TZ1 replica - searching for history - Page 4 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #46 of 69 (permalink) Old 02-18-2011, 01:27 AM Thread Starter
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Smile Thank you Vin

Thanks Vin for the comments and update to the thread. I will never portray the car as a "real" car. It gives me great pleasure to see the shape though! I bought the car as a "replica" and it will stay portrayed that way. Can you do me a favour and talk to Hugh about sorting the brakes and any other issues you identified that may make the car unsafe.

The chassis number being found etc was great fun, but, importantly there is no documented history. A collector should only pay the big $ for a proven, documented history car.

Integrity is important to me. PLease slap me around the head if I get ahead of myself!

Best Regards
Phil
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post #47 of 69 (permalink) Old 02-18-2011, 02:15 AM
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Thanks Vin for the comments and update to the thread. I will never portray the car as a "real" car. It gives me great pleasure to see the shape though! I bought the car as a "replica" and it will stay portrayed that way. Can you do me a favour and talk to Hugh about sorting the brakes and any other issues you identified that may make the car unsafe.

The chassis number being found etc was great fun, but, importantly there is no documented history. A collector should only pay the big $ for a proven, documented history car.

Integrity is important to me. PLease slap me around the head if I get ahead of myself!

Best Regards
Phil

You certainly weren't getting ahead of yourself Phil, though reading through it in one go, a couple of other posts were getting just a teeny bit over-excited.......obviously didn't take too much time in studying your photos I guess. (I think JG105 got a bit carried away too!, see separate reply)

I reckon a bit of TLC and re-engineering a few of its creators shortcomings, and you have a wonderful little toy!
PS:Have you replaced those tacky door handles yet? If not Classic A of A/holics have good replicas (same as GTA).
Cheers,
Vin.
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post #48 of 69 (permalink) Old 02-18-2011, 04:15 AM
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John,
I believe you have hit the nail on the head. We should admire the art form not specifically the source and run with what we have got.
On another point...
Phil is trying to log book the care here in Australia with very little progress with CAMS (confederation against motor sport - my own conflagration). I believe he wants to run it in various competition events, which proves he is serious to me, however, the "gentlemen" at CAMS in their blindness have flatly refused to log book it!!!!!!
I must add here that I am biased, as I have had a similar situation recently with the blinkered bills there in relation to log booking my Ti Super REPLICA, They just don't get it as they (as a whole) and in particular some who wish to pontificate, procrastinate and hinder those who love our cars and just want to get out there and run our pride and joy. CAMS are there, specifically, to ensure those that wish to run their cars can run them in a safe & fun environment, not to wander around and give every one the SHI!!
SORRY Off Topic I Know.
However if there is enough ground swell to put pressure on the mighty Conspiracy, sorry confederation, the we might see some of these wonderful cars performing as they were built to do and run competitively.
I have finished my ranting and will persue this else where on the BB, but please help Phil fulfill his dream.
Jim Gordon
Hi Jim,
As much as we all like to rubbish CAMS, ther are Historic classes to cater for replicas and others to cater for genuine old race cars with or without actual racing history. In all cases it is a requirement that the basic car is of and from the actual marque manufacturer. You have replicated a TI Super using a Super as a basis, in a class that allows race-replicas, OK. You did not try to start with Datsun and try to make an Alfa from it!
In classes that represent original racing/sports cars, you cannot just create a LotusXYZ from a pile of tube and Cortina running gear and expect it to be "authenticated" by the issuing of a CAMS/FIA Historic log book. These are rules that prevent Historic racing being flooded with (for instance) replica Cobras and Ferrari GTO-esq Datsun Zs.
There is some flexabilty in regulations that allow say a car built up of original spare parts, or an original chassis damaged and repaired with original running gear. There are also some allowances for exact spec. 'factory continuations or recreations'. But things that are plainly replicas and really share only a passing approximation of the real thing in most technical areas just don't qualify nor deserve a log book under the rules as plainly stated. This is as much in respect to the people and original cars that do actually compete. that they do not miss out perhaps on an entry gone to a mock-up car.
There are also plenty of avenues to use and compete with replica cars, without having to attempt to get one through the process and perhaps get bitter and disappointed about the outcome.
If the basic rules are read first, it is quite self evident that with a replica, it is really a bit, umm....ambitious.
Cheers,
Vin
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post #49 of 69 (permalink) Old 02-22-2011, 04:37 PM
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Vin,
THANK YOU.
Jim
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post #50 of 69 (permalink) Old 02-25-2011, 04:30 AM
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Vin,
THANK YOU.
Jim
No worries Jim. Sometimes it seems a bit difficult to grasp some of the historic classes when built up cars are run across so many catagories, but not others. Group N and S are examples of where the class was expanded to accept built up cars to cater partly for the demand for participating at these types of events versus the relatively low numbers of original race cars available. Which all works pretty well and gives the opportunity to participate to a much broader competitor base. There is nothing wrong with build ups or replicas running in the class structures provided. I have both GpN and a GpS projects myself, and a spare Montreal engine and other parts for perhaps a T-33 replica project one day.......
The one down side of say GpN, is that because the racing between the built up cars is so rough, the class is virtually devoid of any original period cars, most originals choosing to run by arrangement with GpA and C class instead, where the value of these genuine cars discourages much damaging contact.
Cheers,
Vin
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post #51 of 69 (permalink) Old 07-13-2015, 01:38 AM Thread Starter
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This car was built by Greppi

