Th Future of Our Cars and Hobby/Passion - Page 8 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #106 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-21-2018, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSk View Post
I know I have said this before, but you guys and the fools that are pushing these autonomous cars are missing the point.

The greatest things about human beings is their ability to enjoy a sense of achievement. What autonomous cars, artificial intelligence and robots are doing is making the number of humans still able to achieve anything smaller. What it is doing is making it possible for only skilled and intelligent people to enjoy the benefit of achievement.

End result will be that heck maybe the number of road deaths will drop if we ever perfect autonomous cars (I don't believe this will happen though) but the number of deaths due to suicide will go up considerably meaning on balance more people will die per year. Brilliant not.

The unintelligent people of the world, and there are plenty of them out there and in my family, need to be able to work and feel they are contributing to their countries economy, otherwise why even bother living at all. We know how receiving the dole and doing close to nothing all day long does to people ... this is where we are heading, thanks to these fools.
Pete
Not exactly what you are referencing but I do suspect that some of this may already be evident in some of the recent tragedies.
Lots of things are blamed, violent video games and movies, ISIS propaganda, years of drugs administered by schools to "Calm Johnny down", bullying, etc.
But a sense of being adrift in an uncaring and pointless world is probably just as valid.
So I agree taking away even more of the simple victories we (Used to?) enjoy, particularly from the young, is unlikely to turn out well.
The present reminds of a book I read years ago, I think it was titled "Stand on Zanzibar".
Too much similarity to recent events.
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post #107 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-21-2018, 05:38 AM
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Thatís an interesting point that Pete makes. Commuting to work on public transport day after day can be a mind numbing experience and so could sitting in one of those cars once the novelty wears off. I fail to see why people get so excited about them. I would find sitting in one incredibly boring. Some say that they would be able to read the paper or watch a video as if that is exciting. Wow, I canít wait for that! My wife has a 30 km commute to school each day and she says driving her 159 Sportwagon is enjoyable and gives her something to do. My daughter pointed out that if people think it means they can get drunk and wonít have to worry because the car can take them home, they would still get booked because presumably a human has to be able to take over if needed. There will be all sorts of other legal implications as well. On top of all that people will need to be convinced they are safe in the things and so far that isnít going brilliantly after that Uber car killed a pedestrian the other day.
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Current Alfas
2010 159 ti 1750 TBI sedan (red).
2004 GT 3.2 V6 (Stromboli Grey).
2008 159 TI Sportwagon 2.4 JTDM (Stromboli Grey).
1987 75 3 litre (red). My first 75 and now my son's.
2000 156 2 litre Twin Spark, ( Cosmos Blu metallic), my daughter's car.
2000 156 Monza Twin Spark, (Cosmos Blue metallic), sonís girlfiendís car.
1999 GTV 3 litre 24 valve V6, metallic black, (sonís new car).

Non Alfa
1988 Range Rover Classic Highline 3.9 V8

Past Alfas
1989 75 3 litre, written off by runaway van.
1990 75 3 litre Potenziata (black), now sold & living in Newcastle NSW.
1990 75 3 litre Potenziata (grey, sadly deceased due to fire).
1982 GTV 2 litre, red, (daughter's first Alfa)
2 x 1992 164s, (1 red, 1 grey).
2 x 1988 33s, (both red).
1985 GTV 2 litre, (white).
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post #108 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-21-2018, 06:56 AM
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I am amused when people say that you will be able to do other things like read a book or watch a movie. I know there are some people that are able to do this and they make great rally co-drivers. But for me and I know I am not alone, I get sea sick if I try to read in the car, and as far as movies I just did a 16 hour flight to Australia and let me just say that movies get old really fast. Basically I am going to be bored out of my mind in these autonomous cars, oh well they had better ban firearms and blunt instruments from them.

