Warning: bad suspension bushings - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #16 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by barbone105 View Post
poly bushings are not necessarily harder than the rubber ones. the bushings i sell have their durometers matched to the job at hand. in some instances they are harder than the rubber ones they replace. in trailing arms, they are not - maybe a little firmer but not much. have sold bunches for trailing arm applications, so far all good. properly lubed and installed, no issues w squeaking etc. as i type this, trying to remember if i have had any complaints about noise and can not remember any instances. generally speaking, they have a MUCH longer life than rubber bushings. for most of us, they will be a one time install.
andy
With the rear suspension of a 105 series Alfa the bushes must be able to flex not just rotate otherwise the trailing arms will be twisted back and forth.

Think about what happens when one rear wheel goes over a bump and the other doesn't. The axle has to twist versus the body of the car. This is why you need bonded soft rubber bushes.

Soft poly bushes will eventually oval their inner hole and while useful for leaf sprung cars and anti-roll bar bushes not the correct product for the trailing arms of a 105 series Alfa IMO.

I wonder how long the trailing arms will last being constantly twisted back and forth like that before they start cracking or welds fail? I've seen one, not related to poly bushes (I think, don't actually know) break the outer tube away from the arm.

I'd rather install (single) rose joints than poly in the front end of a trailing arm.
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post #17 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 03:04 PM
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So what about a poly bushing isn't allowing the trailing arms to flex? As noted, the durometer is similar to stock....the poly bushings from Centerline are surprisingly soft to the touch.

Chris

1990 Spider Veloce

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post #18 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 04:32 PM
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Why would you want the trailing arms to flex?

Ed Prytherch
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post #19 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 05:02 PM
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So what about a poly bushing isn't allowing the trailing arms to flex?
You want the bush to flex NOT the trailing arms.
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As noted, the durometer is similar to stock....the poly bushings from Centerline are surprisingly soft to the touch.
So how with this design when they are not bonded to the inner sleeve is the poly going to last and not be squished out and deform/oval the hole in it?

I've run poly bushes in my Sud and even back in those days when it was not as soft as rubber the holes became oval. This allowed dirt, etc. to get in and quickly they wore away.

Sometimes there are just better designs for certain applications and the rubber bush is a very good design, which is why modern cars still use them. Rubber is also a very good vibration isolator.
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post #20 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 05:05 PM
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Why would you want the trailing arms to flex?
You don't.
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post #21 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 06:32 PM
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Warning: bad suspension bushings

Does anyone happen to have any tips on how to push the bushings out of the trailing arms?

I have a shop press but for the life of me I can't get the arm to sit right where I feel comfortable bearing down on the bushings...
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post #22 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 06:56 PM
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Hacksaw.

See here, post 7: http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/spid...e-dummies.html

Chris

1990 Spider Veloce

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post #23 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 07:07 PM
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Thanks... I missed the vids on the 3rd page. I was trying to avoid the hacksaw but it seems that it is the only way.
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post #24 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 09:07 PM
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Thanks... I missed the vids on the 3rd page. I was trying to avoid the hacksaw but it seems that it is the only way.
I just removed the rubber from my trunnion bushings using the EB Spares video and it worked absolutely brilliantly. Of course you still have to hack and pound out the metal rim when you're done but the rubber comes out like magic, and the drill bit takes a good bit of thickness out of the metal rim in the process.

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post #25 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 09:33 PM
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I just removed the rubber from my trunnion bushings using the EB Spares video and it worked absolutely brilliantly. Of course you still have to hack and pound out the metal rim when you're done but the rubber comes out like magic, and the drill bit takes a good bit of thickness out of the metal rim in the process.


I removed the rubber from mine as well. It definitely works... I broke a few bits before I was able to get it right.

The one thing I still had to do is use some threaded rod to wiggle the rubber out by hand. My bits really like to grab and not chew at the rubber.
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post #26 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-27-2016, 09:38 PM
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Also I checked my bushings. The ones purchased from alfaholics is smooth and seem to be like OE.

Figured I would let anyone know who was wondering where to get the proper bushings.

P.s. The guys at alfaholics have been awesome! They really know their stuff and have some top quality parts.
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post #27 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-28-2016, 05:11 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by phillipah View Post
Does anyone happen to have any tips on how to push the bushings out of the trailing arms?

I have a shop press but for the life of me I can't get the arm to sit right where I feel comfortable bearing down on the bushings...
Don't try to press them out! The risk of damage is too high. I've tried it myself (not using a press but a threaded rod and some other bits and pieces) and as a result the weld between trailing arm and the cylindrical sleeve for the bushing came loose.
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post #28 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-30-2016, 01:00 AM Thread Starter
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For those of you who replaced the bushings with the original style rubber bushings: did you use the "normal" ones or the reinforced/heavy duty ones which are also suitable for the Montreal?
What is the difference? Does it make any difference in the handling of the car?
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post #29 of 55 (permalink) Old 05-30-2016, 08:28 AM
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typically can not press the old bushings out - especially if old and especially if car is from the rust belt. the steel shells of the bushings tend to rust in place, making for extra special grip. the trailing arms are just folded sheet metal. the seats for the bushings are reinforced (steel tube welded in place) to take the stress and hold bushings in place. unfortunately, the trailing arm itself is not flat so no supporting surface to rest it on when pressing bushings in and out. there is an Alfa tool to support arm and guide the bush - works great if you can get it. however, even with the proper tool, typically, apply 12 (or 20) tons of press, bushings do not move and trailing arms destroyed. sometimes the bushings will start out and then get stuck half way out. not an improvement. the alfa tool supports the arm for pressing bushings out and in, but will not prevent the bushing from getting stuck half way out. unfortunately, the cut method is the only reasonable chance for success, especially on an older piece. work carefully, keep the blade as flat as can, try not to cut the tube.
re the poly bushings - the trailing arm bushings are roughly same durometer as the rubber - at least mine are. polyurethane will displace under load - which is good in this case - but does not deform and will return back to original shape as soon as load is removed. perhaps not forever, but for a hell of a lot longer time than rubber will.
as psk mentioned, the poly is not bonded to a shell or to the arm - which is a real benefit for install and for use. use the supplied lube liberally. the bushing is held in place (laterally) with thrust washers in the bracket on either side of the arm.
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post #30 of 55 (permalink) Old 06-02-2016, 08:20 AM Thread Starter
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Today I received new bushings (and an uprated clutch pedal pivot arm and pin from Mr Ortakes). I ordered the uprated bushings. The ones I received do have the smooth finish, so that might mean that the bushings are original.
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However, the inner sleeve still is thinner than the ones I removed from the car in the first place.
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ossodiseppia: I guess what you showed in the picture is the front bushing for the rear trailing arm. Do you have a picture of the rear bushing of the rear trailing arm as well?

Last edited by NielsP90; 06-02-2016 at 08:32 AM.
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