Alfa Romeo Forums banner
1 - 20 of 82 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
419 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·


the “5” in the serial number looks strange. Also it has provisions for hydraulic clutch and some strange brackets in the engine compartment…

Product Vehicle Gas Automotive design Automotive exterior

Aircraft Vehicle Airplane Automotive lighting Aerospace manufacturer
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
889 Posts
The support of the brake booster in the engine compartment is actually the one for the versions with hydraulic clutch low pedals.
A change of body?
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
17,058 Posts
Paint the f'ing chassis number area. Gosh I hate it when people do this. Looks like poo, and if you cannot read a chassis number when painted there are big problems

Same with top tanks of radiators, paint them ... a 60s+ car is not a 1910s vintage brass car

Rant over
Pete
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,889 Posts


the “5” in the serial number looks strange. Also it has provisions for hydraulic clutch and some strange brackets in the engine compartment…

View attachment 1719249
View attachment 1719250
Hello Marcel and Sergio,

The first two digits of the chassisnumber aren't aligned properly.
You already mentioned the third digit.
The fifth digit has another digit stamped beneath it, so it appears.
You and Sergio mentioned some other features that seem strange on a GTA 1300 Junior.

Chassisnumber #775967 is mentioned in Alleggerita with a lot of raceresults.
Whether this is the real car?

Ciao, Olaf
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
276 Posts
I'm missing the rivet holes in the front and rear fenders for the "GTAm body kit" of picture 47 and 49...

Also missing... anchorage points - or the remaining scars - for the roll cage...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,477 Posts
Paint the f'ing chassis number area. Gosh I hate it when people do this. Looks like poo, and if you cannot read a chassis number when painted there are big problems

Same with top tanks of radiators, paint them ... a 60s+ car is not a 1910s vintage brass car

Rant over
Pete
I have noticed it (outline) and a well know restorer pointed out to me that one can notice, on un-repainted cars (car as original from the factory at the Serial number stamping), what appears to have been the outline of some masking ( tape) temporarily placed over the serial number to reduce primer build up over the numbers. The tape appears to have been removed before final colour paint. Thus yielding a crisp number stamping.

Ken
 
  • Like
Reactions: PSk

·
Banned
Joined
·
625 Posts
Honestly, something "strange" with the VIN engraving is noticeable. Compared with an undoubted one, the differences are noticeable. The observation of the different firewall in the initial photo and the one with colored bodywork is also correct. The rest does not matter. Hydraulic clutch command on cars produced in 1969 (and the car in question is a 1969 model) already existed. Even the riveting is correct, as factory certification is and also period documents. The restoration is done to the rule of art. Rather strange is the lightened spare wheel well, which was not common on the GTA Juniors (it existed though!). However, the car appears convincing, it depends on the asking price. It is no less (but not even more) authentic than many others.
Rectangle Wood Font Automotive exterior Material property
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,470 Posts
Honestly, something "strange" with the VIN engraving is noticeable. Compared with an undoubted one, the differences are noticeable. The observation of the different firewall in the initial photo and the one with colored bodywork is also correct. The rest does not matter. Hydraulic clutch command on cars produced in 1969 (and the car in question is a 1969 model) already existed. Even the riveting is correct, as factory certification is and also period documents. The restoration is done to the rule of art. Rather strange is the lightened spare wheel well, which was not common on the GTA Juniors (it existed though!). However, the car appears convincing, it depends on the asking price. It is no less (but not even more) authentic than many others. View attachment 1719338
Even the AR is a little funky, The font of the 5 is not even close, and the spacing is off. My 68 has a riveted spare tire well, the 75 does not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
276 Posts
... Hydraulic clutch command on cars produced in 1969 (and the car in question is a 1969 model) already existed.
Yes, hydraulic clutches came with the introduction of the 1750 by the end of '67 but ONLY for the 1750-series.

All other Giulia's had to wait until Jan. 69 to receive hydraulic clutches.

Besides that, a hydraulic clutch adds weight so it has no sense on a GTA as these are all about weight saving...

