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-   Spider - 105 & 115 Series (1966-1994) (https://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/spider-105-115-series-1966-1994/)
-   -   Ignition Advice (https://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/spider-105-115-series-1966-1994/683136-ignition-advice.html)

alfalori86 07-16-2019 01:32 PM

Ignition Advice
 
Hello, I have an 86 Spider. Have done much of the routine maintenance but now running a little rough. I am guessing its the ignition because its the only thing I did not replace. I assume we have points/condenser on these cars? How difficult is it to replace items on these cars? I have done points/condenser on other cars. I notice Vick sells an electronic distributor with new coil for $200. Any experience with this? how difficult is it to replace the entire distributor with the electronic one? I can find distributor cap, rotor, but not the points and condenser. I realize the electronic would probably last forever but $200 as opposed to $50 for traditional ignition parts is a big difference.

sloboy89 07-16-2019 02:08 PM

Need a little more information. Does your car have the original Bosch L-Jetronic system? If so, before going and throwing money at possible solutions, you should work through the L-Jet diagnostics at the link below to figure out the problem--

https://www.hpsimotorsports.com/l-jetronic--spider-

alfalori86 07-16-2019 02:24 PM

It has the original Fuel Injection system. I replaced the Air intake duct when I got the car a year ago. The car was idling very rough and couldn't keep it going unless I gave it gas. What I found was that air intake duct must have rotted away and someone replaced it with something other than the correct duct. It was not a tight seal and there was leakage. Once I replaced the duct it ran fine and idled perfectly. I also replaced the fuel filter, plugs, air filter, oil & filter.

GV27 07-16-2019 02:25 PM

Assuming your car is still running the original Bosch fuel injection and ignition system your car already has electronic ignition, handled by it's own separate computer. The coil and distributor are simple affairs that are completely under the control of the computer. There are no points involved. The only replaceable parts on the dizzy are the cap and rotor. This is the coil you want:

https://centerlinealfa.com/catalog/i...spider-1982-94

Don't think being an old car it has "classic" ignition bits - other than being an analog computer rather than digital, it is just like a modern car. edit, well not like a modern car that has the coils right on top of the spark plugs, but just like a modern car that still uses a distributor!

spiderserie4 07-17-2019 12:24 AM

get a matched cap and rotor, I'd also spend the few bucks and go for Bosch.
A new set of oem type spark plug leads (metal ends, right angle) and new plugs does wonders for any 30 year old car.

alfalori86 07-17-2019 06:58 AM

Yes wires, cap, rotor cheap and easy and most certainly needed.

Alfajay 07-17-2019 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sloboy89 (Post 8439606)
before going and throwing money at possible solutions, you should work through the L-Jet diagnostics

sloboy89 offers good advice here. A vacuum leak caused the last incident of running poorly, and you have already replaced the spark plugs, so I'd say that your problem is more likely fuel than spark.

Sure, you could replace the wires, cap, rotor, points and condensor just because they're old. But it's just a shot in the dark that they are the cause your rough running problem.

Quote:

but $200 as opposed to $50 for traditional ignition parts is a big difference
Why not just inspect the cap and rotor, and check the point gap before throwing parts at it? That will cost nothing.

SkiBum 07-17-2019 09:58 AM

I purchased an L- jet Spider that had been sitting for 17 years. I replaced all the wires, plugs, cap, rotor, along with injectors, fuel pumps, FPR, and hoses but still ran rough. Found a few vacuum lines that were compromised. Still ran rough. Finally found all the vacuum leaks and now she runs fine. I HIGHLY suggest running through the L-jet troubleshooting guide and take nothing for granted. The smallest vacuum leak will make the car run poorly. Good luck! I know you will find your issue...

ballough510 07-17-2019 10:58 AM

Pull the vacuum hose of the FPR and see if the vacuum circuit is full of raw fuel.
The diaphragm is probably broken causing poor idle. Not the ignition at all. Seen it dozens of times.
RML

