Engine Seized? - Page 35 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #511 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-12-2018, 11:53 AM
PSk
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Please stop idling this "new" engine. A rebuilt engine should be banged up to ~2000 rpm while everything is checked and then buttoned up and loaded to bed the rings.

Time to get her off the jack stands and doing laps
Pete

'71 1750 Series 2 GTV:
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post #512 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-12-2018, 12:13 PM Thread Starter
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TPS was checked, including VVT functions. Idle speed set at 970. I thought of that too, when I had my initial idle problems on first start.

-Kevin
1988 Spider Veloce (with lots of 3D printed parts)
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post #513 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-12-2018, 01:08 PM Thread Starter
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Please stop idling this "new" engine. A rebuilt engine should be banged up to ~2000 rpm while everything is checked and then buttoned up and loaded to bed the rings.

Time to get her off the jack stands and doing laps
Pete
Yes, sir! If it's not leaking already, it's probably not going to (at least for now). I should be able to hoon it Wed or Thurs evening.

-Kevin
1988 Spider Veloce (with lots of 3D printed parts)

Last edited by Shakey; 06-12-2018 at 02:50 PM.
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post #514 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-12-2018, 08:21 PM Thread Starter
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I had some unexpected free time this evening, so I continued with the Alfa. The engine components read 88F on the IR thermometer, having been protected from direct sunlight today. It started and idled without any issues.

Then I took it out and hooned it. At varying RPMs and engine loads, the engine performed great. I got it up to operating temperature, at least as indicated by the temp gauge, but I didn't have a chance to check the engine idle RPM at that temp as @Gubi had suggested. I'll drive it again tomorrow night, and double-check the idle speed.

I had forgotten how much fun this car is to drive. It's hard to believe this poor thing has been living on jack-stands for the last eight months. I'll check the driveway in the morning to see if any leaks have appeared.
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-Kevin
1988 Spider Veloce (with lots of 3D printed parts)
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post #515 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 06:31 AM Thread Starter
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On Monday, I plan on taking the Alfa to get its state safety inspection; the license plates expired last month, while it was still up on jack-stands. To that end, I have a few things to do, in order to get the car completely back together:

Now that I'm satisfied that the trans and clutch are working well, I can go ahead and reinstall the center console. I also have some bad spots in the clear coat on the hood. (I had originally thought the pest-control guy had got some over-spray on it, while it was up on jack-stands...but now I'm not so sure.) I'm going to prep and clear coat the hood this weekend. I don't want it to look like a beater when it goes in for inspection.

Once the Alfa is completely street-legal again, I'll switch my youngest daughter's driver training from the wife's '76 Super Beetle convertible to the Alfa. The oldest daughter took her driver's test in the Alfa; it's a great little car for learning to drive.

In the few times I've driven it since its resurrection, I have a couple of initial observations:

- I cannot say enough good things about the silicone hose kit from Hi Performance Store. I replaced the vacuum lines, including the ones to the infamous charcoal canister behind the right-front wheel well. When I pull the oil dipstick, the change in engine idle RPM is quite pronounced, compared to the previous slight change. Engine idle RPM responds more readily to adjustment than before. I am quite confident that the engine is 'air-tight' now; certainly much better than before. It will be interesting to see if there's any difference in performance or economy.

- The transmission work...repairing the 2nd gear synchro and making the 1st gear synchro mod...has significantly improved the driving experience. I initially found myself continuing to 'baby' the trans while shifting into 2nd gear, and had to remind myself that I don't have to do that anymore. It's a hard habit to break, and you don't even notice you're doing it. This will be a vast improvement on drive-ability for the wife and daughters. I have to give a big thanks to @factotum for cajoling me into doing the trans work, as well as being my mentor and guide for that project.

So far, still no fluid leaks of any kind. Oil still looks good on the dipstick, and the coolant is still clean; no sign of any cross-contamination there. For a brief, shining moment...I have a leak-free Alfa Spider! I've never had that before.

I am organizing my thoughts, to post a summary of this project at its conclusion.

NOTE:
I eventually purchased an optical tachometer, and set the idle speed to 970 RPM. Removing the oil dipstick results in a drop of 300 RPM, so it indicates the engine is still very 'air-tight'.
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-Kevin
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Last edited by Shakey; 09-02-2018 at 10:49 PM.
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post #516 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 06:46 AM
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Don't forget to set the fuel mixture.

1969 1750 Spider Veloce w/dual webers, 1969 1750 Berlina, 1971 1750 Spider Veloce w/ dual webers, 1985 Spider Veloce 23,000 orig. miles, {Two} 1986 Spider Veloces, 1987 Spider Veloce bought new, 1988 Quadrifoglio, 1991 164S, Plus several more. I think they are breeding.
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I just got 2 more. Now I have a Matta. I must be crazy.
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post #517 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 01:09 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Don't forget to set the fuel mixture.
Are you referring to the idle bypass screw on the AFM, or adjusting the AFM's spring tension?

