$98 Rust-oleum paint job - Page 5 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #61 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-25-2007, 03:50 PM
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.. that's fixable...
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post #62 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-25-2007, 03:50 PM
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Man that sucks! Hope you get it all sorted out OK.

Kevin

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post #63 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-25-2007, 05:16 PM
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I keep thinking about this. I am strongly inclined to touch up the '74 Spider I purchased this summer (not yet running, since '91).
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post #64 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-25-2007, 06:49 PM
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... one more question..on the primer.. did it go on full strenght? or did you thin it out..if so by how much? thanks
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post #65 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-25-2007, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by bianchi1 View Post
... one more question..on the primer.. did it go on full strenght? or did you thin it out..if so by how much? thanks
No Primer. Just sand with 400 grit to start and then a good wipe down with mineral spirits then a good wash, followed by a thorough wipe with denatured alcohol. Thats it. Let it dry and then start your first coat, let it dry, apply another coat, let dry and start the sanding with 600 then repeat. Move up to 800, then 1,000, 1,200 finishing after the 8th coat of paint with 1,600-2,000.
Polish. Wax. Smile.

Thin the paint about 1:1 (depends on the paint, temp. , humidity etc) with mineral spirits not paint thinner.

Go for it.

Get out there and DRIVE !

Bill ("Plays well with others")
1978 Spider Veloce
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post #66 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-25-2007, 11:01 PM
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.. thanks bill... i was asking about the primer..becase...well my car has a few difff. shades of colour on it..red. black grey..and the org. colour beige( yuc)so i thouhgt a base coat of primed might even out the colour of the paint as i put it on..no dark areas..thanks for the help.
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post #67 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-26-2007, 12:17 AM
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I ran across that MOPAR thread last year, one of the guys on a flight simulator list (of all places) posted it and was trying it on a truck he's restoring.

I tried it on the rear hatch of my driver 280ZX........not sure what I did wrong, if anything, but for me it was a *huge* amount of work for pretty marginal results. Perhaps part of the problem was that at the time I was located in the humid disgusting midwest (Indiana). Sometimes I could sand and apply another coat the next day, but other times it had to be 2+ days between coats. The car was down for over 2 months as I recall. I reached a point where I just didn't seem to be making any progress. I had some orange peel, but mostly the entire paint job was just very uneven and "splotchy". After experimenting with various consistencies, I couldn't ever seem to get around either having the paint so thin that any sanding would pretty much burn through that coat, or having it so thick that it would orange-peel really bad (requiring so much sanding that, again, almost no paint remained). Perhaps more sanding would have yielded better results, but I sure wasn't getting anywhere near the results that a lot of the people on that MOPAR thread were seeing. The only thing I didn't do was wash the surface between coats with denatured alcohol or mineral spirits (frankly I was concerned that the mineral spirits would soften up the paint again).

I lost count of the number of coats applied after 13 or so....by the end of it I think I had well over 20 coats, and even then I could see dark areas in the paint where it wasn't even (previous surface was black, I was painting red on it). And despite much fine sanding and buffing/waxing, I never got it to shine like I'd hoped for. Plus by the time I had purchased all that extra paint, brushes, and mineral spirits to keep re-coating the thing, I was well over the "$50 paint job". I will say, what's there is holding up nicely over a year later, just getting faded (like the rest of the car) from the Arizona sun.

Once I'm in a position here in AZ where I have a place to do painting again, I might try this again on a test panel or something to see if the dry climate helps any. But it would have to do a LOT better....for me, the *insane* amount of work and frustration just wasn't worth the end result, even for a daily-driver.

'83 Spider SOLD
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post #68 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-26-2007, 07:18 PM
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Well, up to a point. This is what happened to me today: not sure whats going to happen with their insurance adjuster and how I will repaint it. Probably the same way.
Ugh. Murphy strikes again. I think the odds of you getting any compensation for all that manual effort are probably pretty slim - at least I can show the invoice from the body shop to help with valuation.

-Jason

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1974 Spider restoration project
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post #69 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-26-2007, 07:39 PM
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...how much paint do you need for the job?
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post #70 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-27-2007, 07:56 AM
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The insurance settlement should involve restoring the paint job. It doesn't matter who does it. The owner of the car is not obligated to donate his labor to restore the paint job. Loss here is not simply materials, and the offending party's (and his insurance company's) responsibility is to restore to like condition or to pay for whatever the "going value" is so that the owner can purchase another car of like condition to replace his broken vehicle. Or so I think. Do Not Under Any Circumstances volunteer to anyone else that your paint job cost you $0.32 in materials plus your labor. Otherwise that party will attempt to limit you to this, as being your own valuation of the job.

If you buy a $700 Spider (as did one young fellow a few years ago) and make it run and be worth $2500, and then you are hit by someone who is clearly at fault, do not tell that party that your car cost you only $715. net direct outlay. Save that info to impress your friends. You'll not be able to get another equivalent car for $715, and you want to be paid the going value for your car in its "just prior to impact" condition so you can purchase an equivalent vehicle.

Michael
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post #71 of 80 (permalink) Old 10-27-2007, 11:23 AM
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Good advice MrT, I heartily agree with your jibba-jabba. I'm continually disappointed at how often I read posts on car forums about people getting a lousy deal with insurance companies. I pity da foo's who accept a cursory amount for a special car that should be worth more, and "let" the insurance company keep the wreck.