Alfa69GTV1750 07-17-2019 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SkiBum (Post 8439990)
I purchased an L- jet Spider that had been sitting for 17 years. I replaced all the wires, plugs, cap, rotor, along with injectors, fuel pumps, FPR, and hoses but still ran rough. Found a few vacuum lines that were compromised. Still ran rough. Finally found all the vacuum leaks and now she runs fine. I HIGHLY suggest running through the L-jet troubleshooting guide and take nothing for granted. The smallest vacuum leak will make the car run poorly. Good luck! I know you will find your issue...

A great way to find vacuum leaks is with a spray bottle of starting fluid. If you spray it around the various vacuum sources and air ducts a vacuum leak will show up as a change in idle speed. You can also use something non-flammable like brake cleaner. WD-40 works too, but its still flammable and messy.

alfalori86 07-17-2019 01:42 PM

All great advice and much appreciated. I used the link above to resolve vacuum leaks when I first got it. That is what lead me to replace the air intake duct. Will try the spray bottle technique to be sure i dont have new issues.

ballough510 07-17-2019 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfalori86 (Post 8440056)
All great advice and much appreciated. I used the link above to resolve vacuum leaks when I first got it. That is what lead me to replace the air intake duct. Will try the spray bottle technique to be sure i dont have new issues.

Pull the vacuum hose....off the fuel pressure regulator it takes 2 seconds. Do that FIRST!!

SkiBum 07-17-2019 02:26 PM

Also pull the dipstick during idle to see if idle changes. Should drop around 300 rpm. If not, you have a leak somewhere!

Calguy 17 07-17-2019 04:44 PM

I have a 1976 Alfetta GT and recently replaced the original a worn out Marelli distributor with a Pertronix unit.
The installation is very easy as long as you can find TDC and have a timing light. My old GT runs like new
and starts immediately. Gas mileage has also improved. Points and condensers are stone age today. Go with electronic ignition and you will never look back.....

SkiBum 07-17-2019 04:48 PM

He has a 86 with the original L-jet system. No points, no condenser, distributor is basically just a 4 way switch....

GV27 07-17-2019 08:02 PM

Yeah, just to back up SkiBum and reiterate my point from earlier: no points, no condenser - it's modern computerized ignition. Going to a Petronix unit would be a step backward and highly unlikely to improve anything.

Cap and rotor are a whopping $35.

alfalori86 07-18-2019 01:40 PM

Where is the fuel pressure regulator?

SkiBum 07-18-2019 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfalori86 (Post 8440538)
Where is the fuel pressure regulator?

on the end of the fuel rail, above the distributor.

spiderserie4 07-19-2019 12:28 AM

fuel pressure regulator is number 2 in diagram:
https://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/8158178-post2.html

Top hose is vacuum hose from plenum (apart from checking this for raw fuel, also make sure the hose is not cracked)
Bottom hose is fuel return line.

alfalori86 07-19-2019 06:39 AM

Ok Updates! Found fuel regulator its brand new! Disconnected vacuum line and no raw gas. I started the car and got a spray bottle with water and sprayed what vacuum lines i could see no leaks. The car idles fine what I found was after driving it and stopping at a red light it got rough but not immediately at startup while standing.

SkiBum 07-19-2019 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfalori86 (Post 8440824)
Ok Updates! Found fuel regulator its brand new! Disconnected vacuum line and no raw gas. I started the car and got a spray bottle with water and sprayed what vacuum lines i could see no leaks. The car idles fine what I found was after driving it and stopping at a red light it got rough but not immediately at startup while standing.

Looking for a vacuum leak with water doesn't work, need some to be type a combustible liquid. Have you pulled your dipstick to look for an RPM change yet?

spiderserie4 07-19-2019 03:49 PM

so are you saying the 'rough running' really only occurs when the car warms up?


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