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1991 Alfa 164
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Discussion Starter #61
I don't know the harness wire colours but from one side to another they have been known to change colours and stripes. You may have to dig up a wiring diagram to be sure. I can't tell from the images. Are the wires the exact same on either end?
All but 2. The gray/red and the yellow/black have been intersected so they both meet their opposite partners.
 

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Well with the harbor frieght jackstand recall I can't try smacking the starter while attempting to start it. So until I can get new jack stands I've been doing small things on the car. While poking around I found that the MAF wires had been cut and spliced. It looks like they rearranged the wires. I was wondering why someones would do this and what I should do with it. View attachment 1630859
Well now, we need to find out just exactly what model 164 you have. So let's start with terminology is this a 1991-93 12v V6 164B/L/or S model? What is last 7-digits of chassis VIN number? Secondly your MAF on these models is actually known as an air flow meter (AFM). Now what is the Bosch part number on the AFM? Does it end in -201 or -035 or if not what is complete part number on the AFM you have? Your picture of cut/spliced wires indicates something has been changed from original configuration. Waiting for your reply.
 

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That is good to know IF I ever get my 164L down from VB,VA and need to change the plugs. I think I now have the BPR7EIX plugs in it and I regapped them to 0.025".
You should be able to leave iridium plugs in for at least 60,000 miles (100,000 km). Ford/Jaguar engines specify 100,000 miles (160,000 km) for the service interval.

Some makers (Toyota is one) have a non sensical time limit of six years regardless of mileage but I would ignore that were it my car.
 

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1991 Alfa 164
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Discussion Starter #64
Well now, we need to find out just exactly what model 164 you have. So let's start with terminology is this a 1991-93 12v V6 164B/L/or S model? What is last 7-digits of chassis VIN number? Secondly your MAF on these models is actually known as an air flow meter (AFM). Now what is the Bosch part number on the AFM? Does it end in -201 or -035 or if not what is complete part number on the AFM you have? Your picture of cut/spliced wires indicates something has been changed from original configuration. Waiting for your reply.
The last 7 of my vin is 6173720. As for my AFM we're looking at 035. Thanks for all your help.
 

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The last 7 of my vin is 6173720. As for my AFM we're looking at 035. Thanks for all your help.
OK the 035 AFM is from a 164S. So is your 164 a 164S or a 164B or L Can't get my VIN checker to work tonight. I suspect your have a 164B with that low VINand if so that is why wires are cut and miss matched as S 035 AFM only has 4 wires whereas the B/L -201 AFM has 5 wires. When using S 035 AFM on B/L models the gray-red wire from pin 5 on -201 AFM is moved to pin 1 of the 035 AFM and yellow-black wire at pin 1 on -201 to ECU is not used. Also the Bosch -130 S ECU goes with 035 AFM whereas -117 B/L ECU goes with -201 AFM.

Two more questions: What engine block do you in car AR06412**xxxxxx for 164B/L or AR64301**xxxxxx for the 164S? Numbers are on back of engine block at rear of front head under distributor. I suspect you do not have a S model and for some reason somebody has spliced in a S AFM with 4-pin connector instead of unpinning yel-blk wire from pin 1 and moving gry-red pin 5 wire to pin 1 in original 164L wiring harness.
 

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I think you have a 164Base model with engine AR06412**0013249 and it has blue velour interior. But you said the alarm went off when you opened trunk so it maybe a 164L
Correct me if I am wrong? Is it a 5-speed or A/T? Looks like is was made 01-1990.
CURRENT VEHICLE DATA:Colour: undefined
01
GS
Chassis No.: 06173720
Vehicle No.: 03173730
Engine No.: 0013249

 

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1991 Alfa 164
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Discussion Starter #67
I think you have a 164Base model with engine AR06412**0013249 and it has blue velour interior. But you said the alarm went off when you opened trunk.....
5 speed manual. It does have blue velour. And yes it has the CODE alarm system. What I'm left confused about is that the side leading to the wiring harness has 5 wires as does the side leading to the AFM meaning it would have to be an S?

Also do you have any recommendation on water pump belt tensioner?
 

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5 speed manual. It does have blue velour. And yes it has the CODE alarm system. What I'm left confused about is that the side leading to the wiring harness has 5 wires as does the side leading to the AFM meaning it would have to be an S?

Also do you have any recommendation on water pump belt tensioner?
No the 164S air flow meter connector only uses pins 1,2,3; 4 wires. There isn't a wire in pin 5 in the S harness. Looks like somebody has put an S AFM in a 164Base or L model. Now verify what engine you have look under disributor cap area. If AR06412*0013249 you have a 164b or L engine. The S engine is AR64301* and would be much lower number after **.
Report your findings.

