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What is a 105/115 Spider?

23K views 45 replies 18 participants last post by  ARwrench 
#1 ·
My 1980 Spider is often described in literature and articles as a 105/115. Does this mean it isn't a 105 anymore, but it isn't quite a 115 yet?
 

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#5 · (Edited)
Yours is a 115. People say 105/115 because it's essentially the same car. There were obviously some important changes to the body and trim as they made the transition and there have been some important changes since, but the majority of parts will fit either series - i.e. any Spider (or any Giulia for that matter) from 1966 to 1994. For example if I want, say, a new trailing arm bushing for my 1990 (115) Spider from ClassicAlfa I would just click on "105 series Spider" and then click the trailing arm bushing. I would do exactly the same thing if I had a '68 105 series. You do want to pay attention because not EVERY part fits EVERY car, but most do.

If you look at the Centerline rebuild kits you referenced you'll see that the only difference between the 105 and 115 kits is the swaybar bushings - they were different early on.

Now I would say that referring to a 1980 specifically as a 105/115 is entirely incorrect - it's a 115 for sure and your VIN reflects that - but saying "I need a rear suspension refresh kit for a 105/115 Spider" is certainly correct.
 
#7 ·
European Spiders have always been 105. Whenever you order from Classicalfa you are order from the 105 Spider section
Cheers, Jon
 
#10 · (Edited)
European Spiders have always been 105.
Totally incorrect. Euro Spiders also differ in 105/115's as well as ROW.

JimG said:
As the spider evolved into the 80's and 90's. The 105/115 pretty much merged together.
No. Spiders and as well Giulias got 115's VIN #'s from early Seventies on. IN EUROPE, TOO.
 
#9 ·
In the early 70's Alfa started numbering the U.S. spiders as 115's. So if your spider is a U.S. spec car then its a 115. All the parts that were different from a euro spec spider started with 115. If the part was the same between both the euro and the U.S. spider the part number started with 105.

As the spider evolved into the 80's and 90's. The 105/115 pretty much merged together.

So Alfa's 115 model number just designated that the car was built to U.S. specs for emissions and crash standards andall the other stupid stuff the DOT made manufacturers do.
 
#12 · (Edited)
Alfa did this kind of thing all the time. If anyone tells you anything they ever did has a firm delineation date they're likely wrong. The OP's car is definitely a 115 though - it says so on the VIN plate and they were definitely (probably) done with 105s by 1980.

Total chaos around 1970 though.
 
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#13 ·
Well, up until 72 Fusi referred to 2000 Spiders as 105s. There is no evidence of 105 or 115 on my UK 78 Spider so I am intrigued to see that is referred to on the VIN plate. I don't have one of those either!
 
#16 ·
As evieceli "sez", there are many opinions so I'll add mine.
I have a 73 Spider Veloce and it's VIN starts with 115. It doesn't bother me when ordered parts as to which is listed, 105 or 115, they have always fit . Whether they came from the UK at Classic Alfa or Colorado from Centerline, they work for me.

When doing sparse reading on the Spider, I noted the designation of the S1, S2, S2a, S3 and the S4. Yes, two classifications of the S2.
From records we had no imports released during 1970 (those of you old enough to remember the Russian steel issue?). 69 of course was the S1, 71-74 were the S2, 75 thru 82 were (Kammtails) the S2a,, with the wonderful regs on "safety",, thank you Mr. Nader.

So hopefully, you get the idea, by the way, those 71's,, should have been 70's if they could have got out of the docks.:wink2:

02
 
#29 ·
From records we had no imports released during 1970 (those of you old enough to remember the Russian steel issue?). 69 of course was the S1, 71-74 were the S2, 75 thru 82 were (Kammtails) the S2a,, with the wonderful regs on "safety",, thank you Mr. Nader.

