Wanted Alive: A Giulia - Page 101 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #1501 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 04:25 AM
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Fantasy Junction has a nice looking 71 Euro Super at what is for them a reasonable price. 1971 Alfa Romeo Giulia Super 1600
Car was previously at another retailer in MA. Italy before that.
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post #1502 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 12:12 PM
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Looks like a sweet original car.

Bill Maloney

1969 Giulia Super Biscione
2017 Giulia TI AWD
1965 Fiat 1500 Cabriolet
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post #1503 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 03:18 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew View Post
Fantasy Junction has a nice looking 71 Euro Super at what is for them a reasonable price. 1971 Alfa Romeo Giulia Super 1600
Car was previously at another retailer in MA. Italy before that.
Andrew
Reasonable? $36k for a Series 2? Nice color combo and seemingly nice condition but $36k?? Wow. That might put nice S1's in concourse shape into the $50k range? Doubtful but watching.
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post #1504 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 05:09 PM
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For what it is worth I just checked the current valuation from Hagerty for a 71 Giulia Super. A #1 or Concours car has an average valuation of $58,800. A #2 or Excellent car is valued at $44,100. A #3 or Good car is at $31,700, and a #4 car in Fair condition is at $22,200.

That means if priced accurately this car should be between a #2 and a #3 which from the pictures I think it probably is, but that is up for debate of course.
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post #1505 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 07:06 PM Thread Starter
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I have not seen actual prices supporting those estimates for all but the best S1 cars. Not all MY Supers are created equal. Generally S1 (65-67)>S2 (68-71)>S3 (72-74)>S4 (74-77) and 1300's generally 70% +/- of 1600's. I have no idea where Hagerty gets their pricing from, members declared values??
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post #1506 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 07:35 PM
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From prior experience pricing out S2 Spiders, Hagerty and NADA prices were always ahead of the market.

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PAST RIDES(abbreviated list): 1969 Spider 1750, 1969 Berlina x2, 1974 Spider x2, 1979 Spider, 1982 Spider x2, 2001 Jaguar XJR, 2011 BMW 328i, 2002 BMW R1150R, 2004 BMW Rockster Edition80 169/2003, 1968 Firebird Convertible, 1968 BMW 1600
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post #1507 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 08:37 PM
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That's a good question - I wasn't sure how Hagerty gets their data either but just went to their website and here is their explanation: https://www.hagerty.com/valuationtools/about-our-prices

Basically they say it is a combination of auction sales, dealer sales that they get the data on, private sales that are reported to them (presumably at the time of purchasing insurance), and insured values. They do take the model year into consideration, and for some cars significant options like an engine upgrade, convertible top, etc.

I am insured by them for both of my classic cars. I initially insured each of the cars for the corresponding purchase price. One car was already restored so I haven't changed the insured amount; but the other one I put about $10K of work into it and therefore later raised the insured amount (and they in turn raised my premium) because I think the car is worth more now than when I purchased it.
Bill

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1965 Fiat 1500 Cabriolet
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post #1508 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 08:45 PM
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We should keep in mind that Supers and TI's are hardly the kinds of "rare" cars that benefit from value guides. The reason is that with over 500k produced, most in Europe, there is still a substantial amount of cars for sale. The best value guide is the one you do for yourself by checking out European car sales sites like Anamera, Austoscout24, Mobile.de, or Marktplatz. Those sites have real cars with conditions ranging from rust-buckets to absolute first quality examples with real prices attached. In a global marketplace, the best prices are those attached to cars which are competing with other, similar cars. And that's Y'urp.

Jim . . . '72 Super 1300, '70, 1750GTV, 2nd series,
'62, Lancia Flaminia Zagato3c, 2nd series

Last edited by 180OUT; 10-03-2018 at 08:49 PM.
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post #1509 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-03-2018, 11:55 PM
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Yes - I looked on the internet for about 6 months before finding and purchasing my Giulia Super in the US. There is definitely a bigger online supply overseas, and I am sure I paid more here in the US as a result. But I eventually justified it by the fact that I was able to personally inspect my car prior to purchase, and I didn't have to pay to ship it across the ocean either. In the Hagerty link above they say they collect data from around the world but it seems logical that the majority of their data is from the US, and I wonder if US prices tend to be higher than those in Europe for similar reasons that I ran across.
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post #1510 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-04-2018, 09:18 AM Thread Starter
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And Jim, there is enough sales there to actually make a "market" there. Awhile back in this thread I posted data from a day's research on many of the NW Europe sites and there were over 50 Giulias for sale., Most 1300's and Nuovas. Few 1600's, very few S1's. A few heavily modded. I even did price statistical analysis and it revealed nothing like $36k for a good S2 but their prices have risen since I started looking in 2010. In 2010 a good S3 in #4 would go for Euro 8-12k )1300 vs 1600). My superb 2L Pino car was Euro 8200. That would be Euro 20k today. The value of my S1 has doubled also.
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post #1511 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 06:26 AM
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Project Super in Contra Costa County. From the listing looks fair for the money these days. If someone contacts, please get the VIN, I'll see if I know the car.
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto...724229082.html

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post #1512 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
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Project Super in Contra Costa County. From the listing looks fair for the money these days. If someone contacts, please get the VIN, I'll see if I know the car.
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto...724229082.html

Andrew
This "find" is one of the advantages of living in California, it seems to me. I would think the price is in the ballpark for the sort of project the ABB likes. Go get 'em!

Jonathan-
'73 GT Junior1600-gone now.
'69 Giulia 1300ti 2 liter-the honeymoon is ON.
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post #1513 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 08:33 AM
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I'm a True Believer in the Austrian school of economics which suggests that there is no such thing as intrinsic value. Instead, the Austrians suggest that value is subjective and always subject to negotiation. Simply put Supers become "worth" X when we decide they are worth X. If the pristine Super down the street is selling for $50k and you find an almost identically pristine car in Italy for $30k, you're being asked to pay more for the convenience of buying locally. The fun part is deciding whether the $20k difference is "worth" it.

Jim . . . '72 Super 1300, '70, 1750GTV, 2nd series,
'62, Lancia Flaminia Zagato3c, 2nd series

Last edited by 180OUT; 10-16-2018 at 08:35 AM.
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post #1514 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 09:23 AM
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I'm a True Believer in the Austrian school of economics which suggests that there is no such thing as intrinsic value. Instead, the Austrians suggest that value is subjective and always subject to negotiation. Simply put Supers become "worth" X when we decide they are worth X. If the pristine Super down the street is selling for $50k and you find an almost identically pristine car in Italy for $30k, you're being asked to pay more for the convenience of buying locally. The fun part is deciding whether the $20k difference is "worth" it.
Jim, permit me two follow up observations: Note I didn't pass judgement on the seller's math; I too question whether one could pay the asking price and then pay a shop to restore the car and still have it cost what a car "ready to go" could be bought for. But, the issue is, it seems to me, that the supply of project Supers is in short supply and this one is still in a guy's driveway, quite possibly an original US import model in the state where it was first sold. Not so easy to find, especially if you live in a place where people didn't know what an Alfa was in 1967.
Run all of this through the "Austrian school" and you still have to say that it's hard to find any Giulia worth messing with for under 10k, anymore.

Jonathan-
'73 GT Junior1600-gone now.
'69 Giulia 1300ti 2 liter-the honeymoon is ON.
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post #1515 of 1728 (permalink) Old 10-16-2018, 09:48 AM
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One would have to see in person, but the shell at least looks solid, though he does mention bubbling in the paint, which I guess means it's not recent paint.
Time was I'd have been all over this, but my big project days are kinda behind me. At least that's my feeling just now.
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