Duetto engine removal - Page 10 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #136 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-19-2019, 10:25 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim G View Post
Don't put the front seal in until the timing cover is one. You can slide the slinger on then install the front seal.

Ahaaaaaa... Somehow I knew you'd have the answer! Thanks Jim.
Mark

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post #137 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-20-2019, 02:06 AM
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The easy approach is to remove the oil pump and the distributor. The cover goes on easy peasy then. There is s careful way to then install the two parts, and index the oil pump and Dizzy shaft with the valves and pistons...

Gordon Raymond described it very well (I'll try to find the link).

Robert
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post #138 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-21-2019, 05:46 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by 60sRacer View Post
The easy approach is to remove the oil pump and the distributor. The cover goes on easy peasy then. There is s careful way to then install the two parts, and index the oil pump and Dizzy shaft with the valves and pistons...

Gordon Raymond described it very well (I'll try to find the link).

Robert

Thanks Robert. Surpring the manual doesn't mention the slinger
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post #139 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-23-2019, 07:21 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Alfajay View Post
My trick is to "glue" the slinger to the backside of the oil seal usin grease, with its notch aligned with the key in the crankshaft. Then just slide the front cover + oil pump back on.

The fun part of this operation is aligning the oil pump-crankshaft gears so that the distributor rotor is properly aligned when the front cover is fully seated. Generally this takes a couple of tries.
I thought about the "gluing it with grease" approach too. I also took a dry run at installing the cover, without the slinger in place, to get an idea of how to set the distributor so that it aligns properly when the helical gears are fully meshed. I set the distributor rotor pointing at the #1 spark plug wire notch and seated the cover fully, marking how far the rotor moved clockwise. Then I pulled the cover back, set the rotor past the same notch by the same distance it moved previously and voila! Maybe I got lucky😊.
Thanks for the ideas everyone!
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post #140 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-23-2019, 11:05 AM
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Then I pulled the cover back, set the rotor past the same notch by the same distance it moved previously and voila! Maybe I got lucky
Yes, that's the proper technique. Those gears just have a few teeth, so there's only a few (logical) ways to assemble the oil pump & crankshaft gears.

When I wrote "the fun part of this operation is aligning the oil pump-crankshaft gears", I meant "fun" to literally mean "fun", not "difficult".

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I thought about the "gluing it with grease" approach too.
In thinking about this some more, I realized that the "gluing with grease" technique is what I used to do back when I only had a rear-mount engine stand. Now that I have a side-mount adapter for my stand, I simply tilt the engine nose-down, and gravity holds the slinger in place as I raise the front cover + oil pump up to the block.

Jay Mackro
San Juan Capistrano, CA

'65 Guilia Sprint GT
'67 Duetto
'91 164L

Last edited by Alfajay; 02-23-2019 at 11:24 AM.
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post #141 of 197 (permalink) Old 02-23-2019, 11:53 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Alfajay View Post
Yes, that's the proper technique. Those gears just have a few teeth, so there's only a few (logical) ways to assemble the oil pump & crankshaft gears.

When I wrote "the fun part of this operation is aligning the oil pump-crankshaft gears", I meant "fun" to literally mean "fun", not "difficult".