This GTA is produced in october 1968 and should have a "cross over" air filter with the actual filter housing on the left side... the bracket for this filter house is also missing...
What's visible on this air filter spot are two little hooks for the water bag... which clearly indicates that this car has a post Jan. 1969 body!

This is the engine bay of GTA 1300 Junior AR 775 882 from 1968, notice the cross over air filter, the location of the blue water bag and the different brake booster bracket:


This AR 776131, one of last GTA Jr.'s built... it still has a cross over air filter (and a mechanical clutch). Notice also the different bracket(s) for the radiator:

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,422 Posts
The shell does not appear consistent with the period pics:

No trace of holes or reinforcements for the sliding block in the trunk floor ...
No modified inner fender for the cold air box ...
No trace of roll bar or cage ...

Also sports a GT radiator and mounts ...
Bolt holes in the trunk floor for GTA specific spare tire clamps missing ...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,477 Posts
Ken, yes, all my 60s cars had have that "taped" aspect on the VIN stamping. I think all did, not just GTAs or other low-production cars.
Andrew
I will have seen it on 1750 GTVs
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
419 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
A aluminium spare wheel well is nothing unusual on GTA1300, all 3 Zetor cars for example had them. Maybe a racing option - or the Italian way of taking what is just available in the shelf 😅

also the provided documents is just a collection of newspaper clips, the Alfa “certificate” of no value, as it only confirms a production number not the car (and it doesn’t take much effort to get one)…

also in one picture, the rear seat wall is open, in the next it’s closed again. But not with the central support bracket…
also the riveting on the rear seat wall is not correct.
Although in the booth, no support brackets for the sliding block.

the figment of the bronze block attachment to the rear axle is not Orginal, see the Allen bolts.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
625 Posts
You are too strict. For heaven's sake, I do not question any of the objections, which are generally correct, but using this criterion, the majority of cars (even yours!) would not pass the exam. Almost all GTA Js (even GTAs!) Intended for use today are restored using current criteria and with recently available and produced spare parts. If I'm not mistaken, someone in this forum has posted a useful guide on how to classify “reborn” historic cars. The GTA J in question, with all the defects listed, still remains an acceptable car, it depends on the price, I repeat. Below, the advertising text regarding the 1300 GT, from which the bodies for the GTA J also came. The criterion for choosing the bodies was never specific, and they had to be picked at random.
"The 1.3 version of the Alfa Romeo GT was launched on the market in 1966. Very similar to the Giulia Sprint Gt, it differs externally only for the grille (the Junior has only one horizontal chrome), the design of the wheel cups and the rear lettering. The car has undergone continuous improvements over the years. In particular, in 1969 (production of the 'modernized' version however begins in the second half of 1968) with hydraulically operated clutch, stabilizer bar also at the rear, braking limiter on the rear wheels, wider tires 165x14 on request (instead of 155x15), panels in sound-absorbing material to improve comfort. Inside, the dashboard is renewed, now with the two humps that incorporate the speedometer and the rev counter. "
It is also possible that at the time the customer asked for the hydraulic version of the clutch, otherwise not provided for the "standard" GTA J, and this is reflected in the car offered. As for the certificate of the factory, I agree that it is not that great, but if someone has a better one, I would be happy to see how it is made. Finally, Pietrino Tali is a well-known name in the GTA J world (related to Balduzzi), and I don't see what's wrong with his connection to the car.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
419 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Too strict? Or do we have certain people who - with what ever own interest - are trying to talk every ****ty car good… 😉

this car definitely stinks….
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
625 Posts
@ARGTAReg, what is your relation to the seller or restorer of this car?

I see that your book is "lingering around" on the car... were you asked as a consultant or for your expert view during the restoration?

For consultations and expertise, the only relevant source is RIAR Technical Commission. ALL OTHERS are private points of view without any value and certainly not to be considered. I have seen for the first time this specific car in photos of this forum and I have no any interest in it. Herr Renc are you so sure that, for example your GTA J, would be so period of production correct example?
 
1 - 20 of 82 Posts
Top