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I guess its how one looks at it!

Either way, I don't think it will make a hoot of difference if done properly in the grand scheme of things. Steve is right, its far easier to get the belt on and tensioned well initially with one or more pulleys loose. IF you take the pully loose, make sure you use a good torque wrench to redo the pulley holding bolt. ALSO-- Once the new belt is on, and the cam dies in place, take a good quality close up photo of the back side of each cam so you will be able to tell later which marks are which. Im sensitive to it becuase I had to key pulleys to camshaft after repeated slippage.

Most important is to decide whether you want to replace the water pump and make sure you check all idlers, etc.

Steve suggests checking the tsubaki tensioner-- I generally do not do that IF the gap is good and the belt has not slipped/car still in time. Easy enought to do as long as one has a vice to recompress it.

Again, torque wrench for everything.
 

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Discussion Starter #42 (Edited)
Update

Belt removed, new water pump and new bearings installed. Tensioner is good, as per tested like mentioned above. Just waiting on the timing belt from Jason for re-install and tensioning.

I did have sort of a scare when the intake cam rolled on the back side, but it is back in place and all cam locks are secure. Also a bolt sheared when hand tightening in the water pump. But the disasters are now behind me, excited to tension and button up. Could someone be so kind to send me the tensioning procedures of both the timing belt and serpentine as I do not have access to a 24v cardisc and the service bulletin link above does not have a link to the procedure.

I will upload a photo of the belt and how bad it looked as well as some progress photos later tonight. I'm glad I did the belt after seeing it, and I changed the bearings as a precaution even though they were ok. Could the car have been missing because the oil in two of the spark plug wells?

Oh, and the gap of the spark plugs in the car was .032
 

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yes

among other things. Keep your old bearings, prolly OK to throw out the old water pump. Make sure that the 2 little hoses that connect behind the tstat are tightened down!
Saw your edit=== gap = 0.025 and make sure you have the right plugs. With a 0.035 gap I will bet that was the cause of your misfire
Good job you're doing great on this
 

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Ok. Great we got the cm back in place. No biggy right? Ok. There are many ways of doing this. But your on the right track now.
Now work on that stripped bolt for the water pump. Do that first now that you have the cam locks on. One thing at a time. Get all that done, timing belt will arrive next week and we can move on from there.
 

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Discussion Starter #45
Yessir back on track, fortunately it didn't spin as much as I thought, and I just wrenched it back into place and cam locked it down good this time. Yep, all is well and on track.
 

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Did you see my link to TSB in this post above?

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/1161915-post39.html

Send me your old water pump core so I can rebuild it as I have a jig for 12v pump that I can probably drill and tap some extra holes for the side of 24v pump housing shaped different from 12v pump. I have seals and bearings to rebuild 164 pumps.

I will PM you my shipping address.

Steve
 

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Discussion Starter #47
Frustration

I am so frustrated with the fricken waterpump bolt. Ive been fighting with it for hours now. I tried to easy out it, failed. Now im left with a drilled hole in the middle with the bolt still hanging on the sides. It will not budge. Should I drill and retap with helicoil? Can anyone tell me the size to get? or should I just retap and use a larger bolt?
 

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Remove the pump. If there is some of the bolt still left off the block use some vise grips and try to get it off using that. Otherwise drill an hole in it and use an easy out. Should come out unless your using the wrong size easy out. You only put it in by hand so it should not be hard to remove.

Take a picture for us so we can help.

But I do think removing the pump will be best to access it.

I am so frustrated with the fricken waterpump bolt. Ive been fighting with it for hours now. I tried to easy out it, failed. Now im left with a drilled hole in the middle with the bolt still hanging on the sides. It will not budge. Should I drill and retap with helicoil? Can anyone tell me the size to get? or should I just retap and use a larger bolt?
 

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Discussion Starter #49
Waterpump was removed and I tried what you mentioned. Amazing right?! I didn't even get around to tightening it down hard at all yet...Photo on way.
 

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Yikes.
Ok, you need to drill a deeper hole in the bolt. Then you need to get an easy out.
Like this:


Use some PB blaster if needed to soak it. Drill a deeper hole and then get that easy out in there. Should come right out.

Clean up that surface area after too. Could cause a leak.
 

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The 164 Water pump mounting bolt size is an M6 x thread 1.00 x length 22mm or 30mm (6 of each length).

Pretty small sized broken bolt to use an easyout on unless drilled hole in bolt well centered.

Measure depth of other holes and put some masking tape on your drill bit for a depth stop so you don't drill to deep when drilling into bolt.

As for other holes with bolts already out I always clean out each threaded hole with a M6x1.00 tap and also clean up bolt threads with M6x1.00 die or M6x1.00 nut and then use antiseize on threads.

Here is Sears metric set I find handy: http://www.sears.com/craftsman-14-pc-tap-set-metric/p-00952378000P?prdNo=10&blockNo=10&blockType=G10

You are going to probably try to drill bolt out and hope you can get it out so you can retap hole. I expect you will have to see if you can get a M7x1.00 tap and a 15/64" or 6mm drill bit to use for that size tap. M7x1.00 bolt size same size as oil pan bolts and thermostat bolts. The shortest oil pan bolt is M7x1.00x30mm. Now the 12v engine valve cover bolts are M7x1.00x25mm.

Not sure from pix if you broke off a 22 or 30mm long bolt.

If you go with a 6mm helicoil insert repair here is some info:
http://www.helicoil.in/pdf/HeliCoil Catalogue.pdf
 

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I have done an easy out on a water pump bolt. Not difficult as long as Like Steve says it is well centered. Or just drill it out and retap. Steve has some good suggestions.
 

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Discussion Starter #54
Torque

What are the torque values for the essential parts like the idlers, the eccentric bolt, and more...?
 

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All, or at least most of those values are listed in the workshop manual, usually at the end of each chapter.
 

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Water pump covers top bolt in you red outline. Looks like you have correct water pump.

Don't you have alum frame item 7 in first pix that goes over water pump area for timing belt cover to bolt to?

Do you have aftermarket paper/fabric or 24v OEM steel gaskets for item 5 and 2 in second picture?
 

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Discussion Starter #58
Gaskets

Yes I have the gaskets, well now not the water pump because international sent me the wrong one. And also yes I have the aluminum frame I just dry fit the water pump to show that open space.

Did you get my old one?

Thanks
 

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Yes I have the gaskets, well now not the water pump because international sent me the wrong one. And also yes I have the aluminum frame I just dry fit the water pump to show that open space.

Did you get my old one? Thanks
Yes got it thanks.

correct 24v W/P to block gasket is steel 60615714 or 60560199 or 60811792 (probably paper)

correct gasket on top of pump is steel 60615713 or paper 60552316 (IAP 20003)

Steel gaskets about impossible to find now.

Pump should have come with two paper gaskets but usually they are very hard to get to fit right. Next best thing to steel gaskets is black fiber gaskets.

Do they stock a gasket to replace the 60615714 w/p to block gasket not steel but better fit than paper one that comes with pump?

Ask for gaskets by Alfa part number and see what their IAP number(s) is/are.
 

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Discussion Starter #60 (Edited)
Ok so the belt is on and im currently tensioning following the tsb procedure. I have a few questions...

Is the weighted arm supposed to move up and down as i rotate the crank? I know that the tsb says just be sure the arm doesnt fall bellow horizontal.
 
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