In thinking about this some more, I realized that the "gluing with grease" technique is what I used to do back when I only had a rear-mount engine stand. Now that I have a side-mount adapter for my stand, I simply tilt the engine nose-down, and gravity holds the slinger in place as I raise the front cover + oil pump up to the block.
oh yeah that would work too. it also looks like you could hold the slinger with a pair of long reach needle nose pliers while positioning the front cover. all my parts are on their way now so i should be able to drop them off at the machine shop this coming week. hopefully it doesn't take them too long. no hurry i guess; we're flying down to Disneyland next weekend anyway. i'll wave when we pass San Juan Capistrano
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post #142 of 197 (permalink) Old 03-07-2019, 09:25 PM Thread Starter
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Well all the head parts are at the machinist's, so that should be done soon. I pulled the rear main cap today to get ready for the cigarette seal and rear main seal replacement. I plasti gauged the bearing while I had it apart and The gauge read between .003" and .004"; so it's shaping up to be a complete engine rebuild I guess. The car will probably be on a rotisserie by summer😥
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post #143 of 197 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 02:32 PM Thread Starter
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the Head is finally back from the machine shop and the short block has been dropped off for the autopsy .
Here's some pictures of the head and a picture of the threaded plates that the flywheel bolts go into (slinger?) that i have a question about: i pulled them out and marked the side facing outward for reinstallation reference but noticed that each was in differently. one side has a shoulder and the other side has a chamfered outer edge. is this how they are supposed to be installed or had this been done incorrectly in the past? either way, does anyone know which way they are supposed to be oriented?
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post #144 of 197 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 03:52 PM Thread Starter
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now i can start on this engine compartment
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post #145 of 197 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 04:05 PM
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chamfer OUT (towards flywheel bolt) as I recall to help get the bolt centered and started. Its kind of a blind thing to get started

Think about pulling the steering box while you have easy access-- and check for cracks/maybe rebuild it----

74 GTV with 10548's and Ingram pump
71 Spider 1750 BOMBER ; 1995 LS 78K tight fast car
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post #146 of 197 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 05:18 PM
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the threaded plates that the flywheel bolts go into (slinger?)
No, the slinger is just a flat sheetmetal washer-shaped part. It slings oil by centrifugal force, just like the part at the front end of the engine that you bent and straightened. The rear slinger is much larger than the front, as it has to fit over the flywheel flange on the crankshaft.

Anyhow, if your rear slinger has gone missing, it isn't a catastrophe; the factory didn't install them on 2L engines and modern rear seals work OK without the slinger.

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now i can start on this engine compartment
What are you going to do with the engine compartment? You could re-paint the side of the battery compartment. goat's idea of inspecting/rebuilding the steering box is good.

Jay Mackro
San Juan Capistrano, CA

'65 Guilia Sprint GT
'67 Duetto
'91 164L

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post #147 of 197 (permalink) Old 03-11-2019, 07:50 PM Thread Starter
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chamfer OUT (towards flywheel bolt) as I recall to help get the bolt centered and started. Its kind of a blind thing to get started

Think about pulling the steering box while you have easy access-- and check for cracks/maybe rebuild it----

thanks Goats. so the half pictured, without the blue arrow pointing to it, faces the flywheel. somebody has been in this engine before. i didn't even look to see if there was a flat sheetmetal slinger in there before taking it down to the machine shop. glad to hear it's not a problem
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post #148 of 197 (permalink) Old 05-29-2019, 12:38 PM Thread Starter
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well the engine finally made it home from the machine shop. that only took two and a half months. she's all nice and purty now! i sent Gordon Raymond some photos of the inside of my oil pump and he confirmed it's toast, so i'm sending it to him this week. i guess i can work on the cigarette seals and rear main seal in the interim.
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post #149 of 197 (permalink) Old 06-02-2019, 08:01 PM Thread Starter
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Rear main is all buttoned up. On to the transmission! I’ve already replaced the input shaft seal, re sealed the bell housing and am up to the mount. The replacement didn’t come with these two white solid cylinders, so i’m Guessing I have to use the old ones. They must have worked their way partially out as Both of these are sticking out about a half inch. Do they need to be installed fully?
Thanks!
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post #150 of 197 (permalink) Old 06-03-2019, 12:14 AM
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those white inserts are not factory.

People sometimes use things like that to try stiffen up a bad trans mount in situ.
Or sometimes to stiffen a new mount for track purposes (some suppliers offer aluminium inserts)

I'd wouldn't use them on a road car.

Dom - Alfa Spider 1990 S4 - formerly: Alfa 101 Sprint, 2600 Sprint, Montreal - family classics: Jensen Interceptor II, '58 Hooper RR Silver Cloud I, Shadow II, '60 Corvette.
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