Kevin :-)
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KL Harper
Mebane, NC yes another one from Mebane and it is not that big of a town.
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post #109 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-21-2018, 10:29 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oz3litre View Post
That’s an interesting point that Pete makes. Commuting to work on public transport day after day can be a mind numbing experience and so could sitting in one of those cars once the novelty wears off. I fail to see why people get so excited about them. I would find sitting in one incredibly boring. Some say that they would be able to read the paper or watch a video as if that is exciting. Wow, I can’t wait for that! My wife has a 30 km commute to school each day and she says driving her 159 Sportwagon is enjoyable and gives her something to do. My daughter pointed out that if people think it means they can get drunk and won’t have to worry because the car can take them home, they would still get booked because presumably a human has to be able to take over if needed. There will be all sorts of other legal implications as well. On top of all that people will need to be convinced they are safe in the things and so far that isn’t going brilliantly after that Uber car killed a pedestrian the other day.
There's a big difference in joy between driving 45 minutes in thick bumper-to-bumper commuter traffic in to downtown Houston, versus a fun drive on country roads in the TX Hill Country or any "road trip". But knowing the latter was possible made taking a nice cool comfortable park-n-ride bus ride to a local lot much more tolerable. Now I live in that Hill Country and every drive is a joy, except in/through "town". I could see taking a safe self-driven ride in almost any big city with traffic, one way streets, kamikaze locals traffic, et al, and much more accurate in delivery point than some light rail. I view transportation as being fit-for-purpose. Drive when it makes sense, take a train, light rail, metro, bus, Uber/taxi or self-driven pod (when available) when it makes sense to me.

Last edited by Anfanuts; 03-21-2018 at 10:34 AM.
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post #110 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-21-2018, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Anfanuts View Post
There's a big difference in joy between driving 45 minutes in thick bumper-to-bumper commuter traffic in to downtown Houston, versus a fun drive on country roads in the TX Hill Country or any "road trip". But knowing the latter was possible made taking a nice cool comfortable park-n-ride bus ride to a local lot much more tolerable. Now I live in that Hill Country and every drive is a joy, except in/through "town". I could see taking a safe self-driven ride in almost any big city with traffic, one way streets, kamikaze locals traffic, et al, and much more accurate in delivery point than some light rail. I view transportation as being fit-for-purpose. Drive when it makes sense, take a train, light rail, metro, bus, Uber/taxi or self-driven pod (when available) when it makes sense to me.
Fortunately we donít have serious traffic jams in Adelaide like some other cities, so the need is not as great. As long as Iím not prevented from driving my old school cars, those who want self drive cars will be welcome to them. I think it will be a longer time before they are common than the pundits would have us believe.

Current Alfas
2010 159 ti 1750 TBI sedan (red).
2004 GT 3.2 V6 (Stromboli Grey).
2008 159 TI Sportwagon 2.4 JTDM (Stromboli Grey).
1987 75 3 litre (red). My first 75 and now my son's.
2000 156 2 litre Twin Spark, ( Cosmos Blu metallic), my daughter's car.
2000 156 Monza Twin Spark, (Cosmos Blue metallic), sonís girlfiendís car.
1999 GTV 3 litre 24 valve V6, metallic black, (sonís new car).

Non Alfa
1988 Range Rover Classic Highline 3.9 V8

Past Alfas
1989 75 3 litre, written off by runaway van.
1990 75 3 litre Potenziata (black), now sold & living in Newcastle NSW.
1990 75 3 litre Potenziata (grey, sadly deceased due to fire).
1982 GTV 2 litre, red, (daughter's first Alfa)
2 x 1992 164s, (1 red, 1 grey).
2 x 1988 33s, (both red).
1985 GTV 2 litre, (white).
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post #111 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-21-2018, 07:52 PM
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I think these things are like 3D TV - an expensive curiosity that will never catch on with the mass market. The 'computerists' have been promising the moon ever since we were using punch cards, and most of it has been a mixed bag, at best. We get the internet, along with identity theft. We get 57 channels, with nothin' on. We get GPS, but no one can read a map. Meanwhile, per capita real knowledge is diminished, because of easy retrieval of information. Information - whether critically important, or superficial - is tossed together in an indecipherable electronic swill, with fewer and fewer people possessing the thinking skills needed to sort and make use of the raw information...

If these 'cars' become mainstream, we surrender SO MUCH MORE than we gain. Will individuals even still be the legal owners of cars on the road? Or, will these appliances be leased on some kind of 'subscription' model, going the way of computer software? Will we pay a fee, and then check the requisite 'agree to terms' check-box, in order to have one in the driveway? This is a sure-fire way to kill the spirit of adventure, exploration, and discovery - the very allure of the open road...
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post #112 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-21-2018, 09:19 PM
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Also, what are the chances of hackers shutting the things down and holding them for ransom? I agree with your 3D TV analogy. I always thought it would never really catch on. I love a lot of modern technology such as smartphones, the internet etc, but as you say, not every new thing is going to be a success. History is littered with inventions that failed to sell.

