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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all!

I’m about to send my car to the crusher.. not really, I love it.... however, it’s been years fighting a starting issue...

I finally (forced by Covid-19) have time to work on her!

I have pulled the motor (again, don’t want to do it anymore...) starter rebuilt, new solenoid, trusted shop. Everything is good! New rings, fresh hone, new head gaskets (German) and ***? No power to starter... i’m Assuming weak wires at this point as the car has been 2-4 years resting.... I jump from fire wall (same as solenoid) and just a click click - mild, not like a bad battery. Battery is one day old and charged overnight....

This is my 3-4th solenoid.... since I have headers... it requires the motor to come out to F! with this stuff.....

Please, please, please someone help me. If you can help, I will Venmo/Zelle $100 (negotiable!!!!!)

Please don’t make me pull this f—-ing motor again.....

Thank you!
[email protected]
612-868-3666 (call/text)

100% serious
 

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1984 GTV6, 1973 Berlina, 1987 Milano
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I would either try a different starter, or replace the wires. Its possible you wires are corroded inside the housing and losing voltage.

Thinking out loud, can you test the resistance of the wires?

Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter #3
That is where my my points me too :-(

It was checked-out and reconditioned by a local shop.... new solenoid - said it wa small good. Now I learn about spacers....

I really don’t want to pull the motor again....
 

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I had a stock starter with CSC headers and they were too close causing the starter to overheat. I fitted a Brise axial starter and there is so much clearance that the starter can be removed and replaced without removing the headers. Maybe the exhaust heat has got to the connector on the power cable and caused it to go high resistance. It is important to have an effective heat shield between the starter and the headers.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I will post my results... I wouldn’t wish this on my worst enemy.... well, maybe I would. :-/ no. It SUCKS!
 

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If you can somehow get a multimeter probe between the headers and onto the starter terminal (can use a long screwdriver and an alligator clip as long as you are careful to not short it against the headers!), you can do a proper voltage drop test of the starter wires.

Check both terminal 50 (signal to starter solenoid, smaller terminal) and the main starter positive wire by placing one probe of a voltmeter on the junction connector at the firewall, and the other end on the other end of the same wire at the starter (polarity is not important). Have a helper turn the key to the "start" position, or set up the multimeter so you can see it through the windshield. There shouldn't be more than, say, 0.25V drop when the key is turned---if there is more, like a volt or more, then you have a bad wire or connection between the two points (excessive resistance reducing available voltage: Ohm's Law).

Do the same for the GROUND side. How is your engine ground strap at the left front of the engine to the radiator support? You can also do a voltage drop test here, and at the battery.

If you have a large voltage drop at terminal 50/solenoid activation circuit, the fix is easy. Search the internet for "Bosch WR1," which is a starter relay kit that can be installed in less than 10 minutes.

If the problem is within the heavy cable between the firewall junction and the starter, then you'll probably have do do what is necessary to get at the cable . . . .
 

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Ya, could be your ignition switch if your car hasn’t had a relay fitted. Definitely get a heat shield, a second hand original or a fabric one, need something though. Voltage drop tests are a good idea, don’t forget about the ground wire in the trunk to the battery also.
 

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First thing I would do is check every single connection starting from the battery terminals onward. Disconnect and renew each and every terminal at the wire and clean all contacts. Unseen corrosion inside the terminal at the wire can be the issue. Also, make sure main battery ground wire is making clean metal to metal contact at the body. Same for the main engine to body ground wire and main positive wires. Pull all terminals away from the wire insulation and make sure there is no corrosion inside. Disconnect, clean and renew all connections. Don't bother with voltage drop tests. Even if you find the fault today, after hours of testing, tomorrow you will have the problem again at another spot. Best to simply go through the entire circuit and fix it all at once.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thank you all, will let you know when I get at this, hopefully this weekend.

Much appreciated!
 

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Resistance in the power circuit is hard to measure with a regular meter. The starter may want 100 amps and 0.5 ohm produces a 5 volt drop and that is on top of the drop inside the battery. Inspecting cables and connectors and measuring voltages under load is the way to troubleshoot power circuits.
 

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I'm by no means an expert on this stuff. But may have a clue to consider. A while back, my mechanic needed to work on a starter issue I had on my GTV6. I had a few extra starters laying around, so I took them to a local shop that rebuilds them. I asked that they test these out to see which was in the best condition. They IDed the best one in the pile, but said only that it could be rebuilt much cheaper than the others, from its condition. When I got the starter back from them I noticed it had a shiny NEW Bosch solenoid on it now. I had heard that new solenoids for our cars had been NLA for a long time. So that made me suspicious that this new solenoid was not the exact part needed. My mechanic replaced this combined unit on the car and it did not solve the problem. I did some checking around with others who had expertise on this topic, and found that the wrong solenoid could certainly create the issues I had encountered. I did end up finding a lightly used one to proceed. So it now comes down to now having the right solenoid... or a bad ignition switch. Fingers crossed.

Removing the starter required dropping the exhaust to get at it. So, didn't need to pull the engine. Don't know if any of that helps, but may offer some possibilities on your next attack.
 

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Resistance in the power circuit is hard to measure with a regular meter. The starter may want 100 amps and 0.5 ohm produces a 5 volt drop and that is on top of the drop inside the battery. Inspecting cables and connectors and measuring voltages under load is the way to troubleshoot power circuits.
Exactly. Ironically, what makes the GTV6 so prone to bad/corroded connections and voltage drops----the multiple junction points that are exposed to the elements---make it very easy to measure for voltage drops at various points and isolate a problem!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Have cleaned terminals, the car is very clean and very little corrosion.

Logically, the only thing that has been changed is the solenoid... !

Having pulled the motor many times, I know how it goes together...

Also! I put a different battery on the plenum, grounded it and hit the positive wire directly to the solenoid trigger on the solenoid. Same thing, ‘click’

My deduction after this is that it’s the solenoid... shimming, etc...

I did have the “run-on” issue for a year or two... managed it. Pain in the butt, but managed it...
 

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Put the car in 4th gear, handbake off and push the car until you feel you have turned the engine a little then put it in neutral, handbrake on and try the starter again.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
I tried that yesterday...

All signs are pointing to wires or new solenoid... so far

Again, thank you all for your input
 

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I have experienced New Bosch solenoids that didn't work from the get go.
Whacking the F outa them sometimes helped, but not always
 

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Are you sure you need to pull the entire engine? Maybe try removing the header first to see if you can sneak the starter out.
 
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