Bought a matching hard top for $250!!

5366 Views 40 Replies 12 Participants Last post by spiderserie4, Feb 26, 2016

John533i

Discussion Starter · Nov 22, 2015

With great headliner and glass. I was skeptical about buying it at first, but I love it and the way it looks on the car.

So, since I have an 86 Veloce, is it possible to install a wire harness for the rear defroster? Only the Quads had that, right?

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dghii

· #2 · Nov 22, 2015

Got to believe it would be fairly simple as it's just two wires that go to the grid on the window. Get a switch and figure out where you want to mount it. Provide it with switched power and you're good to go. Might want to find out what size fuse the quads use for their defrost circuit so you have an idea what you'll need for supply current.

Sounds like you got a great deal!

Don Epstein

· #3 · Nov 22, 2015

Had the hardtop on an 86 graduate. The wiring is easy. Get the diagram from Papajam. It requires a switch, and some wire. Maybe some pick-n-pull would have the wiring harness. There is a light in the hardtop that works with the door and under dash lights. Not too much of a deal

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howard100

· #4 · Nov 22, 2015

Ha, I got a mint hardtop for my '92 for $50 on eBay several years ago. Problem is it's white and the car is silver, but I'll work on that. Anyway, both my '87 and '92 Veloce's have the wiring, so look behind the interior trim, and perhaps it's there on your car, too.

Norseman50

· #5 · Nov 22, 2015

The wires coming from the hardtop terminate in a unique 6-pin plug, which is designed to fit into a mating special 6-pin connector mounted behind the driver's B-pillar cover. If your car does not already have the mating plug under the carpet behind the B-pillar, I'm guessing the only places you might find one would be at A.P.E. (or from a similar car stripper). In fact I suggest you get the entire wire harness unit (B-Pillar plug + wires) as I don't think you can remove or replace the terminals in the plug housings. You could, of course, change the connector on the hardtop with a new 6-pin plug for which you have a mate and run all new wires back to the new switches you install in the console, but the value of your hardtop will then stay at or fall well below the $250 you paid for it.
If you do decide to cut off the stock plug on the hardtop, please save it and send me a PM if you would like to sell it. Mine is damaged, and although I haven't found a way to extricate the terminals, I would love to have the option of a good one to use in case I figure out how to do it.

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howard100

· #6 · Nov 22, 2015

Molex-type connectors can be found in almost countless configurations, although I've never tried to match the ones on the Spider hardtop. If a suitable match isn't available, it wouldn't be too big a project to buy a new pair and swap out both the male and female, but one would want to work carefully, as there isn't much extra wire to work with on the hardtop side.

e.g. 43025-0400 Molex | Mouser

Norseman50

· #7 · Nov 22, 2015 (Edited)

3

howard100 said:
Molex-type connectors can be found in almost countless configurations, although I've never tried to match the ones on the Spider hardtop. If a suitable match isn't available, it wouldn't be too big a project to buy a new pair and swap out both the male and female, but one would want to work carefully, as there isn't much extra wire to work with on the hardtop side.

e.g. 43025-0400 Molex | Mouser

Thank you Howard for providing the great link. I had totally forgotten about Mouser, but that's who I used to source AMP/Bosch connectors when I needed to replace some of the plugs used by the L-Jetronic system in my engine compartment.

After taking a good look at the hardtop connecting plugs in my car, I think items A and B on page 1744 in Mouser's online catalog are very close to the plugs that Alfa used:

Mouser Electronics - Catalog Viewer

They may not be exact, but they are close, and might work. Either that or I may be able to change out the ones on the hardtop and in the car with a new set. I will also keep searching for the exact ones. I may buy a pair and give it a try.

I also like the fact that in most cases I can purchase just 1 or 2 pieces from Mouser.

Thanks again Howard!

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John533i

Discussion Starter · #8 · Nov 23, 2015 (Edited)

2

Pictures. We like pictures, right?

I wanted to post these but forgot:

The worst part about the top is that I can hear a bad mechanical noise from the engine now. It might be the TO bearing or the input shaft bearing, as it goes away when I press in the clutch. The engine sounds soooo nice, then theres this freaking other sound...:crying2:

I'll call APE soon and try to source a harness and the switch for the console, after I dig around and make sure I don't have one that's buried. I'm going to try to daily driver this thing, and I can't have it fogging up...

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Norseman50

· #9 · Nov 23, 2015

This is the "dual purpose" switch used on the Quadrifoglios (and S4s?) to control the rear window defroster and the emergency flasher (since the console only has room for 3 switches and the other 2 are used for (a) power window controls and (b) rear fog lights:

Alfa Romeo Spider Defrost Switch Quadrifoglio Hardtop | eBay

On the non-hardtop Series 3 models (Veloce, Graduate) the second pair of push buttons (next to the flasher control buttons) are blanks.