Current Alfas
2010 159 ti 1750 TBI sedan (red).
2004 GT 3.2 V6 (Stromboli Grey).
2008 159 TI Sportwagon 2.4 JTDM (Stromboli Grey).
1987 75 3 litre (red). My first 75 and now my son's.
2000 156 2 litre Twin Spark, ( Cosmos Blu metallic), my daughter's car.
2000 156 Monza Twin Spark, (Cosmos Blue metallic), sonís girlfiendís car.
1999 GTV 3 litre 24 valve V6, metallic black, (sonís new car).

Non Alfa
1988 Range Rover Classic Highline 3.9 V8

Past Alfas
1989 75 3 litre, written off by runaway van.
1990 75 3 litre Potenziata (black), now sold & living in Newcastle NSW.
1990 75 3 litre Potenziata (grey, sadly deceased due to fire).
1982 GTV 2 litre, red, (daughter's first Alfa)
2 x 1992 164s, (1 red, 1 grey).
2 x 1988 33s, (both red).
1985 GTV 2 litre, (white).
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post #113 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-21-2018, 10:22 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oz3litre View Post
Fortunately we don’t have serious traffic jams in Adelaide like some other cities, so the need is not as great. As long as I’m not prevented from driving my old school cars, those who want self drive cars will be welcome to them. I think it will be a longer time before they are common than the pundits would have us believe.
I feel the same way driving though any big city like Los Angeles, Florence, Rome, Paris, Barcelona, Milan, Madrid, etc. It's really not fun, traffic jams or not. Indeed I don't mind having many transportation alternatives depending on the environment.

Last edited by Anfanuts; 03-21-2018 at 10:30 PM.
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post #114 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-22-2018, 10:02 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by iachella View Post
1. A car shall not harm another car, nor through inaction, allow another car to come to harm.

2. A car must obey orders given it by its driver, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.

3. A car shall protect itself, as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.
From this, I gather pedestrians (or animals crossing the road) are pretty much screwed. The recent Uber hit and run plowed right through the pedestrian like they did't even exist. Imagine if it were a deer, moose or cow.

Last edited by Anfanuts; 03-23-2018 at 09:54 AM.
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post #115 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-22-2018, 10:11 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Aggie57 View Post
And on the same day how many human controlled cars were involved in fatal accidents? The cars and computers are not the weak point, the nuts behind the wheel are.
Most accident or death statistics are normalized to miles driven (manhours, etc). I suspect this would make self-driven car accidents and deaths pretty high if not astronomical right now since miles driven are so low. Unless that stat improves drastically you can imagine the carnage to come. Robots meet Mad Max = Carmegeddon. Can't wait for semi-rigs to do this!! Color me quite skeptical right now.
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post #116 of 142 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 05:04 PM Thread Starter
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From a FB post today; you think they are not coming for your car?

"In The Sun today, motorist groups rail against Sadiq Khan’s rushed Ultra Low Emission Zone saying it will hit the poor the hardest

1️ Fair Fuel UK Campaign: ”Families least able to afford a new car will be hardest hit.”

https://www.facebook.com/FairFuelUK/


2️⃣The Alliance of British Drivers: ”ULEZ is a giant con to raise more taxes to fix the Mayor’s budget problem."

https://www.facebook.com/allianceofbritishdrivers/
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post #117 of 142 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 05:29 PM
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Road an E-bike yesterday. That is the future. Fantastic devices.

A far better option for us, and the Earth, for this direction than autonomous cars which will INCREASE the number of cars wasting real-estate and blocking roads.
Pete

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post #118 of 142 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 07:40 PM
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Last year here in California between a new TA and Cat. it cost me a total of $700.00 to get get my my 1976 Alfetta GT to pass smog. This left wing state wants nothing but solar and wind power to generate electricity. I have a big wind farm in my pants that might help......this state is f*****d
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post #119 of 142 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 09:39 PM
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Just imagine if we could power something with farts! Energy problems solved.
Pete

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post #120 of 142 (permalink) Old 03-24-2019, 03:11 PM Thread Starter
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We are so "quaint". Owning a Car Will Soon Be as Quaint as Owning a Horse

Sometimes I think that these articles are written by hipsters who live in cities . . . .

Oh, they are.

Rural folks, ranchers/farmers, boaters, RV'ers, trailers, campers, roadtrippers: take note: grab an Uber. Or move to a city.
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