A good reason to look into classic car insurance, I guess....something I should probably do with my Spider, actually.

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post #72 of 80 (permalink) Old 11-12-2007, 07:38 AM Thread Starter
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Just thought I would throw an update on here. After much debating with myself. I decide to have a body shop paint the Alfa with urethane base clear, not because this method isn't a really great cheap way to paint a car, but more because I think I'll probably have this car for a very long time and I decided it deserved the very best. I did finish the trunklid, it turned out way beyond anything I imagined. Certainly makes the car much prettier to look at while I save for a real paint job. Anyway here it is:

This took maybe 5 coats of Rustoleum "Stops Rust" rolled on with a white foam roller from lowes (well several rollers actually).
Before polishing final layer, had a few runs and some dust flecks in it:


Final coat after polishing:


Here's my final opinion, and some things I discovered along the way. It looks pretty good, but not the same quality that a base/clear or a good urethane single stage would be. I finished this back in July and after sitting in the sun it still looks great, but it is just slightly duller now and when you polish it, LOTS of black comes off on the bonnet, or the cloth so im thinking it would be polished through in a matter of a few years. Also its extremely difficult to not make it really thick in areas like door jams and cowl vents using the foam brush and roller.

A lot of people mentioned that this technique takes a lot of sanding, but compared to sanding automotive paint, this stuff comes off really easy, you can probaly sand the whole car in about 20 min by hand. I'm sure if I had painted the entire car with the stuff, I could sand it all down to the original finish with the D/A in about an hour, which is another thing that makes me believe this paint is nowhere near as hard as urethane auto finish. But on the plus side if you think it would cause problem painting over, it's really not that bad to remove. I've spent a whole day wet sanding urethane before and not been done yet....speaking of which I discovered something else along the way:

YOU CAN USE THIS ROLLING TECHNIQUE WITH URETHANE AUTO FINISH AND IT WORKS GREAT!
I rolled House Of Kolor base and clear, that had been reduced and catylyzed, with this same technique on my boat, and it works really well and looks great! I also rolled some of the clear over the rustoleum on a test panel which has been sitting out in the sun for 3 months now. It looks the same as the day I did it. No fading. No adhesion problems.
Rolling this stuff does have the disadvantage that it smells really bad compared to Rustoleum and I wore a respirator (nowhere near as bad as spraying), but it has the huge advantage for home garage use that there is no overspray and way less dust problems. It goes on with a bit more orange peel than a good spray job, but it's easily sanded out. If you reduce it a bit more than you would for spraying, it self levels just beautifully, and the shine is fantastic! The only real disadvantages I found are the aforementioned tendency to pool in crevices, and the chemicals in the HOK paint tend to start disolving the rollers after about 15-20 min, so you have to work fast and change the roller maybe once per coat. I plan to do this using House of Kolor white on my daily driver/beater Celica All-trac in the next few weeks and will post pics if anybody is interested?

Last edited by maxwedge; 11-12-2007 at 09:04 AM.
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post #73 of 80 (permalink) Old 11-12-2007, 09:18 AM
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>>I plan to do this using House of Kolor white on my daily driver/beater Celica All-trac in the next few weeks and will post pics if anybody is interested?

Sure!

On the polishing could it just be that the paint hasn't fully cured yet and that is why so much is coming off when you polish it?

Kevin

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post #74 of 80 (permalink) Old 11-12-2007, 10:47 AM Thread Starter
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I would say the really good things about this are that it's cheap, it prevents rust, and it looks pretty good for what it is. I probably could use a less agressive compound or pad on the buffer, but really I think the binders in the paint just aren't as good as modern hardened automotive paints. It baked in 90+temps outside for a couple months before I buffed it, so I think it should be cured enough to polish. It didn't haze which is usually what happens when you buff uncured paint. Technically it won't fully cure for years, but for practical puposes I think that's probably all the harder it gets, unless you add some hardner, it's still pretty scratch resitant, I would not be the least bit afraid to try this on a daily driver or use this stuff on a race car or something. It's dirt cheap and like I said it's really not that hard to remove if you don't like it.

Some people have mentioned spraying this stuff and my advice is, don't. It looks like cheap enamel when you spray it. No matter how I set the spray gun I got tons of orange peel, nowhere near the shine, and also rolling is much easier, less toxic, and uses about a third as much paint and goes on thinner. I used the remainder on my rusty boat trailer and the undercarraige of my truck, it looks pretty good and should help prevent further rust anyway. I think you could put HOK urethane clear over it and make it a lot harder and more shiney if you wanted.
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post #75 of 80 (permalink) Old 01-05-2008, 11:10 AM
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I have been a quiet body for a while...
But have some experience with this recently, I have been busy...
Here are some before and after pictures of my son's $500 1973 C10 Pickup.

This is what we bought...


And here is the first pics after we replaced the Hood and front fenders.
Then we went at it with a Roller and Rustoleum thinned 50% with Mineral Spirits.




Here you can see the orange peel texture you get after about 5 or 6 coats.
Now you think that would be good enough for an offroad truck?.... No, not us!


Sanded out with 800 wet and dry


Sanded with 1000 and buffed...


Pretty good now!


So, it works pretty well for less that $100... and a few weekends..

Red 1974 Spider (Restoring!)
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