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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I just replaced two bearings for the power belt pulleys. These are called a fixed tightner on the parts list. The two are identical and use the same bearing. It is a SKF # 63004-2RS1. This bearing has to be a 6000 rpm bearing. There is a lesser bearing, but it isn't rated to 6000 rpm. This bearing is a single row bearing.
I put some grease on the inside of the pulley, found a socket that fit exactly over the outter edge and with some gentle persuasion from my press, both bearing went right in. Twenty minutes later I was buttoning up the inner fender liners. The engine is now very quiet again. So I went out to terrorize the neighborhood. Away from the stop sign I hit red line in 4 gears and the car was flying. This is one fine automobile! :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
We could terrorize the Sac neighborhoods on Euro car night! Why don't you plan on bringing your Q up to join with the wife and I at Kool April Nites. It is the weekend of 21st and 22nd. The limit is 2500 cars so you have to register early. Last year I had my old Dodge truck out. We had a 50's sock hop, pancake breakfast and lots of vendors. You can oogle at all the cool hot rods and unrestored vintage cars. For me the hit was a 1909 unrestored Mac Truck that was running and drivable. Looked like a heap of junk but it was all original! Used to be used in the mines up this way.
Alot of fun on a Saturday. :D
 

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This bearing SKF # 63004-2RS1 rated to 6000 rpm ios a official Alfa part#?

"The two are identical and use the same bearing. It is a SKF # 63004-2RS1. This bearing has to be a 6000 rpm bearing. There is a lesser bearing, but it isn't rated to 6000 rpm. This bearing is a single row bearing".
I just replaced two bearings for the power belt pulleys. These are called a fixed tightner on the parts list. The two are identical and use the same bearing. It is a SKF # 63004-2RS1. This bearing has to be a 6000 rpm bearing. There is a lesser bearing, but it isn't rated to 6000 rpm. This bearing is a single row bearing.
I put some grease on the inside of the pulley, found a socket that fit exactly over the outter edge and with some gentle persuasion from my press, both bearing went right in. Twenty minutes later I was buttoning up the inner fender liners. The engine is now very quiet again. So I went out to terrorize the neighborhood. Away from the stop sign I hit red line in 4 gears and the car was flying. This is one fine automobile! :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Official Alfa Part? No. Here is the reason why. If you order the tensioner itself from a AR supplier of parts, you get the whole assembly. You will be spending about $130+ for the two parts. If you buy the bearings you get two for about $80. Your time is minimal and free to replace the two bearings. My guess is that I have 15 min replacing the two bearings not including disassembly time to R&R them from the car.
If you remove the bearings from the tensioners, this is the number that you will get off of the bearing. So, is it a Alfa Romeo part? Not really but is the correct bearing as supplied by AR at the factory.
I would have preferred a double row bearing or a class 7500 series but the guy I was talking to at the counter didn't understand about class. He said that a double row bearing was more thick by 7mm but I didn't want to risk moving the bearing to far off track so I passed.
 

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He said that a double row bearing was more thick by 7mm but I didn't want to risk moving the bearing to far off track so I passed.
Even with a thicker bearing, you would not move the pulley rotating track outward if you turn the pulley around when you install it (see here that I used two 6004 in place of the 63004 to get "double row"). I would suggest turning the pulley around even with the 63004 after the bearing is replaced. The idea is if the pulley ever come loose and start to slide out, it would be blocked (by the engine side) instead of coming out away from the engine where nothing would stop it.

