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Discussion Starter #1
I recently rebuilt a 2.0L engine on my GTV with big valves, high compression piston and high lift cam, 45 DCOE weber. After drove it for 500 miles did an old change and noticed some antifreeze in the oil, but I was using castrol GTX and they tend to have be greenish color oil. After drove it for another 1K miles it started to spit some oil from the cam breather canister and smoke is coming out of there. I took the cam cover and see some antifreeze in there.
What the problem could be? There is some leakage from the oil passage between the head and the block.
Has anyone had the same experience?
Thanks in advance!
 

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It's leaking coolant either from the head gasket, or "O" rings at the liner skirts. By the time they start blowing from the breather, the water is boiling out of the oil and you are in trouble. Bearings usually go next.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
It's leaking coolant either from the head gasket, or "O" rings at the liner skirts. By the time they start blowing from the breather, the water is boiling out of the oil and you are in trouble. Bearings usually go next.
I am guessing probably from the piston liner seals. Are there any tricks how to put those liners in place, I had them nicely fit and pushed down and the liner, piston is brand new.
I will take the engine out thats not a problem for me, but want to make sure to do it right and final.
I am not driving the car and the bearings are new, I will still check them and replace them if necessary.
 

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You may wish to discuss this with Tom Suppa, another BB member that had the same exact problem, <[email protected]>. This is not an unusual situation, but requires diagnostic disassembly. There are some tricks, however you need to contact Tom first for his most recent enlightenment.
 

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It happened to me when I had false torque readings on the head bolts due to crap in the domed nuts. I chased the threads on the studs but forgot about the nuts.
 

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you can also get antifreeze in the oil with a bad gasket on the front cover, there is an oil passage there.
My 74 just started with the clutch slipping and the throw out bearing howling. I drained the oil in preperation to pulling the engine, and had about a cup of antifreeze come out. not an altogether bad thing, it keeps the oil off your fingers when removing the plug.
There are enough years on the 74, so I am going to go through the engine and transmission while its out.
cliff
 

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Discussion Starter #10
You may wish to discuss this with Tom Suppa, another BB member that had the same exact problem, <[email protected]>. This is not an unusual situation, but requires diagnostic disassembly. There are some tricks, however you need to contact Tom first for his most recent enlightenment.
So he had the same symptom. Does he have a thread about it.
 

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Redgtv,
I think Tom is in recovery mode. If you e-mail, you can prompt him to post and tell all.
 

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71 Berlina 74 GTV 17 Giulia Q4
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No offence to your Alfa mechanic but not retourqing the head is big mistake. When you first crank the motor and run it, keep the rad cap off and go for a drive, it is absoultly necessary to retourque hot, they will be loose. Retourque then you can put the cap back on. Retourqe cold after a couple hundred miles. Was the oil chocolate milk shake or were they sparated. Seems you would have noticed something amiss right away when checking your oil all those times one does after a rebuild?
Now I've seen this happen and stop the coolant getting into the oil by putting some bars leak in after a retourque and complete oil change. Worth a shot. You don't have anything to lose. At least you'll get fresh oil back on the bearings etc.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
No offence to your Alfa mechanic but not retourqing the head is big mistake. When you first crank the motor and run it, keep the rad cap off and go for a drive, it is absoultly necessary to retourque hot, they will be loose. Retourque then you can put the cap back on. Retourqe cold after a couple hundred miles. Was the oil chocolate milk shake or were they sparated. Seems you would have noticed something amiss right away when checking your oil all those times one does after a rebuild?
Now I've seen this happen and stop the coolant getting into the oil by putting some bars leak in after a retourque and complete oil change. Worth a shot. You don't have anything to lose. At least you'll get fresh oil back on the bearings etc.
No the oil is not chocolate milk shake. What is the torque procedure?

What is putting bars leak?

Can you drive the car with the cap off? I suppose just a short drive.
 

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I e-mailed Tom couple days ago but haven't heard anything yet.
Hi Red,

I am sorry to hear about your issues. Sorry, I didnt see your email, I will check my spam folder, sometimes new emails end up there fore some reason. I will try to share my recent engine rebuild experience with you.

I performed a rebuild on my 79 2 liter. Performance cams and head from Centerline, New Motronic 10.1 pistons and liners, new bearings.....etc.. I was extremely careful during rebuild. I actually removed motor and did the rebuild in my basement. As Gordon can attest, I made many,many,many phone calls to him with numerous dumb questions and maybe one or 2 intelligent questions.

While I had the motor apart, I took the crank to a local machinist who builds dirt track motors. He polished it for me.

I thought the rebuild went pretty good. I re-installed motor. Drove car a total of maybe 40 miles, on way home on last drive, I started noticing oil spray appearing on windshield (my car is a Lotus 7 with a hole in the hood for engine clearance).

Upon arriving at home, I removed hood and discovered that my crank case ventilation (oil recovery bottle) was full of a minty colored mixture of oil and anti freeze. I had used Penn break in oil which has a green tint to it and coolant, the result mixture was the consistency a malt and minty green in color.

As advised by Gordon, I immediately drained all oil from crank case and replaced with diesel fuel and cranked engine, flushed and repeated a couple of times. This was an attempt to get all glycol away from bearings etc.....

I removed motor from car and pulled oil pan. With engine on stand I attached radiator hoses and plugged them. Then I started adding water to motor. I immediately saw water dripping ( actually it was probably closer to pouring) out of the bottom of the engine. Could not initially tell where it was coming from. I made a fixture that I could put into one of the radiator hoses and pressurize the cooling system. After pressure was applied, I could see bubbles around the #2 cylinder skirt.

Time to disassemble. I found a main bearing with a very significant gouge in it, luckily journal looked fine. Upon further investigation I found a 3/16" piece of hardened polishing compound in a oil passage in the crank. I attributed this to the cause of the bad bearing, and I also found a cam bearing cap that was damaged, probably also caused by the chunk of polishing compound.

I pulled liners and inspected mating surfaces closely. I could find absolutely no reason for the leak. When I assembled the motor the first time, i used only heavy grease on the mating surfaces.

I thoroughly cleaned everything and started reassembly(with new rod and main bearings). This time I used a thin coat of Permatex gray over the o-rings on the liners followed by heavy grease. I installed liners and pistons and locked them down and let motor sit for 24 hours. Then I installed head and let that sit for 24 hours. At this point with pan still off, I added water to cooling system, and pressurized it to 10psi. No leaks.....woohoo. I left the pressure on it for 24 hours with no leaks.

I have re-installed motor, this time I did not use anti-freeze, just distilled water and bars-leak. For first start -up I put in Valvoline racing oil, ran motor to temperature, and drained oil, repeat. Then I put in Penn break-in oil. I have driven car a little over a 100 miles with no issues, oil looks as clean as when put in, temperature holds at normal.

Sorry so wordy

Tom
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Hi Red,

I am sorry to hear about your issues. Sorry, I didnt see your email, I will check my spam folder, sometimes new emails end up there fore some reason. I will try to share my recent engine rebuild experience with you.

Hi Tom,

Thanks for the info. I am assuming the antifreeze is coming from the liner seals I will know until I take it apart.

One other thing I remembered, when I started the car the first time I didn't have enough antifreeze (my stupidity) and the car ran for a little while overheating, I realized when I saw the temperature gauge high.

The main issue started after driving the car for 1500 miles.

Do you also retorque the head after the engine is warm.

Thanks,
Red
 
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