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Discussion Starter #1
The 8V Ghia "Supersonica" Geneva(?) show car from Detroit was sold at the Gooding auction in AZ last weekend for $1.7 million plus. Unrestored and original with "needs".
Wow.
 

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And the Ghia's are not my favorites, I wonder what a Vignale bodied or Zagato would go for? Not too long ago you could get an 8V for $100k
 

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Discussion Starter #4
A real nice Zagato with good history and a great restoration sold for around $850K a couple of years ago. Don't know of any good Vignales selling recently.
 

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I saw the #0076 at 600.000 € 2 years ago, but it wasn't so good.

Anyway, i think when you buy a dreamcar like the 8V Supersonica you do that not for the car itself, you do it for the prestige to own it, this is completely different.
 

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I think this is a pretty awesome car, pretty awesome history and pretty awesome condition. Given rarity and potentially the best Ghia design around, this might not be completely out of line. If I had the money, I would gladly spend it on this car to boost my ego ...

Two Zagato 8Vs sold at auction recently. Don't have it handy but you can look it up - One (greem) at RM Monaco, the other was the Red LA car with MM history. I think you could 3 Zagatos for the price of this car.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I think this is a pretty awesome car, pretty awesome history and pretty awesome condition. Given rarity and potentially the best Ghia design around, this might not be completely out of line. If I had the money, I would gladly spend it on this car to boost my ego ...

Two Zagato 8Vs sold at auction recently. Don't have it handy but you can look it up - One (greem) at RM Monaco, the other was the Red LA car with MM history. I think you could 3 Zagatos for the price of this car.
Hmmm.... The red Zagato in LA was a car I knew pretty well. It had a Boss 302 Ford in it in the '70s and when it came to me in around '90 the entire body was covered in fiberglass and bondo. We repaired the chassis so that an 8V motor could be installed and it was sold to Europe where it was rebodied and restomodded and eventually came back to LA. Not exactly what I would call a "good" Zagato.
A friend of mine who owns an 8VZ looked at a green 8VZ at Fisken's in London a little while back(the only green one that I'm aware of) and said it was "kinda rough".
There's a nicely restored 8VZ for sale currently in the Netherlands-
(ch. #000026) but I think they want pretty big bucks. I think a Zagato 8V in the same good, original, unmolested condition- first paint, first upholstery etc. might bring similar money- if such a thing exists.
In my opinion, it's starting to feel like 1989 again.
 

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#61 sold by Goodings in PB last year for $682k - Car out of LA in what I thought 3 condition. I did know some stories but did not know this history - Thanks for sharing. A nice Rapi coupe in a weird blue metallic color sold for $400k at the same auction.

Green car #76 was a no sale at Euro 345k in Monacco.

I think a Zagato in similar condition than the Ghia would almost bring that money but not quite: The Ghia is a tad more flamboyant and rarer than a Zagato. That's all hypothetical though.
 

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Coachbuilt 8V's have been the fancy of 'art collectors' for many years now. Any serious thoughts of enthusiasts purchasing such cars should have disappeared 10 -15 years ago.
 

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Coachbuilt 8V's have been the fancy of 'art collectors' for many years now. Any serious thoughts of enthusiasts purchasing such cars should have disappeared 10 -15 years ago.
I have no clue what that means. But I find it always troubling to generalize and stereotype about those who have the fortune to acquire such cars. I do not know what an art collector within apostrophes is to be true.

But, to provide a perhaps counter observation to that, I was lucky to drive a 1950 166 Touring Berlinetta and a 1952 212 Inter Vignale today, owned what you might call an 'art collector'. However, that guy drives his art pieces and shares it with his friends. And, no, we treated the cars the way they should be, including reving the Holy Sh*t out of the sweet 2 litre 166, really crashing the crashbox and causing a carburetor fire when we were unable to start a longnose 275 ... I do love 'art collectors' ...

Didn't we discuss exactly that recently?
 

