[Biba69]

Is anyone having problems rubbing with the size of 165 HR15 Vredestein Sprint Classics on their 750 or 101 Spiders?

The 101 Spider came with a set of unused but old off brand 165R15 which have the same diameter as the Classic's.

However, I don't have the front suspension mounted on the 750 so wanted to make sure there won't be a problem. Yes, accident damage can play a part in whether they fit or not.

 

[DaveB]

I would highly recommend using 155's.
Now that there are cost effective options available for 155's
There is no reason to use 165s on a Giulietta or Giulia Spider.
And besides they (165's) just look wrong.
DB

 

[Gordon Raymond]

I've a vintage set of 4 used Pirelli Cinturatos identical to the OEM 165 x 15 Pirelli's that happend to come on my odd '65 Giulia Spider when I bought it new, 50 years ago. However, Dave is 100% correct as most all the Giulia and Giulietta spiders DID come with 155's which fit these cars correctly and look right. The vintage period 165 tires I have also look correct, and do fit my car, but I don't believe these are available anymore. Further they may not fit other spiders as my car is a factory one-off.

 

[Biba69]

Why would tires roughly 5/8" taller look wrong? Because they fill the fender openings a bit closer? This is assuming stock springs of course.

 

[kuni123456]

I had an old Pirelli 165 x 15 tire as a spare, but could not buy new ones, so I brought a set of Pirelli 155 x 15 tires from Lucas tire in Long Beach. The tires are $250.00 each and the tubes are extra. I personally like the old Pirelli CN36 175/70 15 tires that were on my car forty years ago, but you cannot buy new ones today. I heard that Pirelli might make the tires again.

 

[DaveB]

Another thing to consider is the 165 tires generally do not fit into the spare tire carrier correctly on spiders, speedo calibration will be off,
I have had both size tires on many different spiders (over 30 of my own giuliettas)
155s feel better on the car when driving to me, lighter steering, more finesse.
Although its a small difference in size they just don't look right. Just sayin.
A different question would be why use 165's anyway.
155 Vredesteins can be bought for $100 a piece,
I have Michelin 155's on a 58 normale, 155 vreds on a 61 normale and 155 Pirellis on a 58 veloce,
DB

 

[30931]

165x15 Michelins rub the front fenders on my 750F.

Doug

 

[tregana]

165x15 Firestone rub the front fenders on my Giulia spider ... I am going to put back 155x15.

 

[HooliganSuper]

Biba,
165s not only usually rub on the front fenders but in extreme situations, like turning into a drive way with an elevation change, or a deep gutter, the tire can actually tear the lip of the fender. Ask me how I learned this, (in 1978). You don't want to go back and fix a torn fender on a new paint job. Run 155s they work fine no problem!
Bill Gillham
Jefferson Oregon

 

[divotandtralee]

This subject is getting "tired"....It reminds me of my mother telling me not to play with matches. Use 155's and sell the 165's to someone with a Duetto.. a real Duetto.. not a faux one with 14" wheels

 

[alphil]

155 Vredesteins can be bought for $100 a piece,
I have Michelin 155's on a 58 normale, 155 vreds on a 61 normale and 155 Pirellis on a 58 veloce,
DB

Dave,Which tire of the three do you like best and why?

 

[Gordon Raymond]

Pirelli and Michelin feature the original tread pattern. Back "at-the-time" most users preferred the Pirelli as it was made in Italy, and was a physically lighter tire than the made in Germany Michelin. Being old enough to have raced these cars when new, as required, on street tires, I remember the Pirelli as being a forgiving tire as far as adhesion, with plenty of noise before the let-go. On the other hand, once HOT, it seemed the Michelin may have had more grip, but less warning noises before they let go. Today this is pointless, as though tread patters may remain the same, the casing design of either is probably different, as well as the rubber compound. I have never raced on Vredesteins, and can't comment, other than to say that many DRIVERS of these cars today like them.
Only my opinion from my own experience.

