[kveldssanger]

Back from the referee - it did not pass but is not far off.

To pass CA smog:
Vacuum advance must be connected and functional (164 Motronic - doesnt use vacuum advance)
The harmonic balancer is missing timing marks which must be present and set to factory specifications (again a result of being 164 Motronic, has a crank trigger on the balancer)
Must provide a passing BAR-97 pre-test prior to re-inspection (test not performed)

Other findings after bringing it out of storage:
The right rear brake is dragging and should be fixed before driving any real distance. I have 2 spare calipers and can provide rebuild kits (already ordered)
There is a vibration that only appears at low speed (maybe 15-20 mph?), my best guess is either the tires have slightly flat spotted from sitting or its time for guibos
The Dakota Digital tach signal converter isnt working so the gauge is reading high. Dakota Digital has agreed to do a warranty replacement

This isnt a terribly long list but I am underwater with work and other projects at the moment, so it is still for sale. New asking price is $9000 to account for the sticky brake/vibration

 

[philip.yo]

PM sent. Thank you. 👍

 

[tizer2]

I'm in process of building a similar sedan, but with a Milano Verde 12v, otherwise I'd be all over this. GLWTS!

 

[racingswim2006]

I really like this car.

 

[peakay]

Hey K, regarding your referee visit, have you considered reporting the engine as a 164 so as to make it easier to comply wince it has the 164 motronic on it? I doubt they are verifying engine serial numbers and it might be easier that way maybe??

 

[kveldssanger]

Thanks for the kind words everyone. It is still for sale and I am open to offers!

For any prospective Ca buyers - an electrical engineer friend has devised a simple way to make the vacuum advance "work" that I would be happy to share. The only missing piece of the puzzle is a stock GTV6 crank pulley (please let me know if anyone has one laying around).

@peakay - it had crossed my mind, but the referee was pointing out discrepancies that were far more minor than 12v vs 24v. e.g., I replaced the intake manifold with one that has the 6C cast into it whereas an 82 would have had only the straight fins.

 

[peakay]

91-93 164s are 12V, but if they are checking fin layouts on intakes then yeah, probably a no-go.

 

[tizer2]

I'll look around for a crank pulley, I might have one and can bring to socal for the convention

 

[Milanoguy]

Hi
You said
"Fuel injection is controlled by a 164 sourced Bosch Motronic ECU. The engine harness is also 164 based but has been fully stripped back, shortened appropriately, and closed out in mil spec heat shrink."
And

To pass CA smog:
Vacuum advance must be connected and functional (164 Motronic - doesnt use vacuum advance)
The harmonic balancer is missing timing marks which must be present and set to factory specifications (again a result of being 164 Motronic, has a crank trigger on the balancer)
Must provide a passing BAR-97 pre-test prior to re-inspection (test not performed)

The GTV6 crank pulley won't have a trigger wheel so it won't work with your Motronic system unless you modify the pulley to add a trigger wheel (this can be done).

What year emission are you needing to hit and how was that year decided upon? is it based on the engine serial number?

More to the point why don't you register the car in a less fussy state? Like Montana or South Dakota who cater to out of state vehicle registrations.

Hope this was helpful

 

[kveldssanger]

I appreciate everyone's efforts to help get the car legal, but at this point I will be selling it either way. I have several other projects that I'd rather focus on, and it is the build that I am interested in more so than having a completed car to drive. I will be continuing to work towards CARB legality as time permits to help with the sale.

@Milanoguy - Understood that a GTV6 crank pulley wont have a trigger wheel, but as you said this is easy to add.
Emissions requirements are based off the engine year. They did not check the engine serial number and went off my word that it is from an '82.
I'm not sure I would say those states cater to out of state vehicle registrations so much as turn a blind eye. I have heard (second or third hand, so with a grain of salt) about cars being impounded for this which is not a risk I am willing to take for a car I would drive regularly, but could be an option for future owners if they are so inclined.

