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monte carlo 02-18-2019 04:09 AM

Fiat 1500D
 
5 Attachment(s)
Who built the body?

monte carlo 02-18-2019 04:12 AM

3 Attachment(s)

shakingthrough 02-18-2019 07:44 AM

Wow that is gorgeous.
Bill

PG1964 02-24-2019 01:36 PM

It's a late 1949 Pininfarina body.

iicarJohn 03-09-2019 12:13 AM

Just a tease?
 
When folks really wish to learn more about a specific car, it will be helpful if a specific identity is shared with information supplied by the car itself, along with any history that accompanies it.

This car should have a chassis number, an engine number (from Fiat) and a body number from Pinin Farina. There can be other physical characteristics that will also convey important information. There may also be papers that describe some portion of the ownership history. There are times when this sort of information can be difficult to identify, but generally, someone who really wishes to learn more … will actually make an attempt to inform us of what they know rather than try to tease us into speculating needlessly. When something meaningful is shared, then I will make an attempt to respond meaningfully. Until then … there are others who are actually sharing meaningful details every day and getting some response in a relatively short time period about cars that are equally interesting.

It really should not be made artificially difficult to attempt any of us to help to learn more or share something about any car? Each car is an individual. Generalities will often be misleading when trying to describe an individual.

Or, maybe the car is already described and this is merely a teasing promo? In that case, good luck to the seller! I have already lost some interest. I am also easily inspired when one shares more than a tease.

spiderserie4 03-09-2019 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iicarJohn (Post 8385598)
This car should have a chassis number, an engine number (from Fiat) and a body number from Pinin Farina. There can be other physical characteristics that will also convey important information. There may also be papers that describe some portion of the ownership history.

absolutely.

however, to be fair to the OP, the link he provides in post #2 gives some useful info:

FIAT 1500D
n. Telaio: 044751
n. Motore 045969
Anno 1950
Sul libro di Alessandro Sannia "1500 e 2800 fuoriserie" a pag.32 viene descritta "cabrio speciale su 1500 e realizzata nel 1949"
E' stata di proprietà di carlo Croccolo
Manca da costruire la cappotta
Meccanicamente a posto
Versione speciale con 3 carburatori-collettore
ABARTH

iicarJohn 03-10-2019 10:50 AM

links
 
Thank you "spiderserie4". I did not see the link in my browser the other day. Even so, I do think that a chassis number (at a minimum) could have been shared quite easily in the body of the message?

Chassis 1500D*044751* had its origins during 1949 and it could well be that it was not completed and sold as a completed car until 1950. I can predict that the Pinin Farina body number assigned early in the build process at Pinin Farina probably has five digits beginning "10xxx"? It may be that the last three digits will be found on a number of parts throughout the body? It is important to find the same number on a few parts as we know of some bodies that had numbered parts mixed during the build process as cars were completed.

There can be curious anomalies during the build process of any such car. If the chassis number was not issued out of order and if the body's build was not begun "late", I can expect that the body number will be found to be higher than "10200" and probably lower than "10600".

The license plate number is blacked out in the photos so I cannot report if the plate might be the original plate number issued to the car. A study of that plate number should report the official (bureaucratic) ownership history and perhaps quite a lot more?

There are three cabriolet Pinin Farina cars described inadequately in my study files (for all 1500 cars beginning from the pre-war beginnings of the series) and this car is the latest example reported thus far. It is the only 1500D Pinin Farina reported thus far but I do not expect it was the sole example built. There are quite a number of examples from Stabilimenti Farina and other coachbuilders that might be considered "almost similar" to some viewers.

I do not see much point in studying Carlo Croccolo (an actor whom I have seen in some film or another) in depth at this point (from the standpoint of the car's history) as we've not been informed as to the "when" of his ownership.

There is probably a build number on the Abarth manifold? Each carburetor is probably numbered individually? With enough study, we may be able to date the origins of those parts so as to predict (if only approximately) the "when" of the installation … if this is not known. There may be special ratios in the gearbox and/or the rear end? There may be a special fuel tank and/or radiator? There may be a date cast on the engine block? That date would perhaps have served more as a batch number than as a precise point in time from the foundry workers.

I have some level of descriptive information recorded for approximately 180 Fiat 1500 cars listed by chassis number at this point. Some history and descriptive information is recorded about certain cars not yet identified by chassis number. This is representative of how little we know. The "approximately 180" number is merely a starting point for future studies. Fuoriserie examples are described in higher percentages than normal Fiat production examples and this is misleading simply because of the source materials I have come across. As an example, a good number of Fiat 1500 chassis numbers come from remaining records from the coachbuilder, Boneschi, many of which are probably no longer existing today.

There are at least 25 Fiat 1500 examples (many are fuoriserie) that could be described individually with the payment of some fees in Italy … and at the expense of some shoe-leather and time doing the research. One day …!

There are 20+ pages of listings of Fiat 1500 cars declared taken by German troops during WWII that will add perhaps 700 chassis numbers (and additional detail) to the listing. These will be largely prewar examples and most will not be existing today. But there is at least one example of one such Lancia existing (in the former Yugoslavia) with the papers of another, each of which were appropriated and were declared taken during the war.

Keep in mind also that the survival rate for special examples almost always exceeds the survival rate for cars that were considered "normal" when built.

Are there any other Fiat 1500 cars out there (fuoriserie or not) that would like to be added to the study of these cars?

monte carlo 03-11-2019 05:06 AM

I tried to contact the owner (seller?), But he does not answer. :-(

iicarJohn 03-11-2019 01:55 PM

Fiat 1500E cabriolet by Pinin Farina
 
1 Attachment(s)
Here is an image edited from a 1949 Pinin Farina advertisement showing a slight variation of the PF body on what is described as a 1500E chassis.


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