solution repairing it myself using 1/8 in cable. Good luck.

 

[WithanF]

My power window on my 1985 Veloce is ripping itself apart as the cables are so very, very tight I am surprised that the plastic pulleys have not snapped. The three holes that hold the electric motor are no longer circular as they are eating the sheet metal because the cables are so tight.

I have greased and lubed the tracks, but the cables get tighter as the window goes down. I have the interior panel out so it is easy to notice. I thought I might find a way to 'loosen' the cables, but nothing seems to an adjustment.

I am at wits end with this. Any help would be appreciated.

I can help. I went through major window issues over the past 6 months:

Step 1: Remove door panel.
Step 2: Remove window glass. You can't mess around w/ glass in place.
Step 3: Play with every adjustment bolt you can find for 3 hours.
Step 4: Take family car to store for more beer.
Step 5: Get a hat to keep head from burning any worse in sun.
Step 6: Fiddle some more, be sure to cut your hand on a few sharp edges.
Step 7: Notice how glass on lawn in sun has killed a square of grass.
Step 8: Put car in garage until you have the energy to try again.
Step 9: Re-seed lawn.
Step 10: Repeat steps 1 through 7.
Step 11: Repeat steps 1 through 8.
Step 12: Charge battery, which died b/c you have not driven car in a month.
Step 13: Break cable while trying to repeat steps 1 through 10.
Step 14: Buy new cable. Spend day trying to guess length.
Step 15: Take car to shop. Fork over $400 (you'll need a new battery by now due to all the recharging, etc.)
Step 16: Go for a drive and forget your troubles.

 

[norm_86veloce]

Alfa Power Window Issues

I agree with Pete and believe he's on the right track to solving Alfa power window issues, especially going to the store multiple times for beer, that is unless you as stubborn as me and want to beat the Alfa engineers at their own game. Other the beer/repair shop option is the way to go.

 

[mghamms]

Come on guys make it easy on all.
Someone has to know the correct length.
Then we'll have more time to drink beer and drive.
Or better drive first then beer.

 

[mghamms]

I just fixed mine with a regulator from my parts car.
used tie wraps to hold cable on the spool, and cut them off when done.
I still want to know the exact length of the cable to fix the one I removed as a spare.
Exact length anyone.

 

[tseibold]

I just bought and 83 spider that needs some work. One of the issues is the driver side window. I am trying to replace the regulator but can't figure out how to get it out of the door. Any ideas or tips.

 

[johndewaele]

I was able to get the cable at a boating store. It seemed a hair thinner than the factory cable but works great!