 

[Edgewood121]

Couple of things:

-The SMOG test allows a variation of +/-3 degrees of variance. I mention this because 1982 timing is 5 degrees, so you are allowed to be between 2 degrees and 8 degrees. Motronic I believe is 7 degrees at idle (assuming stock ignition setup). So looks like you would be good with a 2.5 pulley with the added crank trigger. Or you could notch your current pulley with timing marks and punch the letters (since the ref already knows your set-up, you could go to another ref if you went the notching path and probably nothing would be noticed). Current ref might actually even roll with a notched pulley if it looks stock and you mention you replaced it. What exactly triggered the ref to comment on the pulley? Was it purely because of the lack of timing marks? Assuming you have a TDC pointer on the engine too?

-For the vacuum line to the distributor, there is no functional test required (unless it is called out by the emissions sticker for ignition timing testing, which in this case it's not). Only that vacuum is present at the vacuum line (really, that is not part of the test either so the ref might be reaching a bit here...definitely an overreach if he checks for functionality of the advance system). So in theory, you could mount a sealed nipple to nowhere on the body of the distributor and connect a vacuum line to it. What did the ref say he was looking for exactly?

-1982 route is better rather than the Motronic route since there is more slop in those earlier exhaust cut-points.

-Ref doesn't check serial numbers on engines. They can check engine codes though if present but that doesn't apply here (usually comes up on Japanese import motor swaps on US market Hondas).

-Ref didn't care about the intake manifold because it doesn't matter if it was swapped as long as all the emissions provisions are present. No look-up is required, though the fact that the intake manifold looks very much OEM helped moved things along for comfort.

If you have time, it would be nice to see a pretest with tail pipe readings, just to make sure the cat/etc is cleaning things up just enough to pass. Any smog shop should gladly be able to do it.

Sounds like you are really super close on this. Looks like there are a lot of folks here rooting for you!

 

[kveldssanger]

The ref noticed the missing marks on the pulley as he attempted to verify that the timing was set to factory specs.

I do intend to get a pre-test done (in fact it is required before I can set up another appointment) but need to fix the sticky brake caliper/vibration and get another temporary moving permit before doing so.

Here is the exact verbiage provided by the ref of requirements before re-inspection:

Timing - Set timing/idle to factory specifications
Timing - Install/replace timing indicator
Miscellaneous Emission Controls - Other, vehicle must be made testable (vibration at 15mph, 1st test on the rollers)
Timing - Other, provide vacuum diagram for vacuum advance
Miscellaneous Emission Controls - Other, must provide a passing BAR-97 Pre-test

He also mentioned that there should be a 5 deg drop in advance when the vacuum line is disconnected which made me think that he did intend to do a functional test.

 

[Edgewood121]

Did you show the ref the emission label from post #20 by chance? That has the vacuum routing diagram, so now is a good time to check to make sure those components are there and connected to the correct ports if you haven't already. Should not be functional but just visual. In general, might be a good idea to get a repro sticker and stick it under the hood for future smog techs. Will save the new owner many headaches if the car stays in California.

Ref should not be performing a functional test on vacuum advance ignition timing. My guess is since there was no emissions sticker present, he went the generic route and also poked around. Then I found this thread;

1979 Alfetta Sport Sedan, Busso V6 Swapped

Back from the referee - it did not pass but is not far off. To pass CA smog: Vacuum advance must be connected and functional (164 Motronic - doesnt use vacuum advance) The harmonic balancer is missing timing marks which must be present and set to factory specifications (again a result of...

www.alfabb.com

Post #1 mentions that the Smog field manual says to pull the vacuum hose (this is an error in their field manual) but the underhood label does not specify removal of the vacuum hose. Since you didn't have emissions label info present, the ref went to the field manual.