So hopefully, you get the idea, by the way, those 71's,, should have been 70's if they could have got out of the docks.:wink2:

02
S2 is the stainless steel bumpers 71 to 74. S2a is the rubber bumper cars. 75 to 82. 71 on are kammtail cars.

No car were imported to the U.S. in 68 or 70 due to emissions.
 
#19 ·
Alfaboutvegas said:
, 71-74 were the S2, 75 thru 82 were (Kammtails) the S2a,
Every S2 from 1971 on is a Kammtail.
Russian steel wasn't used until 1974 in a lot of European factories.

A lot of tell tales in the whole thread.

Just check VIN's from 1971on @ Giulias and Spiders and a light will switch on.
 
#21 ·
US market is not the only one in the world - there is also ROW.
Spiders were not only equipped with 1750 and 2000 engines.

That's a fact, hardly to believe but true. Your Mr T also has some issues to believe there is anything else than the US in the world. May be he missed some lessons in geography.
 
#25 ·
The pictures pretty much back up what I posted. Alfa started numbering the U.S. spiders in the early 70's 115's.
 
#27 ·
ossodiseppia said:
In general, for the US and Canadian market, to which he was referring, 105 cars came with 1300, 1600 ad 1750 engines. The 115 cars came with 2000 engines.
The pic listings tell a different story about 1600´s; and on page 1 it has been stated Euro models have been 105´s throughout, and only US 115´s.

That´s wrong.

Thread starter question was: Differences between 105´s and 115´s.
 
#34 ·
#36 ·
Sorry for the off top. What was the logistic of Spiders assembly? What was done at Arese, what was done at Grugliasco? How cars shipped between factories? What company was responsible for shipping? Did assembled cars shipped to customers directly from Pininfarina or from Alfa? How Alfa Romeo entered body/engine numbers in their system, by actual assembly date or by arriving of paperwork?

Sent from my Z957 using Tapatalk
 
#37 ·
Never let it be said that Alfa enthusiasts aren't passionate.

The 115 series cars appeared in 1972. While the USA market cars were the 11500 2000 Berlina, 11501 2000 GTV and the 11502 2000 Spider, some non-USA market cars included the 11503 GT Junior 1.6, 11505 GT Junior 1.6 RHD and the 11507 Spider 1600 Junior.
So, since the 115 cars were not USA exclusive, why the change from 105 to 115? Simple. Alfa ran out of 105 designations! Sure, some European 105 models continued for years after 1972 (the 10521 2000 GTV and 10524 2000 Spider being just two examples) but there were simply no more new 105 designations left to be issued. The last two 105s issued were the 10593 Junior Zagato in 1970 and the 10597 2000 Berlina with auto gearbox for South Africa in 1974.
@gkmeyer
Your 1980 Spider is a type 11541 (USA market 2L w/Spica fuel injection). This is a later version of 11502 USA 2000 Spider which is a later version of the 10562 USA 1750 Spider. Basically, your Spider is the descendant of previous versions (going back to the 10503 Spider 1600 from 1966). This is why Spiders can often be referred to as 105/115. It's a generic term that covers an almost 30 year span of 105/115 Spider production.
 
#45 ·
Hi Greg

Okay you said "...My 1980 Spider is often described in literature and articles as a 105/115. Does this mean it isn't a 105 anymore, but it isn't quite a 115 yet?"

In answer to your question No, your car is definitely a 115 chassis. However the term "105/115" doesn't refer to a specific car, it's just a made up term to ease the parts ordering process. In American car catalogs, you would see the phrase, fits 1970-1981 Camaro/Firebird.

Well there is no such thing as a Camaro/Firebird, a car is either a Chevrolet Camaro or a Pontiac Firebird; but the car are very similar and the majority of the parts interchange. Similarly "105/115" means that many parts that fit the 105 chassis also fit the 115 chassis.

This isn't the first time this happened. The early Giuliettas are referred to as "750" cars, as Alfa developed the car it changed the designation to "101". In parts catalogs, you see the term "750/101" used to refer to, parts that fit both early and late Giuliettas.


Hope this helps
 
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