Flaminia Coup -the Bugatti-Wagen- - Page 15 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #211 of 463 (permalink) Old 01-08-2017, 08:11 PM
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Wow that car and the transaxle are gorgeous. It must seem pretty sad really when ones gets pleasure from just looking at mechanical components such as a gearbox but it gives me as much pleasure as driving the car. The Flavia from that angle looks so subtle in style and I love the colour combination. I have to admit of the Flavia variations it would be my least favourite but yours with those colours has style. Still think the Pininfarina Coupe though is best (I`m biased).
People forget the difficult parts and the emotional highs and lows of a restoration - I`m glad you recorded yours. As I, and others have said before, you are a source of inspiration to us all.

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'65 Giulia Ti, '69 GT Junior, 72 Spider, '74 2000 GTV, ,`00 156
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post #212 of 463 (permalink) Old 01-13-2017, 09:42 AM Thread Starter
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Todays achievements and although the winter has arrived, no thermometers dropping below zero in the shop any more. Have to admit that I do not miss that.

No cleaning or finishing of the weld yet, but things fit together well, not much distorsion (?) in the panels.

Hubert
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Flaminia GT 3C, Flaminia Convertibile 3C, Flavia Convertibile 1.8, A112 Abarth, Flaminia Coupé 2.5, Fulvia Sport 1.3S, Unimog U900

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post #213 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-05-2017, 01:33 PM
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Hubert,

What a great and inspiring project!
Since a couple of months I own a Flaminia coupe 3b myself and right now i'm busy working on the car to get it on the road this summer.
Your topic is a great source of information for me!

The inner front fenders of my car have a very rough, hammered, surface. I thought this could be an old repair after a minor collision. The subframe however looks straight.
In your pictures i see the exact same rough surface.
Do you have an explanation for this? It does not suit the high quality standards of Lancia at that time in my opinion.
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post #214 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-06-2017, 03:23 AM Thread Starter
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My explanation is, that they were using Flaminia Berlina panels and the air intakes as well, which did not fit in combination with the lower PF fender. So they played it simple "lowering" the inner fenders by a few beats with a big hammer. As far as I can see, that was done on all PF coupés.

Hubert


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post #215 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-06-2017, 09:40 AM
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This is a good example of the not so discrete "ironmongery" workshop practices of period Italian coachwork. Underneath the elegant body designs one could often find some very rough-and-ready fabrication techniques. The difference between Italian methods and German or British methods could often be striking. Under the svelte lines and lush paint, the bodies of famous Italian cars were usually quite rough. I remember finding this grotty, porous filler on a 1900 Alfa. It had the consistency of cement and was surprisingly thick. I was shocked, shocked . . .

Jim . . . '72 Super 1300, '70, 1750GTV, 2nd series,
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post #216 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-06-2017, 11:17 PM
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That makes sense!
So i should be pleased i have the original 'factory-molested' inner fenders on my car!
Shocking indeed.
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post #217 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-09-2017, 09:01 AM Thread Starter
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Tempus fugit

Right inner fender in place, fender quite nicely aligned to the rest. Had a look at the passenger door at this occasion. The frame will need partial replacement, no prob. But there is a substantial loss of material from the inside at the door handle area, where the door blade is round. Deep dents of corrosion and sandblasting. (Forgot to take pics of that, next time)

Hubert
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post #218 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 09:33 AM Thread Starter
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Snippets

Sourced a rubber band for the English Wheel, this gives you much more bend and much less stretch when running a panel through it.

Took a picture of the rough surface of the door blade.

Found some examples for welding carried out at PF, with deep love to the work
(Have found some pics of ugly mods on the Touring bodies as well)

Started on the production of a handfull of "box nuts". Square nuts are available but the boxes are not, aren´t they?

The bead roller is showing more and more of its capabilities, mainly on youtube not in my shop, i admit. Mine is the most simple version of all (I bought it 25 years ago and still remember the disappointment when making the first beads with it. This resulting in not using it for two decades). Besides lack of practice, which I am now overcoming, the manual crank was identified as a limiting factor.