Per the emissions label, pulling the vacuum line is not part of checking base idle timing. Post #7 from this thread shows factory procedure for checking base ignition timing (for a 1981 but I'm sure it's the same for 1982 but best if you could find the factory manual info for 1982 and print it out for the ref):

GTV6 timing marks - again

Hello, new member here. I found an old thread on this subject, but it didn't answer my question: Which line on the crank pulley indicates top dead center? On my '81 GTV6 I see this: R|P|F I think P = TDC, but which line is P? Everything is equally spaced. I'm guessing that the line between P and...

www.alfabb.com

There is a reason for not pulling the vacuum hose at idle...because it does nothing anyway. There is no vacuum at idle because vacuum is ported. #3 from the legendary Papa Jam:

vacuum retardation device

Moving on from previous thread about timing marks... I pull the vacuum line to the throttle body and nothing happens anymore. I say anymore because last night, it did. But not what it was supposed to do. On pre-84 cars pulling the line should advance the timing, right? Well, I pulled my line...

www.alfabb.com

Ref was generalizing with the 5-deg drop in advance from pulling the vacuum line. Some cars you may see (when the system is designed to work that way of course) but from what I am seeing, the 1982 engine management system is not set up that way for base idle. This is important because if you go back and the ref checks for vacuum at that line and doesn't see it, he may try to fail. Best to bring factory manual documentation to show him that the 1982 engine management system has no vacuum at idle and that's why there is no call out for disconnecting the hose for setting base timing. But now you may need to mount the 2.5 throttle body if the ref makes an issue of ported/manifold vacuum routing and function. Really, though, I think the ref will go with what you present. They are very reasonable.

I believe 1984 and later cars require the hose to be removed and plugged, which probably explains the mix-up in the ref's field manual.

More importantly, I didn't realize that stock ignition timing is 5 degrees ATDC whereas Motronic is 7 degrees BTDC. Since you can't set timing by moving the distributor on Motronic, you will have to re-orient the crank trigger wheel to change ignition timing to get within the 3-degree variance allowed by SMOG.

Once you get past all of that and the car eventually passes SMOG, then you can throw back on the 3.0 pulley for performance or you could roll with the retarded timing curve from 1982 and see if that impacts performance noticeably, otherwise you will have to swap pulleys every two years for subsequent SMOG tests. Hey, it's a solution!

So doing the above should get you to a 1982 standard. If you went the Motronic 3.0 direction, it will save you all this work, but the exhaust cut-points will be tighter. and with your performance mods, you may want the extra margin from 1982. Knowing what your current exhaust readings could help with the decision process.

Really, you are close on this. As you said previously, not much needed. Just pain in the butt stuff and time.

 

[kveldssanger]

This is all great info as usual Edgewood, thanks.

This particular ref wasnt very communicative during the inspection so I didnt know that was something he was looking for until it was all said and done. I do plan to print out that label and bring it with me at a minimum. Related - if anyone has an overrun valve (functional or not, item B on the diagram) I would be interested in purchasing it.

 

[Edgewood121]

Also try Larry Jr. at Alfa Parts Exchange (APE) for any parts if no luck here.

 

[Neil Martin]

I for one am very impressed you made it this far.

 

[alfasteve]

I have a GTV-6 crank pulley if you are still in need or wanting one. Thanks, Steve

 

[kveldssanger]

Update time. I haven't had much free bandwidth recently and when I do I find myself wanting to work on one of my many other projects. It's time to let this one go - no reasonable offer refused. If there are enough interested people in western Washington I would be happy to ship the car back up there for showings.

Changes since the last update:
Bumpers, front plate, and front turn signals installed for the inspection. Thought it best to look stock
Plugged vacuum lines "connected" with check valves or in-line plugs
Milano airbox and K&N filter installed in place of the cone filter
Front and center guibos replaced along with the center support bearing
Sticky right rear caliper replaced and Porterfield R4S pads on both rears
Got a stock GTV-6 crank pulley (thanks Steve) but it is going to be more involved to swap over than I had hoped, as half the accessories have serpentine belt pulleys. There isnt much room on the 164 pulley to scribe new marks onto but I think that is the better option.

There is still some vibration at load when holding 15 mph that will be an issue for a Ca dyno smog check. Not sure what is causing it and didnt even notice it until it was on the rollers. When driving on the road you skim right past it.

 

[kveldssanger]

Asking price reduced to $7500 and fresh pictures, help me free up some space!