-Kevin
1988 Spider Veloce (with lots of 3D printed parts)
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post #518 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 01:26 PM
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Are you referring to the idle bypass screw on the AFM, or adjusting the AFM's spring tension?
I wouldn't touch that, tbh, unless you have a specific afm based problem!
(...also not sure what Jim means by adjust fuel mixture...)

Dom - Alfa Spider 1990 S4 - formerly: Alfa 101 Sprint, 2600 Sprint, Montreal - family classics: Jensen Interceptor II, '58 Hooper RR Silver Cloud I, Shadow II, '60 Corvette.
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post #519 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 01:27 PM
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Are you referring to the idle bypass screw on the AFM, or adjusting the AFM's spring tension?
Don't mess with the spring tension, and in the absence of any running problems or emissions test failure I would suggest against messing with the idle bypass screw.

You can check the idle mixture using a digital voltmeter on the O2 sensor as a mixture gauge and if it's properly being controlled then you're fine.

Tom

1963 Giulia Spider (1750 engine)
1974 GTV
1991 Spider
Former: 1987 Milano Gold
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post #520 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 02:03 PM
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You use the screw under the aluminum plug on the airflow meter to adjust your fuel mixture. Screwing it up and down makes the mixture richer or leaner. This was suppose to be checked at every tune up.

Use either a CO2 analyzer or an AFR meter. I use to use an old Sun 75 machine until it died for the third time years ago. I now use the Innovate LM-1. Its been replaced with the LM-2. For the AFR I just put the sensor up the tail pipe since I don't have a cat. If you have the cat you can install the AFR sensor in place of the O2 sensor. You can find a conversion chart to convert AFR numbers to CO2 percentage.

Unplug the O2 sensor. Insert or install the AFR sensor and read the number. Alfa wanted the CO set to .70 percent which would drop to around .20 percent when the O2 sensor is plug back in. This is why back in the day when they were driven as daily drivers they burned an exhaust valve between 50,000 and 80,000 miles.

Nowadays I set the mixture around 1.0 percent if it has a cat or 1.5 percent if it doesn't have one.

Do not take the black cover off and mess with it. To remove the aluminum plug take an 1/8 inch drill bit and drill 2 holes side by side with a little space between them and use a pair of needle nose pliers and pull up to remove the plug.

The double nutted fitting on the intake is used to set the idle to 900 give or take a 100. Sometimes adjusting the fuel mixture changes it. This usually happens on one thats had a valve job, engine rebuild or hasn't been adjusted in many years.

This can all be found in the factory manual.

1969 1750 Spider Veloce w/dual webers, 1969 1750 Berlina, 1971 1750 Spider Veloce w/ dual webers, 1985 Spider Veloce 23,000 orig. miles, {Two} 1986 Spider Veloces, 1987 Spider Veloce bought new, 1988 Quadrifoglio, 1991 164S, Plus several more. I think they are breeding.
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I just got 2 more. Now I have a Matta. I must be crazy.

Last edited by Jim G; 06-15-2018 at 02:06 PM.
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post #521 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 02:57 PM
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There are over 500 posts on this thread.. time to start a new one... no matter if they are the same car.
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post #522 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 03:01 PM
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there are over 500 posts on this thread.. Time to start a new one... No matter if they are the same car.
You’re not my supervisor!

Tom

1963 Giulia Spider (1750 engine)
1974 GTV
1991 Spider
Former: 1987 Milano Gold
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post #523 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 04:07 PM
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okay..roll on.. if you had a clue why I said that you might get a grasp of why I said it. Your attitude will set the tenor for the future and you will get by without me..just fine.. Please block me from your incoming. I'll help you if you don't know how.

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post #524 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 04:48 PM Thread Starter
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@Jim G, being a lowly driveway mechanic, I don't have any of that specialized equipment. I have read the procedure to check the O2 sensor with a digital ohmeter. I'll give that a whirl.

-Kevin
1988 Spider Veloce (with lots of 3D printed parts)
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post #525 of 572 (permalink) Old 06-15-2018, 05:14 PM
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@Jim G, being a lowly driveway mechanic, I don't have any of that specialized equipment. I have read the procedure to check the O2 sensor with a digital ohmeter. I'll give that a whirl.
Good to check, but suggest reporting back before you change anything. Generally you shouldn't have to mess with the AFM, and I suspect more folks have messed things up than fixed things by doing so.

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okay..roll on.. if you had a clue why I said that you might get a grasp of why I said it. Your attitude will set the tenor for the future and you will get by without me..just fine.. Please block me from your incoming. I'll help you if you don't know how.
Great googly-moogly, son. Settle down, I was just joking around.
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Tom

1963 Giulia Spider (1750 engine)
1974 GTV
1991 Spider
Former: 1987 Milano Gold
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