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I can see a 30 page thread coming up on the destruction of cars as an accessible hobby for anyone on less than a multi-national corporation's CEO's wage...not that I'm suggesting Joe who works the GMC line has ever been able to entertain owning such vehicles as a 166 Inter, an Otto Vu or a Gullwing.

Mike seems to be protesting a lot, for someone who 'doesn't understand'.
 

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I can see a 30 page thread coming up on the destruction of cars as an accessible hobby for anyone on less than a multi-national corporation's CEO's wage...not that I'm suggesting Joe who works the GMC line has ever been able to entertain owning such vehicles as a 166 Inter, an Otto Vu or a Gullwing...
I wouldn't bother with even a 1-page thread on that subject. Because it's nonsense. One other active thread on this forum is about a Lancia Fulvia Coupé on eBay, with the current bid below $11k. And Craigslist is chock full of classics, many of which barely break into 4 figures. Those cars don't get their own forum threads, and they don't get many headlines. But it so often helps to read beyond the headlines.
 

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I wouldn't bother with even a 1-page thread on that subject. Because it's nonsense.
Well, each to their own views, I guess. Unfortunately, as you've so quickly noted (reverse snobbery!), I am at the lower end of the collector scale, so I'm feeling the pain of not being in the in crowd. I'd have to say that for every cheap Fulvia, I can raise you an $82k Bianchina or $25k Fiat 850 Spider. Everyday classics propelled into the stratosphere by auction attendees with little grasp on reality - or at the very least, the inability to surf the 'net. Comments on websites such as BaT are a great snapshot of each side of the 'argument', worth having a look at the frustration exhibited there.

Who was it on this forum (?) last year that relayed the tale of an $82k Abarth buyer, who turned to the gent next to him at completion of the auction and asked if he knew what the cars was? Exhibit A: Art collector.

Mike's friend sounds like very interesting and generous chap, with great taste, but doesn't sound like the more-money-than-sense collectors I'm referring to. I guess the confusion comes from feeding words into other posters' mouths.

Cheerio!
Duane
 

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SUggestion 1: Out of respect to other forum members, I suggest to discuss the 8V cars in this threat - For the only reason because we love the cars. Attached a few pictures - mostly Vignale and probably not as expensive as a Zagato or Ghia to buy for obvious reasons.

Suggestion 2: Good discussion (heated as always) on the other topic but I would move that discussion into the off section category if you guys desire to continue.
 

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Well, each to their own views, I guess. Unfortunately, as you've so quickly noted (reverse snobbery!), I am at the lower end of the collector scale, so I'm feeling the pain of not being in the in crowd. I'd have to say that for every cheap Fulvia, I can raise you an $82k Bianchina or $25k Fiat 850 Spider. Everyday classics propelled into the stratosphere by auction attendees with little grasp on reality - or at the very least, the inability to surf the 'net. Comments on websites such as BaT are a great snapshot of each side of the 'argument', worth having a look at the frustration exhibited there.
Duane,

Not that it matters, but for the record I'm very much at the same end of the scale as you. I just don't feel as much pain about it as you apparently do. I regularly hang out with guys whose financial positions and car collections far, far exceed mine. But neither they nor I ever make any issue of it.

Perhaps your experience has been different. But IMHO focussing on frustration doesn't make life better. And although you can easily point to guys with too much money and too little knowledge spending absurd sums on specific cars--a world whose epicenter must be Scottsdale in January, with the prime-time TV cameras turned on--the point remains that having and spending a lot of money on a serious car collection doesn't necessarily make someone an "art collector" rather than a genuine car guy. And it's ungenerous to suggest otherwise. End rant, and my last word on the subject on this thread.
 

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... where is the 4th step when you need it ... Back to 8V's?
 

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Mike,

To have taken it to another forum would only have encouraged the discussion--something I have no wish to do.

But back to the Otto-Vu. The Supersonic looks very familiar; I assume it's our local one(?). That top photo (silver/dark red roof) must be Vignale, as it exhibits their characteristic light touch with the grille and surround. But is the red w/ black roof and hood stripe also Vignale? It's interesting from the front, but I wonder what those fins and roof line look like from the rear quarter.
 
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