The SKF 63004-2RS1 has a limiting RPM at 11000. The 24V serpentine belt pulleys are much bigger than the 12V idler pulley so they should turn at a lower speed (probably pretty close to engine speed vs the 12V pulley would be turning at twice the engine speed). So, replacing the bearing with the original spec 63004 should be pretty safe and should last for a while.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I remember this thread. If I had opted for double bearings I would have exceeded the cost of buying two new tensioners. Not my original intent. :) I can understand spreading the load on the bearings by doubling up which would add alot of life to the bearings. For now this is a good deal as the car is now back on the road with out fear of a bearing blowing out. I will keep your idea on file and remember this when I get to where I am doing a timing belt job-Toss in a couple more bearings. :)
 

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I remember this thread. If I had opted for double bearings I would have exceeded the cost of buying two new tensioners. Not my original intent. :) ...
I think you missed the "intent" of my reply :) ! I was saying what you did is perfectly OK. I did the same on my LS last year. I went to the bearing store, bought some 63004-2RS1 bearings and replaced them on my LS pulleys. It was at the same time that I also picked up a couple of 6004 (btw, only ~$11 each) to try them on the 12V idler pulley.

However, the primary point of my previous reply is to suggest that I believe it is a good idea to flip the pulleys over when re-installing them on the car. Although the bearing might still be pretty tight inside the pulley, the replacement process does increase the chance that the new bearing might come loose (from the pulley). By flipping the pulleys over, it is just another pre-caution (perhaps unnecessary :) ) to prevent the pulley from "flying" out! I also used to use grease to press bearing in but I now use bearing retaining compound (or a couple drops of green loctite) to prevent possible slippage between surfaces.
 

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I think you missed the "intent" of my reply :) ! I was saying what you did is perfectly OK. I did the same on my LS last year. I went to the bearing store, bought some 63004-2RS1 bearings and replaced them on my LS pulleys. It was at the same time that I also picked up a couple of 6004 (btw, only ~$11 each) to try them on the 12V idler pulley.

However, the primary point of my previous reply is to suggest that I believe it is a good idea to flip the pulleys over when re-installing them on the car. Although the bearing might still be pretty tight inside the pulley, the replacement process does increase the chance that the new bearing might come loose (from the pulley). By flipping the pulleys over, it is just another pre-caution (perhaps unnecessary :) ) to prevent the pulley from "flying" out! I also used to use grease to press bearing in but I now use bearing retaining compound (or a couple drops of green loctite) to prevent possible slippage between surfaces.
This is very true! It does increase the risk a lot!

Becareful and check them often for looseness!
Ciao!
 

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That was on 12v serpentine belt idler not 24v serpentine belt set up. It is way to small OD for 24v set up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I thought I would dig back in to my earlier messages to see if I could find this thread and the part numbers for the 2 bearings. I kept hearing a noise coming from the belt side of the engine on the black 164Q. So this after noon in 106 deg heat, I pulled the wheel and power belt. Sure enough the two idler pulleys were about to fall off the engine. They had enough wobble in them that I am afraid to drive the car to the end of the street. :eek:
So, off to the bearing store tomorrow to get two more bearings! :D
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Bearing Issue Warning!

I think you missed the "intent" of my reply :) ! I was saying what you did is perfectly OK. I did the same on my LS last year. I went to the bearing store, bought some 63004-2RS1 bearings and replaced them on my LS pulleys. It was at the same time that I also picked up a couple of 6004 (btw, only ~$11 each) to try them on the 12V idler pulley.

However, the primary point of my previous reply is to suggest that I believe it is a good idea to flip the pulleys over when re-installing them on the car. Although the bearing might still be pretty tight inside the pulley, the replacement process does increase the chance that the new bearing might come loose (from the pulley). By flipping the pulleys over, it is just another pre-caution (perhaps unnecessary :) ) to prevent the pulley from "flying" out! I also used to use grease to press bearing in but I now use bearing retaining compound (or a couple drops of green loctite) to prevent possible slippage between surfaces.
OK, I admit that someone was absolutely correct and I wasn't thinking. Fortunately the result wasn't catastrophic but very well could have been. You can go ahead and say "I told you so!" because you said it and I didnt think that far ahead.

