[Mikethree]

Hey guys , i recently recived two engines one a 1600 the other a 2000, i planned on selling the 1600 and rebuilding the 2000 for my self , i want to increase hp in the 2000 , so i am thinking of going for high compression pistons , lightened flywheel , and maybe cut the head to second stage (making the bore and stroke closer)
What do you guys suggest?
And does anybody know where i can find 2000 high compression pistons ?


Regards

 

[Alfajay]

....maybe cut the head to second stage (making the bore and stroke closer)

Sorry, but I have no idea what that means. Milling the head will increase the compression ratio, but it won't change either the bore or stroke.

does anybody know where i can find 2000 high compression pistons ?

Try Spruell Motorsports: http://www.spruellmotorsport.com/pistons-c-22_2416_2346.html?page=3&sort=4a

 

[alfaparticle]

There is lots of information here http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/spider-1966-up/304825-79-spider-dyno.html on building a high output 2L motor for road use. I am still developing it and hoping/expecting around 185 HP. Ask me anything that you don't understand but please post in that thread.
Thanks.

 

[Mikethree]

Sorry, but I have no idea what that means. Milling the head will increase the compression ratio, but it won't change either the bore or stroke.



Try Spruell Motorsports: Alfa parts and other Sports Car Performance Parts

Thank you for your response , basicly i was saying milling the had , thank you for the link ill deff look into it , i am still looking around before i start and going to use 1600 motor sell it to help the 2000 build

 

[alfaparticle]

Do good research if you decide to buy high compression pistons. There have been issues with some of them.

 

[DT62370]

Best advice is probably - start with making a budget on how
much you're willing to invest in it.
High comp. pistons is only part of it. Add cams, refurbishing the
head with guides, valves, springs, seals plus having it milled.
Add liners, gaskets, chains, new water pump, potentially new
oil pump, better or refurbished distributor. Then comes carbs either 45 mm or having them overhauled and re-jetted. If Spica probably
expenses to have it checked. Then comes another important part,
a lighter clutch, other rods and the list goes on and on.
I'm in the process myself, love what I'm doing like so many others, but it's easy to get carried away on a late night surfing for fancy parts.
Oh yeah, set aside a bit for good tools as well like comp. tester, torque wrench, valve removal tool, seat cutter if you plan on doing all by yourself, a proper engine stand and so on.
Not to take away your motivation to do it, just experience.
All the best with it.
Thomas

 

[Mikethree]

Hi thank you for your response , and i share the same fun as you , i had that experience with the 1600 motor and its a big pay off at the end , i do have a budget but imhave an extra 1600 that i will sell to help me go over the budget , i have all the tools for it , the head i will get milled , and the rest you said i agree and probably do also , once it is complete ill post it on here , hopefully i can get 200Hp out of it , i do have a question , do you guys think electronic distruibuiter s are worth it?

Regards

 

[GTA R]

I, and quite a few others on here, wouldn't be without my 123 Distributor.
I have the early one with fixed advance curves, but found the one that suits my modified engine very nicely.
Starts better, smoother running, very reliable.
Steve

 

[Mikethree]

, ill deff get one then even for my 1600
Cheers

 

[gigem75]

Having built several non stock motors I am of the mind to resurface the head as little as needed to get it flat for a good seal. These heads are getting up there in age and have most likely have been cut and are getting to the min head height. Doing so leaves meat on the bone for future resurfacing. There are other ways to get higher compression. Most folks use the later motronic pistons 10 to 1. They are not exactly as advertised cr wise but higher than stock and have a improved dome design for more efficient combustion. Couple that with a nicely ported head, cams, exhaust, and other things can get you a very nice reliable motor.

 

[alfaparticle]

I, and quite a few others on here, wouldn't be without my 123 Distributor.
I have the early one with fixed advance curves, but found the one that suits my modified engine very nicely.
Starts better, smoother running, very reliable.

I second that emotion.

Most folks use the later motronic pistons 10 to 1. They are not exactly as advertised cr wise but higher than stock

I measured it at 9.7.

 

[gigem75]

The RML dizzy has a great curve that gives good low end pull and top end zoom. Top that off with you are not paying for curves you will never use and you end up with a great value.

 

[Lani]

Piston dome

Having built several non stock motors I am of the mind to resurface the head as little as needed to get it flat for a good seal. These heads are getting up there in age and have most likely have been cut and are getting to the min head height. Doing so leaves meat on the bone for future resurfacing. There are other ways to get higher compression. Most folks use the later motronic pistons 10 to 1. They are not exactly as advertised cr wise but higher than stock and have a improved dome design for more efficient combustion. Couple that with a nicely ported head, cams, exhaust, and other things can get you a very nice reliable motor.

Correct me if im wrong, but I was of the impression that the high dome on these pistons was due to raising the compression and not to improve combustion ?
Im not sure that high dome pistons helps combustion at all.

What about milling the block and liners instead of the head ? how much room is there from the top piston ring to the surface ?

 

[gigem75]

The higher compression Motronic style pistons (not shown above) actually have a flat top, think of the top half inch of the dome being cut off, which improves the burning of the fuel, flame fronts, propagation, stuff like that. The pistons above sure look nice that's for sure and I've no doubt they are great at what they do but considering price vs performance I'll go with the Motronics everytime. Whatever you do don't do or not do just because someone says so. Get all the info and you decide, we're here to help
It's not feasible to start decking down the crankcase for any number of reasons.

 

[Alfar7]

Stock 10.0 to 1 Motronic pistons

You may have trouble finding these anymore. Joe at Centerline had the last of them and cost was higher than before. CR is really less than 10 to 1 as Ed noted.

Shape of the dome was to improve squish area and flame travel. With .025 to .030 off the head they work quite well for street motors at 10.5 to 1.

Spruell`s CRs are overstated as well...

Someone should sell .010 oversize ( to stock bore size) true 10.5 to one pistons which would make re-building less expensive and leave the liners stronger. Not much to be gained from the 1mm overbore anyway.

 

[ljayr]

History Lesson

I am in need of a history lesson. From what engine does the Motronic piston come from?

 

[papajam]

1990-1994 Spiders.

 

[DT62370]

Agree with Richard regarding Motronic, they are hard to get.
In Europe it only seems to be Alfaholics who has them, and price
is up, above 1000 USD with 20% VAT
Managed to get a set with me home to Denmark when I was in Houston last week. Bought as set with liners from Spruell at a resonable 635 USD.
Back to the thread, 200 hp from a 2 liter N.A. Nord is going to be hard work (read A LOT OF MONEY) It may even require work on the crankshaft itself to get things as light as possible and most likely an engine characteristic more for race than road.
I don't know what a spare 1600 engine can be sold for in order to
cover expenses, suppose it all depends of condition but I managed to
buy two spare engines for 250 USD each. One came with Dell Orto carbs the other with starter and alternator.

 

[Mikethree]

I dont plan on the engine covering most expensis , and dont forget european and usa market are diffrent , here in Portugal 1600 motors can b sold up to 1000 euros or more ,t reconditioned . Even one tail light from alfa 1600 can cost 150 euro each

 

[DT62370]

I'm actually in Denmark Europe :smile2:
I used to know an elder gentlemen who had
a lot of spares for an 1600 he wanted to sell.
Mechanical as well as electrical plus interior parts.
All in good condition. Let me know if you want
his contact details.