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thanks
so for removing the oil pan on my 24v i only need :
open the sub frame bults pn pasenger side
the 11 mm hand made tool that we saw on this tred
and thats it ? no damage to the oil pamp ?
 

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thanks
so for removing the oil pan on my 24v i only need :
open the sub frame bults pn pasenger side
the 11 mm hand made tool that we saw on this tred
and thats it ? no damage to the oil pamp ?
What language is this in anyway? :confused: These mobile devices are destroying readability and I'm about to just ignore any post that I have to decipher. Makes this forum (or any other) no fun and just downright unpleasant to participate in. Of course if you are from another country and English is not your first language all is excused, but please update your location so all can see where you are from and we can understand the reason for the spelling errors.
Charles
 

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Discussion Starter #23
thanks
so for removing the oil pan on my 24v i only need :
open the sub frame bults pn pasenger side
the 11 mm hand made tool that we saw on this tred
and thats it ? no damage to the oil pamp ?
Yes. I mean, follow the procedure that Steve has in his sticky, but with the additional (and maybe not necessary) steps of fabricating the special 11 mm hand tool and loosening the subframe on the passenger side.

To make the 11mm tool, I had to not only cut a slit for bolt clearance, but also reduce the height of the tool by quite a bit. So reduce material in the direction of the axis coincident with the hole of the wrench.


What language is this in anyway? :confused: These mobile devices are destroying readability and I'm about to just ignore any post that I have to decipher. Makes this forum (or any other) no fun and just downright unpleasant to participate in. Of course if you are from another country and English is not your first language all is excused, but please update your location so all can see where you are from and we can understand the reason for the spelling errors.
Charles
Or you could use your brain and infer what he was saying. Whine somewhere else.
 

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thanks very much fourmotioneer * 2......

chazzyd, i am realy sorry that i am hard to understand, i will try harder. but yes english is not my firest lang.

i think thats what nice here, we can share nolage no metter were we are in the globe.
and yes the ipad is a nice tool but i dont know why the copy paste is terrible.

i wil try harder

thanks every one.
 

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"I am really sorry that I am hard to understand,"

Don't worry about it. It's understandable. When I've tried using another language, it comes out much worse. Usually have to resort to hand/arm waving, etc, something that doesn't translate well on the BB.
 

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American English is hard enough for me!

I wish I could learn a second language. When I lived in Japan about 45 years ago I got where I could speak some but don't ask me to try to write any of the characters they used to write it. I have forgotten more than I knew now.

I am trying to do some learning of Italian doing an Immersion course on DVDs now but not very easy. I need to practice at my friends house as his wife is from Italy and he is pretty good at it too. Since they have been married almost 50 years he has a head start on me.

My daughter does better by far than I do. She took 3 years of Latin then 3 years of Spanish and she is in her third year of American sign language now. She is Hispanic by birth but English is her first language as we adopted her when she was 5 months old. She seems to do well with Spanish and got good marks in sign language. Her teacher is deaf and makes them sign in class and they have to go on field trips to deaf people's events. Can you imagine going to a deaf mute softball game and conversing about the game?

Alfa content - I finally felt well enough to bend my neck enough today to get into My Beloved 164s. So I drove my BB1 164L home tonight. I still don't feel recovered enough from my back surgery to drive my 5-speed 164S aka BB2. Maybe tomorrow.

I did lay under Tra's Wife's 164L enough to instruct him how to work on rear crossmember brake valve linkage. He had to drop rear crossmember to remove long suspension arm bolts so he could replace linkage that contols valve in panic stops.
 

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Reminds me of an old joke...

What do call someone who speaks three languages? - TRILINGUAL
What do you call someone who speaks two languages? - BILINGUAL
what do you call someone who speaks only one language? - an American
 

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Reminds me of an old joke...

What do call someone who speaks three languages? - TRILINGUAL
What do you call someone who speaks two languages? - BILINGUAL
what do you call someone who speaks only one language? - an American
I am guilty as charged of that last one!
 

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Yes, being raised in the USA, speaking American as the first language, is a problem, as while we might like to learn other languages, the question becomes, which one. We have Norwegian, French, Italian, Thai, Japanese, Mexican, Indian, and Chinese, etc, friends and business associates. We also travel to many different countries, so... which language to learn in depth? We all tend to pick up words, phrases, and expressions in other languages, but that's usually just enough to get you into trouble, lol. Too many to choose from, so one chooses one which perhaps just tickles your fancy, to be of little use. So, most say, why bother.

For many, learning another language, unless started in preschool, is pretty darn difficult as an adult learner. Our sponge like brains just don't soak up something new as it did when we were very young.

Alfa related? Well, I did try to study Italian when I bought my first Alfa. Carlo and Lino talked soooo fast, I ended up giving up, renewed somewhat only when we traveled to Italy decades later, and I had to read the rental Alfa Giulietta Owners manual, of course written in Italian.
 