I have an update on this car....

A friend of mine visited Greppi at his factory last week and he has identified my TZ1 replica as the 3rd of 85 he built. Yes, I was astounded, 85! He started building them in 1991. Mine, 75003 was built in 1991.

Sounds like there are quite a few not "real" TZ1 s out there! :-)
A lot more than expected. LOL!

Very interesting.

Last edited by sinkman1; 07-13-2015 at 08:52 PM.
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post #52 of 69 (permalink) Old 07-13-2015, 02:17 AM
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85?? unbelievable, maybe he meant 8.5!

Richard
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post #53 of 69 (permalink) Old 07-13-2015, 07:13 PM
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Red face

How is the quest going to get the car log booked?

Jim

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Originally Posted by sinkman1 View Post
I have an update on this car....

A friend of mine visited Greppi at his factory last week and he has identified my TZ1 replica as the 3rd of 85 he built. Yes, I was astounded, 85! He started building them in 1991. Mine, 75003 was built in 1991.

Sounds like there are few not so real TZ1 s out there! :-)

Very interesting.
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post #54 of 69 (permalink) Old 07-13-2015, 08:53 PM Thread Starter
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85?? unbelievable, maybe he meant 8.5!

Richard
Trust me Richard I doubled checked that stat. Sounds like it must have been a real production line at the Greppi workshop. The first one was done in 1991.
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post #55 of 69 (permalink) Old 07-13-2015, 08:54 PM Thread Starter
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How is the quest going to get the car log booked?

Jim
EASY!
:-)
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post #56 of 69 (permalink) Old 07-14-2015, 04:22 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by sinkman1 View Post
Trust me Richard I doubled checked that stat. Sounds like it must have been a real production line at the Greppi workshop. The first one was done in 1991.
A double check is underway now as per perhaps he meant 85 replica cars of all types, not 85 x TZ1 replicas.
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post #57 of 69 (permalink) Old 07-14-2015, 05:42 AM
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Hi Sinkman1

Now, that I can believe - 85 reps of all types - impossible TZ1/2s; they would be coming out of the woodwork everywhere!

Richard
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post #58 of 69 (permalink) Old 07-14-2015, 07:08 AM
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Indeed, as early as 2001 Greppi was "publicized" for building, beyond TZ and TZ2s, also fake Alfa SZs from Giulietta SS or Spider wrecks, fake GTAs whose aluminium was hammered on a poor GT Junior shell, and also Ferraris and Lancias, and even Porsche 906s. Probably more models have been available over time.
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post #59 of 69 (permalink) Old 08-01-2015, 01:51 AM Thread Starter
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Letter from Greppi

I, the undersigned, Giorgio Greppi, resident of 73 Via Nazionale Sud of Colico near Lecco, being the owner of Carrozeria Greppi do declare that in 1991 I built the replica vehicle Alfa Romeo TZ1 number 750003 for Mr Giorgio Totti of Bologna,
Yours faithfully Giorgio Greppi.

I have a whole host of photos from my friend who visited Greppi's' workshop. Simply AMAZING what he is doing there and the sheer scale of his operations!
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post #60 of 69 (permalink) Old 08-01-2015, 04:49 AM
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Hi SinkmanUno

Congratulations! That is a valuable document to establish the provenance of your `TZ`!

Richard
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