I was going to take the 94Q down to see AlfaBob and his cars and check out the parts he might have. I pulled the car out of the garage and was idling the car in the driveway warming up. As I was washing the windshield I heard what sounded like something metal falling. I looked under the car and there wasn't anything and the car was still idling. The cat was messing around the garage and I didn't see where he had knocked anything over. I went back and opened the hood, where I found the serpentine belt sitting there not moviong. Quickly turning the car off I looked to find one of my idler pulleys with the new bearing had "FALLEN OFF!" The idler pulley was laying behind the car where it had rolled to. Imagine what that could have been like driving down the road. :eek:

Four solutions: 1. buy a new pulley 2. install bearing with Loctite 3. reverse pulley 4.install bearing and stake the edge of the lip over to retain bearing.

Tomorrow I will reinstall bearing with Loctite, stake the edge over on two sides with a punch and reverse pulley on the engine. No more problems. I wouldn't have never imagined this could have happened.
 

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Crap that would have scared the hell out of me! I have so far had great luck with Alfissimo's Krytox greese treatment on my idler bearing, I would recommend it highly.
 

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Chris thats what happened to me!

Long story short-- lost the serp belt idler pulley at 65 mph going up the 15 freeway. bit of a surprise and a loud bang, etc:eek:-

Can someone post, for the record

1. Serp Idler pulley bearing number, price, and source for 24V car?
2. Any other 24 V bearings that are known?

many thanks, bob
 

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Agree about the Krytox bearing lube. It is quite superior to everyday lubes. Have it in the 91S idler bearing. Should think about using it for the 24v as well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Krytox bearing lube? where is that stuff bought locally? Dealer item? Cost? How do you put it in the bearing? I agree, if you are going to want longevity out of these expensive bearings it wouldn't hurt to put in some top notch high load bearing grease. They are generally packed with just enough grease to do the job for a finite life.
 

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Krytox bearing lube? where is that stuff bought locally? Dealer item? Cost? How do you put it in the bearing? I agree, if you are going to want longevity out of these expensive bearings it wouldn't hurt to put in some top notch high load bearing grease. They are generally packed with just enough grease to do the job for a finite life.
Krytox is not cheap, contact Jason at Alfissimo, he takes the bearing apart, and repacks it with Kytox. Its a grease that is synthetic and holds up very well to the high temperature conditions that makes most of the bearings on our 164's fail.
 

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Krytox bearing lube? where is that stuff bought locally? Dealer item? Cost? How do you put it in the bearing? I agree, if you are going to want longevity out of these expensive bearings it wouldn't hurt to put in some top notch high load bearing grease. They are generally packed with just enough grease to do the job for a finite life.
Yes, I repack most bearings with krytox. The smaller bearings in he 24V serpentine pulley are the same as the 12V serpentine pulley bearing just a larger diameter. All though they are moving slower they will still fail with the hydrocarbon grease used which can handle only 250F.
Protects bearings and other components under high loads or slower speeds. Components run quieter and wear protection is extended

Here are some benefits of Krytox:
Krytox® Lubricants - By DuPont

One main benefit is it can handle up to 617F and as low as -60F.
It bonds to the metal as well to provide almost friction free environment.
Does not effect seals at all.

The only issue is you need to either send me the bearings or I can pack some new ones here. I am not sure what your plan is but I only use SKF bearings which are around $35.00 I don't bother with the $11-15 bearings.

Or if you want new pulleys I can pack those. Either way.

Jason
 

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How to install?

I remember reading somewhere about substituting Fiat part# 4443446, which is a double bearing pulley. Has anyone tried that recently?
I decided to look into alternatives to the stock bearing for my 91 164S and came across this Fiat part# 4443446 option here and on the Alfa 164 digest.

The new part has the same diameter and width compared to the stock pulley which is great.

On the attached picture, the new part is on the left and the pulley from my car is on the right.

Steve posted a useful diagram here: http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/164...alfa-164-12v-v6-belt-routings.html#post229183

My questions are:
a) how do I remove parts #4 from the original pulley and transfer them onto the new one in order to get the new part to bolt onto the tensioner arm (part #7)
b) will those original parts #4 fit on the new pulley?
c) will I need extra washers when mount the new pulley onto the arm?

Cheers folks!
 

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