So if you have an emergency flasher control switch that's all alone, you might want to consider finding a used "combo" switch for that slot and you won't have to cut or drill holes in the console for an aftermarket switch to operate just the rear window defroster.

Jim G

· #10 · Nov 24, 2015

1986 and up are prewired for the hardtop. Look behind the carpet in the area were the harness comes out of the top. You will need the the combo switch for the defroster. You will also need the relay that goes in the fusebox.

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John533i

Discussion Starter · #11 · Nov 24, 2015

Thanks, guys. I'm pretty sure that only the Quad had the wiring harness, not the Veloce, going by the older threads I've read. But I'll check again. There's no end to the harness that I can see up by the switches.

Thanks for the heads up about the relay- I didn't think of that.

Jim G

· #12 · Nov 24, 2015

There is not going to be an end to the harness by the switches. The wires for the defroster are already in the connector for the flasher switch. 1986 and ups all used the same harness for all 3 models.

Move the drivers seat all the way forward and lean the seat back forward. Look down behind the carpet from the upper (top) edge right behind the trim panel that holds the latches for the trunk and gas lid. You might have to remove one of the trim screws that hold the carpet in place. You will see the harness clipped into a metal bracket thats welded to the body. The harness from the top is long enough to go down behind the carpet and clip into the harness from the car.

bjwhite

· #13 · Nov 24, 2015 (Edited)

John533i said:
With great headliner and glass. I was skeptical about buying it at first, but I love it and the way it looks on the car.

So, since I have an 86 Veloce, is it possible to install a wire harness for the rear defroster? Only the Quads had that, right?

My 88 Veloce has the rear defroster switch and wiring. I also love the way the hardtop looks on the car. One of the reasons I bought the car is that it came with the hardtop too....and for only $3500 I couldn't pass it up.

Jim G

· #14 · Nov 24, 2015 (Edited)

Heres a picture of an 86 spider veloce I own its been gutted but it shows were the bracket that holds the plug for the hardtop wiring harness to plug into.

As you can see in the picture its located below the soft top frame hinge behind the carpet. Its the bracket with the rectangle hole with notches on the side of the hole. The car harness for the hardtop is clipped into here to hold it in place. Just plug your top harness into it.

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Reactions: 1

howard100

· #15 · Nov 25, 2015

John533i said:
Thanks, guys. I'm pretty sure that only the Quad had the wiring harness, not the Veloce, going by the older threads I've read. But I'll check again. There's no end to the harness that I can see up by the switches.

Thanks for the heads up about the relay- I didn't think of that.

My '87 is a Veloce, and it has the harness. So is my '92, but I've never looked for it on that car.

John533i

Discussion Starter · #16 · Nov 25, 2015

Gaaak! I wish I would have read this today. I'll dig for it again tomorrow.

John533i

Discussion Starter · #17 · Nov 27, 2015 (Edited)

OK, confirmed that I AM wired for the hard top, thanks for advice on that Jim G. I just wish that we had taken more care when putting the top on, as now the hard tops dongle is tucked somewhere...

Anyway, does anyone have the relay part number?

Found it on another thread. I sure wish that I would have known this Tifosi guy. Really great man, and a helpful fountain of info. The relay is the same as the horn or power windows, according to this thread:
http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/spi...d-rear-window-courtesy-lights-timer-same.html

From Tifosi-
Bosch # 0332019150
or Sipea 12V 0679
Thanks,
John

John533i

Discussion Starter · #18 · Nov 28, 2015 (Edited)

3

Next issue...

So, the connectors don't match.

Maybe S3 and S4 tops have different?
I used to have the manual for S3 spiders on disk and I could study this stuff, but it's not on that hard drive anymore, and the original has walked off somewhere...

Another issue. I have the 'workshop manual' in print, and both depictions of the fuse box are different than mine. I have no spare fuse holders. Also, mine appears to have an relay in the rear window defrost position already, if that IS the defroster relay position . Crazy DPO stuff...

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purgatory

· #19 · Nov 28, 2015

Sounds like a heck of a good price for a hard top for the Spider. Way cheaper than the few I have seen advertised. Thought about hunting one down, but living here in SC, and being that this car is only a "fun weekend" car for me, not a DD, and the fact that I am having a garage put in for the Alfa and all my tools, etc., probably don't really need one. But if I ever ran across one locally for a good price, might like to have it anyhow.

How much does the top weigh? The owners manual stresses that you need two people to place it properly or to remove it. Also, do you have to remove the soft top in order to use the hard top?

John533i

Discussion Starter · #20 · Nov 28, 2015

No, the soft top just folds down as normal. You change out some chrome fasteners in the back and you and a buddy can manhandle the top into position. Not sure about exact weight, but it's not that heavy. My girlfriend and I can do it easily.

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