You can use a Ford tensioner pulley See this thread: 164 12v accessory belt idler substitute
 

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Discussion Starter #69
Looks like I've got the 0013249.
As for the tensioner I need the bracket as well does anywhere sell the whole thing or should I start part hunting?
 

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Looks like I've got the 0013249.
As for the tensioner I need the bracket as well does anywhere sell the whole thing or should I start part hunting?
So you have the AR06412*0013249 which is 164B or L engine. Now even with an alarm system do you have a B or L model? Do you have an ABS pump for brake system in front of transmission? If you do it will have 6 steel brake lines going to it.

I maybe be able to find a spare serpentine belt bracket and pulley in my spares.

How about post a picture of the rest of the wire harness going to your -035 AFM.
 

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Even though connector has 5 terminals does the -035 AFM have 5-pins like -201? I don't think so. What ECU computer does the car have? ECU -117 164B/L but -130 ECU for 164S.

What is that second connector in last picture for?
 

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Discussion Starter #73
I took a look and there are 4 pins on the AFM. Not sure which second connect you are referring to. It’s a bad picture sorry it just of the one AFM connector.
Edit: I am also unsure of the ECU in the vehicle though I’d assume it’s OEM for the base model.
 

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Discussion Starter #74
Well I finally got some time and a helper today. Put the battery back on shimmied under the car and gave the starter a good tap (it's quite hard to give it a proper whack under there) while it was in the start position. Unfortunately all I got was a slightly louder click and a little bit of a burning smell that I think was coming from the starter.

Anyone have any more ideas on how to get it started or am I just going to have to go through the PITA of removing the starter and rebuilding it?
 

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Greenfield. Someone with more knowledge may suggest something more useful but if you can get under, reach under and to the top of the solenoid and make sure the excitation wire is connected. Look at some images to get an idea of where that is connected. It may be a crappy connection, crappy starter, crappy solenoid or something elsewhere. Frustrating I know. From the top, if you remove the firewall, oil separator and hoses, you can get a partial view of the area and you will see the wire, spade and main lug.
 

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Burnt smell means probably bad starter. Just for grins though I would also check for good engine and transmission to body ground. The ground strap runs from transmission to body ground point near rear of air cleaner box on side of body inner wall. It is a 13mm hex head bolt.
 

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Discussion Starter #77
From the top, if you remove the firewall, oil separator and hoses, you can get a partial view of the area and you will see the wire, spade and main lug.
I tried for the life of me to find the spade and wire you're talking about and couldn't get my eyes on it. The wires that ran in the general direction seemed fairly tight when I gave them a small pull.
Edit: I was looking at it from the top driver side, is there some better angle that lets you see it better?

Unfortunately, I also managed to clean sheer the hose that runs to the break booster. How do you get it off the brake booster side?

The 13 hex seemed very snug with very minimal corrosion or oxidation.

I suppose this week or weekend I'll be getting into replacing the starter. As always thanks for all the help y'all.
 

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I tried for the life of me to find the spade and wire you're talking about and couldn't get my eyes on it. The wires that ran in the general direction seemed fairly tight when I gave them a small pull.
Edit: I was looking at it from the top driver side, is there some better angle that lets you see it better?

Unfortunately, I also managed to clean sheer the hose that runs to the break booster. How do you get it off the brake booster side?

The 13 hex seemed very snug with very minimal corrosion or oxidation.

I suppose this week or weekend I'll be getting into replacing the starter. As always thanks for all the help y'all.
"Unfortunately, I also managed to clean sheer the hose that runs to the break booster. How do you get it off the brake booster side? "

Where did you shear off the brake booster rigid Rislan "plastic" tubing? If at or near attachment point to rear if intake manifold Just using a short section of hose to hook back to intake. If you feel you need to remove Rislan tubing from brake booster you have to pop out the vacuum check valve with tubing attached from rubber grommet in top front of booster.

pix of valve with Rislan tubing: Alfa Romeo OEM 164 Brake Booster Hose - NOS 60543874 | eBay

Here is pix of 164 check valve: ALFA ROMEO 164 '91-'95 BRAKE BOOSTER AIR VALVE GENUINE ALFA PART fits alfa romeo | eBay
 

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Discussion Starter #79
Yeah it cracked right at the lip of the attachment point. I have another one on my parts car but I don't know how to get it off. Do I just yank the plastic part that goes into the booster or is there a clip or something? I also did finally get a good look at the connecting wires to the starter from under the car and all seems tight so this weekend will be starter removal.

Is there any good kits for rebuilding the starter or should I just go ahead and buy new? If new which should I go with?
 

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If it broke right at intake manifold connection it is best to use a electric heat gun to soften up the end of Rislan tubing to expand the end enough to slip it back over fitting on intake manifold. If that won't work get a rubber hose to make a sleeve to go over fitting and to insert tubing inside of it.

Have you posted where you are located? I usually find a local good shop and have starter rebuilt.
 
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