As this body restoration is slowly heading to its end, buying a state of the art 5k USD item is not the way to go, but equipping the old mule with an electric drive sounds good to me. And I am not going to use an old garage door drive, nor mums worn out Kitchen Aid. Will report about it.

Hubert
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post #219 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-10-2017, 10:28 AM
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Hubert,

You need to look for 'cage nuts'. There are various styles, although you seem to be 50% of the way to creating your own!

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to all parts I have advertised on the BB so far. Plenty more! Just ask.
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post #220 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-16-2017, 11:25 AM Thread Starter
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Alex,

thanks for your hint. I have been looking for the German equivalent (Käfigmutter= cage nut, Kastenmutter) and have found a couple of standards, but none of them was similar to the original ones. Even more, the nowadays square nuts (also according to DIN standards) are different to the old ones. Long story short, I made some square nuts of the correct size and bent the cages from the panels i had prepared. they are not good enough for the next Mars mission, but will serve the purpose.

Fixed the missing takeup of the tank and made two takeups for the rear bumper and welded them in.

A reference Flaminia has arrived in the shop, too.

Equipment: sourced some devices to do surface upgrades (grinding) and ordered a state of the art bead roller in the USA (changed my mind). The lead time for this is about four to five weeks, I am so impatient!!!!! Perhaps the drive originally dedicated to the old bead roller will find a new application.

Hubert
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post #221 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-16-2017, 11:28 AM Thread Starter
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The tank will be another project, it appears to be completely filled with some kind of solids.

Hubert
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post #222 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-16-2017, 11:56 AM
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The value of having a reference vehicle at hand cannot be overstated, and this looks to be a very nice one indeed.

Many thanks for continuing this thread, Hubert. The shop looks wonderful.

Don
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post #223 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-23-2017, 10:02 AM Thread Starter
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Paid some attention to the driver side door today, coming to some conclusions. First of all it was a mistake to remove the most rotten part of the skin before sending the car to the blast shop years ago. It became obvious upon return of the body that the "free" edge of the skin was hit by the sand blast without having support by the surrounding panel, leading to stretching. Second, the cut off panel got lost, third the lower part of the door frame is deformed as well.

Fourth, the reference car has been restored too, and although the restorer has done a good job regarding durability, he missed some of the important details Pininfarina has put in. I have checked with the profile gauge, the lower edge of the reference car door seems to be straight instead of a very slight curve one should expect due to the overall crown of the side.

Installed some "form follows function" reinforcement to the frame and made the lower part of it. It fits well but something seems to be odd about it. There are two more doors in the barn (from the scraped blue coupé), also in bad shape, but I will check their shape as well.

And by the way, how would one call this door construction? complex? ambitious? well engineered? or simply a mess?


Hubert
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post #224 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-24-2017, 12:28 PM
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Over engineered for the sake of complexity . I feel that you could say that a lot about Lancias ... a bunch of engineers getting their rocks off instead of designing what is really required.

But the word "door" is easy to say but there is a lot going on inside a car door and the fit has to be accurate as seals are involved, etc. Hopefully you do not have to deal with the hopeless seal design that 105 Alfas use ...
Pete

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156 Series 1 v6 ... and remember it's all just opinions
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post #225 of 463 (permalink) Old 02-24-2017, 12:58 PM Thread Starter
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Pete,

you are absolutely right and basically the PF door does very well when adjusted correctly. When I bought the car the doors felt like "German tank" design. Although the condition of the car was as you could see from this resto diary, the doors fitted so well, closed against the old seals perfectly and sounded like closing a vault. Nevertheless this standard is reached by patching a dozen of hand cut rough panels one over the other. Part of the secret is the use of tons of "plasticine". Anyhow, it will be a challenge to get back to that level of haptics.

Hubert

PS found the same number as on the trunk floor on the door, very important


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