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kobbi...we appreciate your input on the bb. Your attempts at English are also very much appreciated and very understandable:)
 

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hi and thanks for all the support :)

i am 45 years, live in israel so my lang is hebrew ( שלום לכולם ) that hi every one in hebrew.
i have lernd english at school of corse but used it only in trips at the world, so mostly speaking and not writing.
i also speak arabic and romenian.

writing was always hard for me even in hebrew as my 9 grade techer wrote on one of my composit that i wrote "poor language".
i think that the main resson is that i alwayes didnt like to read books, i think that books enrich the language and helps you write better.

my hobbies, home theater, alfa, and many other made me write and read in english so i think and hope i will do better, but i realy think that every one in this forom if want to can understand me even if an e become an a or an u or o.
thanks every one for supporting mentaly and of course tecnicaly to my 1994 super.
 

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Greetings fellow 164 owners. I haven't spent much time on the car in the last 6 months given other commitments, and it's been running pretty well thanks to previous advice from all of you. I'm a little bit stumped today though and I hope the 24V experts are still monitoring this post.

I've had a slow leak from the oil pan ever since I bought this car (24V). My mechanic neighbor has been keen to tackle it so after reading various posts we set to getting the pan off this weekend. What a drama... We are at the stage where all of the bolts are out (including the tricky one just in front of the right rear engine mount - after butchering 2 11mm spanners). The RTV holding the pan on has been split - there were patches with no RTV and the bolts had been massively over tightened squeezing the RTV out so at least I've found the cause of the leak!

The problem now is we just can't get the pan to clear the oil pump. The subframe has been dropped and the engine lifted as far as we can - its limited by the cambelt cover hitting the attachment point of the top dog-bone mount. I've tried all sorts of rotating of the pan and nothing seems to work. It's the actual oil pump, not the oil pick up that is blocking removal - I need around one more inch of clearance. I've actually removed the three 6mm allen bolts that hold the oil pump to the engine block but the pump doesn't want to drop away. Do you think I need to remove the pump? If so, what do I need to dis-assemble to remove it.

From reading through the posts again it looks like I just need to drop the subframe more...
We've removed ALL of the subframe bolts (left / right / front / back) and disconnected the engine and gear box mounts but it still seems to be held up. Do we need to remove the steering rack bolts too?
Mine is a RHD car, is it possible the steering linkages are preventing the subframe from dropping on the right hand side?

Do we just need to be more vigorous with prying the subframe away from the body of the car?
Any hints for dropping the subframe further?

Any advice would be very much appreciated!
 

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@DanNZ sorry you never got a response here. I just pulled my pan (Q4). It does take some vigorous prying to get the subframe you drop enough to rotate the pan. You essentially rotate it almost 90 degrees counterclockwise (if you are looking at the pan from underneath the car) to unhook it. I had the rear motor mount bracket removed, and the hoses out of the way.

I fabricated the 11mm tool and oh my, I cannot recommend it at all. I also had to bend another 11mm wrench to access the bolt from the side to break the bolt loose. The open 11mm was just spreading open. The Q4 casting must be different enough from the standard 24V casting - it is definitely not possible on the Q4. You can get the 11mm bolt within about 1/4” and it bottoms out on a rib on the casting.

I learned this time around that it is possible to remove the rear bracket from the starter motor, with the starter motor in place. This then allows removal of the motor mount bracket. Honestly, I would just plan on removing the bracket and making your life easier.
 

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Thanks for the reply.

We’ve had the pan off again. We actually ended up replacing the tricky bolt obscured by the rear mount with a stud and a narrow nut, plus grinding a shallow depression in the pan lip to make removal in the future easier (hopefully you can picture that!). It was tricky but we managed to fashion an 11mm ring spanner to get the bolt out in the first Instance.

Unfortunately after reassembling everything it looks like I still have a weep of oil coming from somewhere around where the oil filter and oil cooler lines join the block. I haven’t gone back to examine the parts manual but I think I’ll need to take that bracket off next... any advice there would be appreciated!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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@DanNZ i have done that job too. I had the motor out for a rebuild (standard 164 LS / Super 3.0), put it back in and had a massive oil leak between that mount and the block. In my case someone had previously had that mount off and had added a nice thin layer of clear silicone (!). When removing and reinstalling and going unnoticed, that created a massive leak.

the large o-ring on the side the the mount that faces the block should usually be replaced. Through thermal cycles they age. Usually if you take off that mount the o-ring will look and feel almost flush with the surface, and if you pry it out it will have a square cross section. Not good! Replace it. That should be your issue. Hopefully it’s not your oil pan seal in that area.

you will need to remove the bracket off of the end of the starter motor. Tricky but doable. 8mm nuts secure it to the back of the starter. I used an 8mm swivel socket and extensions. easier than removing the whole starter.

the 12v cars never had such a bracket. I have to wonder if the car could to without.
 
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