 

[DaveB]

For me, I like the Vreds all things considered, cost, performance etc.
Money no object, I would do the Pirellis.
DB

 

[alfazagato]

Please bear in mind that tyres today have a 10 year life.....up to 5 years on the shelf and 5 years in service. For modern cars this is fine but for our cars 10 years worth of wear is probably very little. So I have moved all my Giuliettas onto 155 Vredesteins, which are great tyres, as I am now starting to have to replace them because of their age rather than wear. The date of manufacture is cast into the side wall and is worth watching when buying "new" tyres. BTW they are the same size as the VW and thus are plentiful and very cheap.

 

[conedriver]

Bill is correct. Way back in the day, I used 165's on my Giulia Veloce spider, and they rubbed during autocross driving with stock springs & shocks. A little bit of hammering at the front wheel opening cured the problem, but I don't think anyone hammers on a 750/101 today...

Biba,
165s not only usually rub on the front fenders but in extreme situations, like turning into a drive way with an elevation change, or a deep gutter, the tire can actually tear the lip of the fender. Ask me how I learned this, (in 1978). You don't want to go back and fix a torn fender on a new paint job. Run 155s they work fine no problem!
Bill Gillham
Jefferson Oregon

 

[bfeng]

Bill is correct. Way back in the day, I used 165's on my Giulia Veloce spider, and they rubbed during autocross driving with stock springs & shocks. A little bit of hammering at the front wheel opening cured the problem, but I don't think anyone hammers on a 750/101 today...

I noticed that the folks racing Giulietta's around here are running 500L15's, which are about the same size as 165's. None of them appear to have had their fenders 'widened'

Is rolling the fenders, and using a stiffer suspension an option?

John

 

[bfeng]

I just got back from a VSCCA event at Lime Rock Park.
Dominic Spadaro and a group of Giulietta's were there and they were all using 185/70-15 Avon tires. They all had somewhat rolled fender lips. Some of these cars are also driven on the street. Mr. Spadaro also mentioned the need to use just the right wheel spacer to avoid rubbing the shock.

So, it seems that with the right setup, it is possible to run 175 and 185/70's on our cars without major problems.

John Feng

 

[divotandtralee]

I just got back from a VSCCA event at Lime Rock Park.
Dominic Spadaro and a group of Giulietta's were there and they were all using 185/70-15 Avon tires. They all had somewhat rolled fender lips. Some of these cars are also driven on the street. Mr. Spadaro also mentioned the need to use just the right wheel spacer to avoid rubbing the shock.

So, it seems that with the right setup, it is possible to run 175 and 185/70's on our cars without major problems.

John Feng

You are absolutely correct..anything is possible. 155's eliminate the endless possibilities.

 

[Biba69]

This thread seems to have gotten along nicely without any input from me.

divotandtralee: I agree with you that real Duettos have 15" wheels. Therefore I have a set of the Duetto 15" wheels which will go on my '69 Spider...if I ever get around to restoring it.

Along with that comment I'll digress and say that going to what I will now say are medium sized tires to small ones was stupid. Going from small ones to giant ones is more stupid. A year and a half ago I bought a more modern car (2007) and it has 18" fronts and 19" rears. As it so happens I will be installing Vredesteins - the ones that were designed by Italdesign (Ultrac Sessanta's). They will be somewhat narrower (very relative) and taller than stock size. The taller is a bit for filling out the fender wells, but mostly to get thicker rubber bands to allow for somewhat more 'give' when driving on SoCal's poorly repaired freeways (think really quick drying concrete with Very Little Time to smooth out the cement).

Client came to see his 101 and we agreed that I'll leave the sandblasting, painting, and installing new tires until the Spider is a runner. Since the tires on it are the same size/height as the 165 Vredesteins, I'll test it out to see if there is any rubbing. Slowly at first, then moving up to what might cause problems. If any even slight problems - which I don't expect, but - we'll go with 155's. Yes, no rolling of the inner fender.

 

[divotandtralee]

uh.uh.....a '69 Spider is not a real Duetto